10/22, Savage mark II TR, or CZ 453

[Builder Bob]

I am looking to pick up a cheap practice gun and was wondering about opinions on each. Should I buy the 10/22 and piece it together for better accuracy etc. or stick with a bolt gun and get one ready out of the box. I know the 10/22 can be made into almost anything/purpose you could want with the aftermarket for it out there.

So what are your thoughts, trick out a 10/22 or go for something more ready out of the box??

Thanks for your thoughts!

Builder Bob

[Dolomite_supafly]

If you like to tinker then, without a doubt, get the 10/22. It is like an adults lego set. anything can be replaced by you to build what you want.

If you are not a tinkerer and want something that is ready to go then get either the Savage or the CZ. Either one is going to be a great shooter. But other than stocks there isn't a whole lot out there for them. Maybe a few mounts and maybe a trigger improvement.

Dolomite

[Builder Bob]

Thanks Dolomite, that's what I was wondering about especially the aftermarket parts for each. It seems there is an endless array of options for the 10/22 out there, much like the AR.

[graycrait]

I shouldn't chime in here but my .22 passion overwhelms me. The Savage and the CZ are good guns. Oftentimes out of the box bullseye accuracy of the 10/22 will be second banana to the other two. However, the other two are boring!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I have been down this road, time and again. Get the 10/22 and then talk to forum members on how not to spend stupid money on a 10/22. You can do a good trigger job yourself and then get someone like Dolomite to clean up your barrel chamber. I was actually shooting .22 bullets through the exact same hole today using Lapua Speed Ace bullets in one of my 10/22s with a 15 mph crosswind at 25meters. I was so amped up and then I put CCI Blaser ammo in the mag and expanded that group to the size of a quarter - bummer. Shooting .22s is fun and educational, as well as humbling.

[Builder Bob]

I am looking for a .22 that I can use as a trainer for centerfire rifles without the expense but also for my kids as they will be coming of age for an introduction to shooting. I was leaning toward a bolt gun but the 10/22 with all the options of aftermarket are intresting/appealing.

[TrickyNicky]

Bite the bullet and resign yourself to one of each.

If money's a bit tight check for a savage mkII bolt action to start your kids out on and have some fun yourself. 10/22s seem to be holding their price at about $200-$220 so you can always pick one up when you get everyone comfortable with the rules of firearm safety.

Or you could consider a completely different route and go with a Henry lever action. They seem well made, hold multiple rounds, shoot long/ long rifle/ and shorts, cycle cbs, and you don't have to worry about multiple shots going off accidentally when training the kids. Plus lever guns are fun on a bun.

[dbla]

I don't have a ton of .22LR experience but I did tack on a 10/22 to my recent AR order...taken it to the range a couple times and have been VERY happy with it. There's few things more classic than a blued 10/22 with a Walnut stock. Great shooter too, only had one FTF that was ironically the first round I ever put through it. Primer dimple and everything, just no boom. Ammo's fault. Nice little gun and pretty ingenious when you get it apart.

[Guest twpayne75]

Been going through this dilemma lately. Haven't owned a .22 rifle in about twenty years. But for some reason I have been wanting one badly. This will be for plinking only.

I think I have decided on the Savage Mark II TR.

I know me well enough to know that a 10/22 wouldn't be safe. If there are aftermarket parts for something, I will get them, all of them. The 10/22 would be to tempting. Not much to do with the Savage other than maybe a scope and trigger.

I think that's why I have been happy with my HKs lately..........no aftermarket support.

I can buy a Glock and end up with more in it than an HK in a few days.

[crossfire]

Savage Mark II added the optics and bipod and it's a tack driver.

Or catch the 10/22 bug. May as well just buy the action and start from there.

Edited July 7, 2012 by crossfire

[StPatrick]

If it makes any difference, Techsights is making military style sight sets for CZ rimfires for $69 / set now. You can not go wrong with a CZ bolt action. I have a 452 Lux that needs no changes or tweaking and is waaaaay more accurate than I am with iron sights. That said, a beater 10/22 to tinker with is on my wish list.

[Guest twpayne75]

Savage Mark II added the optics and bipod and it's a tack driver.

Or catch the 10/22 bug. May as well just buy the action and start from there.

Those are both beautiful.

I can't decide. I am going to hit every place I cross tomorrow. I will be in the area of atleast 5 gun shops tomorrow. So far I have competely decided to stay with Ruger, CZ, Marlin, or Savage...................unless something else comes along.

Any more suggestions? I want to stay in the $450 and under range if possible.

[crossfire]

If your ever in the Chattanooga area PM me and you can try them out.

I have heard good things about the CZ, but never shot one.

Edited July 9, 2012 by crossfire

[Jonnin]

If it is for kids, the mostly alum tactial solutions 10-22 is super light (and about twice the cost of a normal one).

I like the 10-22 but if the kids are very young a semi auto may not be a good choice for learning (too much ratatat and not enough focus). It is also not really centerfire practice, unless you are talking an AR centerfire. If your want to practice for a bolt gun, buy a bolt 22.

Also do not neglect a good used rifle or consider other styles --- there are a number of good tube fed autos, lever guns, single shots, and more. Most can be found used at a decent price, not sure what is still in production.

[Hozzie]

I have all of them and will give my opinion, take it as that. I base my information on my following guns;

Complete KIDD Supergrade 10/22 - $$$$

Stock 10/22 Deluxe - $

CZ 453 Varmint 17HMR - $$

CZ 452 Military Trainer - $

CZ 452 FS 22 WMR- $$

CZ 452 Ultra Lux - $$

Savage 93FVSS 17HMR - $

As you mentioned that you want something to mimic a centerfire for cheap training and you want something that the kids can start to learn with, I absolutely recommend the CZ (either 452 or 453). There are merits to the many different models and I will be glad to give my opinion on that as well, but I won't go into that detail here.

So why the CZ?

1. Quality. This will have the best fit and finish and overall level of quality out of the box. This is important to me because I think if you use this gun to train your kids, it can truly be an hierloom quality gun that your kids can keep and pass down. This for me is probably the most important reason to go with the CZ.
   
2. Accuracy. I think the Savage and CZ are capable of being equal in this category out of the box. The 10/22 will be ok, but will need some work to get up to speed with the others. My KIDD SuperGrade costs 4x as much as my CZ Trainer for comparable accuracy - sometimes.
   
3. Open Sites and Peep Sites. For me, I think kids should start to learn with open sites and even learn how to use peep sites. I think they are fun for games and improve marksmenship. For me, the CZ gives me the best options for open sites, peep sites, and eventually a scope, all on the same gun. The other two don't really handle peep sites as well in my opinion.
   
4. Single Shot Adaptors - Again for Kids, I am a proponent of learning one shot at a time to understand mechanics and safety. You can get these for the CZ and Savage.
   
5. Trigger - the Savage Accutrigger is probably the best out of the box, but with a simple modification, I think the CZ trigger can be made better overall. The 10/22 trigger is terrible out of the box. It can also be improved, but not to the level of the CZ unless you get into high end replacements like the Kidd trigger. (Which I would also highly recommend)
   
6. If nothing else, go back to #1.
   

If overall fit and finish isn't as important, you can't go wrong with the Savage. It will shoot straight and have a good trigger (Accutrigger models) out of the box. It will also be a little cheaper than the CZ most of the time. The 10/22 is fun, but I think I would recommend it for a little later after the kids learn how to shoot with a bolt gun.

My 4 1/2 cents.

Good luck with your purchase.

Edited July 9, 2012 by Hozzie

[Oh Shoot]

...I did tack on a 10/22 to my recent AR order......There's few things more classic than a blued 10/22 with a Walnut stock. ...

Did you get the standard carbine model?

If so, just for accuracy, they haven't been actually blued for many years, and the wood is birch.

- OS

Edited July 9, 2012 by OhShoot

[Raoul]

I have all of them and will give my opinion, take it as that. I base my information on my following guns;

Complete KIDD Supergrade 10/22 - $$$$

Stock 10/22 Deluxe - $

CZ 453 Varmint 17HMR - $$

CZ 452 Military Trainer - $

CZ 452 FS 22 WMR- $$

CZ 452 Ultra Lux - $$

Savage 93FVSS 17HMR - $

As you mentioned that you want something to mimic a centerfire for cheap training and you want something that the kids can start to learn with, I absolutely recommend the CZ (either 452 or 453). There are merits to the many different models and I will be glad to give my opinion on that as well, but I won't go into that detail here.

So why the CZ?

1. Quality. This will have the best fit and finish and overall level of quality out of the box. This is important to me because I think if you use this gun to train your kids, it can truly be an hierloom quality gun that your kids can keep and pass down. This for me is probably the most important reason to go with the CZ.
   
2. Accuracy. I think the Savage and CZ are capable of being equal in this category out of the box. The 10/22 will be ok, but will need some work to get up to speed with the others. My KIDD SuperGrade costs 4x as much as my CZ Trainer for comparable accuracy - sometimes.
   
3. Open Sites and Peep Sites. For me, I think kids should start to learn with open sites and even learn how to use peep sites. I think they are fun for games and improve marksmenship. For me, the CZ gives me the best options for open sites, peep sites, and eventually a scope, all on the same gun. The other two don't really handle peep sites as well in my opinion.
   
4. Single Shot Adaptors - Again for Kids, I am a proponent of learning one shot at a time to understand mechanics and safety. You can get these for the CZ and Savage.
   
5. Trigger - the Savage Accutrigger is probably the best out of the box, but with a simple modification, I think the CZ trigger can be made better overall. The 10/22 trigger is terrible out of the box. It can also be improved, but not to the level of the CZ unless you get into high end replacements like the Kidd trigger. (Which I would also highly recommend)
   
6. If nothing else, go back to #1.
   

If overall fit and finish isn't as important, you can't go wrong with the Savage. It will shoot straight and have a good trigger (Accutrigger models) out of the box. It will also be a little cheaper than the CZ most of the time. The 10/22 is fun, but I think I would recommend it for a little later after the kids learn how to shoot with a bolt gun.

My 4 1/2 cents.

Good luck with your purchase.

I'd have to agree with Hozzie. I picked up another CZ last month. 452A. They are outstanding shooters.

[Guest twpayne75]

Didn't have time to hit all the places today. Going to try to hit a couple of them tomorrow.

One place I stopped at had a 10/22T. Laminate stock with spiral fluted barrel for $409. If one were to decide to go with a 10/22, would you be better off buying the 10/22T or just buying the standard model and start changing out parts?

Will post up what I find tomorrow.

[Retired Navy GMC]

A friend of mine has a Savage TRR-SR that I have shot and it is AWESOME!!

Easily gets sub-MOA groups out of it.

I liked it so much, I ordered one for myself.

I have other .22LR's but none are bolt action..... until I get this one.

[Hozzie]

Didn't have time to hit all the places today. Going to try to hit a couple of them tomorrow.

One place I stopped at had a 10/22T. Laminate stock with spiral fluted barrel for $409. If one were to decide to go with a 10/22, would you be better off buying the 10/22T or just buying the standard model and start changing out parts?

Will post up what I find tomorrow.

I would go with a standard. I have seen more of the target models shoot worse than the standard $200 base model. Put the extra money in an aftermarket trigger kit like the volqaurtsen and get an aftermarket barrel for the same amount of money.

Again, just my opinion.

Edited July 9, 2012 by Hozzie

[Builder Bob]

After much looking around, I guess as said above, I will probably end up getting one each to start with (semi-auto & bolt) and go from there. The kids will first work with the bolt and start there. The 10/22 will be my "tinkering gun"!!

Thanks for all the suggestions and thoughts!