MYSTERIOUS MONEY AND MOTIVE BEHIND MONSTER MOSQUE IN MURFREESBORO

[JohnC]

MYSTERIOUS MONEY AND MOTIVE BEHIND MONSTER MOSQUE IN MURFREESBORO:

http://www.globalinf...ge/abdou-kattih

And found the link via here: http://frontpagemag....mp_FrontPageMag

Disclaimer: I'm not taking any sides on this, just sharing something I came across and found interesting.

FWIW... I believe in freedom of religion and I'll leave it at that.

[TMF]

This "article" is absurd. There is no fact here, just wild theories posed that can be logically reasoned or explained in 30 seconds. Also, quoting the Quran to show how extremist the religion is in regards to killing innocent women and children doesn't really work in the favor of this article when any half wit can pull out a King James and flip to the Old Testament.

[billyscott]

OK. Explain this in 30 seconds.

[TMF]

OK. Explain this in 30 seconds.

Okey doke. Of course I can speak faster than I type, but you get the point.

First off, consider the source or this "article". It is not some objective media source.

Let's break down the article paragraph by paragraph and bring in a little logic:

Visit Globalinfidel.tv.

Why is it such a big deal that a Muslim community is simply trying to build a house of worship?

Let’s start with a little math. Murfreesboro, TN has just over 100,000 residents. According to estimates provided by the Islamic Center of Murfreesboro, there are 200 to 300 Muslim families living in the area. When they announced their plans to build a 53,000 square foot mega mosque, a lot of questions came up. One subject of concern was why they needed such a huge compound for so few families. What is particularly disconcerting is that, according to their own documents (attached 2009 annual report) the ICM only has 45 active paying member families. Naturally this begs another question – who is paying for this massive compound?

And, what will it really cost to build something that looks like this, per square foot, at 53,000 square feet, when the project is completed? How many millions of dollars will these “45 active members†be coming up with – and where is all this money coming from?

Now the question of who is paying for this Islamic compound and why is it so big, begs another question:

Okay, first I'd like to point out that there are no references to support the assertion that there are only 200-300 Muslim families living in the Murfreesboro area. I mean, how would he know? Do Muslims have to register or something? Is it like Selective Service where you go to the post office and tell them you're Muslim? Or did the local government issue them little cresent moons to wear on their clothing so they are easily identified?

As I recall in one of the articles I read in the past the PR rep for the ICM said they have nearly 1,000 people that attend the current mosque which is why they are currently so cramped and have decided to build a new one. Furthermore, the ICM that already exists in a Murfreesboro business park has been in the area for 30 years. I would say that it's safe to assume that they can accrue the funds over 30 years to move some place better.

On to the "active members". If you visit the ICM site you will see that active members must pay a monthly dues. In return you get voting/election rights. I'm assuming that "active members" is made up of some of the more well-to-do members of the mosque as $50 is pretty steep. The 45 active members probably only account for current operating costs of the mosque, but by no means are going to represent all the donations taken in over 30 years. Do you have to register at your church when they pass the plate around?

Here is something else to think about, who funds these multi-million dollar mega-churches? Does anyone ask? Does anyone care? I don't. However they raise their money is their business so long as they aren't breaking the law.... and that has never happened before at any of these super churches, right?

Another thing to consider is the fact that donations have most likely surged in the past few years from around the country and the world after this became a big story. Ironic that this Islamophobic lawyer has actually done more harm than good to his cause. They only need to raise 2 million to pay off their debts on this construction. I'm surprised they haven't ALREADY reached their goals considering the massive Muslim community that exists in middle Tennessee. Or perhaps we can pretend that doesn't exist.

Why is it that after 9/11, mosque construction in America has nearly doubled?

It’s not as if the population of Muslims in America suddenly spiked – not even close. Muslims make up less than 1 percent of the United States population. So is there any logical explanation for the rapid expansion of new mosque construction?

One need only look to the history of 1,400 years of Islamic conquest to understand that according to the Hijra, the Islamic doctrine of cultural invasion, Muslims are required to build mosques following a successful attack.

The 1,400 years of Islamic conquest? Is Christianity the only religion allowed to spread? I know folks hate talking about things like the Crusades, but damn. You can't argue about Islamic conquest without acknowledging that the same exists in Christianity. There was once a time that Christians were nothing more than an outcast cult in the Roman Empire. Over 2,000 years it has spanned the globe and dominated the western world. So, Islam spread across the iddy-biddy middle east while Christianity got an entire hemisphere.

But shouldn’t the Islamic Center of Murfreesboro have the right to build anyway? Is this not a right, given to all religions and protected under the First Amendment?

In order to understand what Islam is and is not, it is important to note a few basic facts. Well under 20 percent of Islamic scripture talks about religion in any way. The rest concerns itself with fighting the infidel, conquest, spreading the tyrannical Islamic political system and enforcing brutal Islamic Law (Sharia) on the non-believers.

Another glaring detail that our last few Presidents left out, when telling us that “Islam is peace†is that Islam is sort of obsessed with hating the Jews. In fact, the Prophet Mohammed had an entire Jewish tribe murdered. Here is a bit of Islamic scripture that I find to be very revealing, when it comes to “the religion of peaceâ€:

“The last hour would not come unless the Muslims will fight against the Jews and the Muslims would kill them until the Jews would hide themselves behind a stone or a tree and a stone or a tree would say: Muslim, or the servant of Allah, there is a Jew behind me; come and kill him.†(Sahih Muslim, 41:6985; see also 41:6981-84 and Sahih Bukhari, 4:52:176,177 and 4:56:791)

Once again, if you're gonna start throwing stones from your soapbox you should understand that Islam is not the only religion with a murderous past. I'm still not seeing what an opinion on a religion has to do with the 1st Amendment, but hey, I'm sitting here thumbing through the Old Testament here and seeing plenty of stuff that has nothing to do with "religion". I mean, I don't know how to classify what "religion" writing is. I guess a lot of it is meant to be a historical guideline, with guidance from God throughout, but certainly not more than 20 percent. In fact, I'm looking at nearly 30 pages that describe the proper construction of the Tabernacle. But let's see if this is what is considered "religious" writing or "guidance":

Deuteronomy

Ch 2

26. And I sent messengers out of the wilderness of Kedemoth unto Sihon king of Heshbon with words of peace, saying,

27. Let me pass through thy land: I will go along by the high way, I will neither turn unto the right hand nor the left.

30. But Sihon king of Heshbon would not let us pass by him: for the Lord thy God hardened his spirit, and made his heart obstinate, that he might deliver him into thy hand, as appeareth this day.

31. And the Lord said unto me, Behold, I have begun to give Sihon and his land before thee: begin to possess, that thou mayest inherit his land.

32. Then Sihon came out against us, he and all his people, to fight at Jahaz.

33. And the Lord our God delivered hime before us; and we smote him, and his sons, and all his people.

34. And we took all his cities at that time, and utterly destroyed the men, and the women, and the little ones, of every city, we left none to remain:

Ch 3

3. So the Lord our God delivered into our hands Og also, the king of Bashan, and all his people: and we smote him until none was left to him remaining.

4. And we took all his cities at taht time, there was not a city which we took not from them, threescore cities, all the region of Argob, the kingdom of Og in Bashan.

5. All these cities were fenced with high walls, gates, and bars; beside unwalled towns a great many.

6. And we utterly destroyed them, as we did unto Sihon king of Heshbon, utterly destroying the men, women, and children, of every city.

Of course, if I go back a few chapters I can find where our Lord smote tens of thousands of Jews for various offenses. So in terms of Jew-killing tally, I hardly believe that one can attack the Quran with such evidence while ignoring the entirety of the Old Testament. Well, I guess you can if you're a hypocrite.

Like I've said before, I don't really care for the Islamic world for a number of reasons. I could care even less about Islam itself. What I do care is about rights as Americans.

As you can see, this article contains no substance or even one fact. It is a bunch of nonsense and opinion. If you're really concerned about this Murfreesboro mosque situation, maybe do a little research that isn't soley on anti-Islamic websites. You would be surprised what you would find out. Of course, if your goal is to simply reaffirm your opinions by seeking news sources that are clearly biased towards your own beliefs, then you have no hope in reaching a conclusion with any more facts than what you can make up in your head. I prefer to diversify my information sources.

Edited June 27, 2012 by TMF 18B

[Guest 6.8 AR]

Okay tell us about the Crusades, TMF. No

problem here.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[JohnC]

This "article" is absurd. There is no fact here, just wild theories posed that can be logically reasoned or explained in 30 seconds. Also, quoting the Quran to show how extremist the religion is in regards to killing innocent women and children doesn't really work in the favor of this article when any half wit can pull out a King James and flip to the Old Testament.

Absured, no fact? ROFLMAO!!!!!!!!!!!

David Horowitz is a very respected reformed Communist. He is also Jewish. He has an inside knowledge of the radical left wing (Socialists, Communists, Islamists, etc) and the Antisemitic groups out here. A lot of it is very well documented through their videos and other print propaganda, students groups right here in the USA at local colleges, etc.

If you think the good Muslims sums up the total of them all, then your stuck in a bias and not reality.

Maybe you should start researching past the crap you use for retorts and start looking at the proof on other side. There is a ton of proof right from the radicals mouths in their propaganda, videos, etc.

Edited June 27, 2012 by JohnC

[TMF]

Absured, no fact? ROTFLMAO!!!!!!!!!!!

David Horowitz is a very respected reformed Communist. He is also Jewish. He has an inside knowledge of the radical left wing (Socialists, Communists, Islamists, etc) and the Antisemitic groups out here. A lot of it is very well documented through their videos and other print propaganda, students groups right here in the USA at local colleges, etc.

If you think the good Muslims sums up the total of them all, then your stuck in a bias and not reality.

Maybe you should start researching past the crap you use for retorts and start looking at the proof on other side. There is a ton of proof right from the radicals mouths in their propaganda, videos, etc.

Yes, Islam has radicals. That does not mean one has to assume they are all radicals by default? By that logic I guess all Catholic Priests like to rape little boys, so sayeth the Spider. A few speak for the many and all.

Also, there IS absolutely NO facts in that article. There isn't one fact in there. The only reference links are to other anti-Islamic websites.

I'm not sure how being a former communist or being Jewish somehow makes you a "respected" source of information. I don't see how one has to do with the other. I only respect journalists that use references that contain facts. This article contains no facts; only circumstantial speculation.

I didn't come back with witty retorts. If you read my post above you see that there are facts and reasonable assumptions in there. I gathered these while doing research on the mosque on other sites than ones designed to paint the whole of Islam as terrorists.

[JohnC]

Yes, Islam has radicals. That does not mean one has to assume they are all radicals by default? By that logic I guess all Catholic Priests like to rape little boys, so sayeth the Spider. A few speak for the many and all.

Also, there IS absolutely NO facts in that article. There isn't one fact in there. The only reference links are to other anti-Islamic websites.

I'm not sure how being a former communist or being Jewish somehow makes you a "respected" source of information. I don't see how one has to do with the other. I only respect journalists that use references that contain facts. This article contains no facts; only circumstantial speculation.

I didn't come back with witty retorts. If you read my post above you see that there are facts and reasonable assumptions in there. I gathered these while doing research on the mosque on other sites than ones designed to paint the whole of Islam as terrorists.

Man, I don't have time to argue with you.

But I will say I never said all of them are radicals. I never said being a former commie or being a Jew makes you credible. I was merely pointing out Horowitz comes from experience and if you took the time to get to know his history and all the proof he has on video and print propaganda from the radical islamists, you'd know this as well (rather than shooting off with your usual arguments just because you want to take a side and play defense on everything Islam because there are good Muslims on earth).

And when I say experience, he has been on the front lines battling the Antisemitic Muslim Students Association, etc. They openly held a Hitler Youth Week at UCSD on campus fwiw.

[media=]

[/media]

It's things like the above he has been exposing, but folks like you do not take the time to read and look at the proof. You'd rather argue silly points and drag the topics in to "not all Muslims are radicals." Well firicken of course not!

But you win! Horowitz is a fake, a fraud, he knows nothing. You're right about everything. No one knows more than you on any subjects about Islam. All your internet sources are the only credible source's, all ours are not.

For now on, I'll come to you for all things Islam, Muslim, Mosque, etc.

Have a nice day!

Edited June 27, 2012 by JohnC

[Smith]

TMF 18B, are you as adamant about this as you were the initial Trayvon Martin "facts"?

Edited June 27, 2012 by Smith

[JohnC]

TMF 18B, are you as adamant about this as you were the initial Trayvon Martin "facts"?

I think he wants folks to ignore the bad (radical islamists, jihadists, etc) because there are also good Muslims on earth.

That's like saying don't point out or expose some priests are molesting little boys because there are also good priests that do not.

[TMF]

TMF 18B, are you as adamant about this as you were the initial Trayvon Martin "facts"?

If you have a problem with me then send me a PM. I regard you making an issue of my opinions to be personal in nature.

I still hold the same belief as I did before in regards to the Zimmerman shooting, but let's not derail the thread for that. I simply ain't participating in threads where the same few people just want to stroke each other and then get offended that someone has a different opinion. Besides, I never formed my opinion on the initial "facts" as you put it. I've explained my reasons very plainly.

[TMF]

I think he wants folks to ignore the bad (radical islamists, jihadists, etc) because there are also good Muslims on earth.

That's like saying don't point out or expose some priests are molesting little boys because there are also good priests that do not.

I've never said anything of the like. If you read a few posts up I clearly state the following, "Yes, Islam has radicals."

Is that not clear enough for you? There is no reading between the lines there and I don't think that makes me some kind of a Muslim lover. I've had plently more jihadists try to kill me than you, I can bet the bank on that.

My position is that AMERICANS have a RIGHT to practice their religion. Last I heard that was the way things are done here. I'm a patriot, so I don't give a good damn what religion someone is, so long as they are American they get to have the same rights as me. Above I clearly state facts and reasonable assumptions based on facts. There is nothing personal or misleading there.

Edited June 27, 2012 by TMF 18B

[TMF]

.

Edited June 27, 2012 by TMF 18B

[Smith]

If you have a problem with me then send me a PM. I regard you making an issue of my opinions to be personal in nature.

I still hold the same belief as I did before in regards to the Zimmerman shooting, but let's not derail the thread for that. I simply ain't participating in threads where the same few people just want to stroke each other and then get offended that someone has a different opinion. Besides, I never formed my opinion on the initial "facts" as you put it. I've explained my reasons very plainly.

No need. You made public definitive statements, I just asked the question. I don't know you personally, I'm a only discussing what you have said.

"A man is known by the words he leaves behind."

Edited June 27, 2012 by Smith

[TMF]

No need. You made public definitive statements, I just asked the question. I don't know you personally, I'm a only discussing what you have said.

"A man is known by the words he leaves behind."

I know exactly what I said and I meant it and continue to stand by it. My question is why are you bringing it up? Here I am making well thought out points that involved research and life experience, and here you come along and want to make a smart a$$ statement about something in another thread. To me that is personal. So, if you have something to say PM me instead of starting a personal pissing contest just because you happen to disagree with me. Understand?

[Smith]

I know exactly what I said and I meant it and continue to stand by it. My question is why are you bringing it up? Here I am making well thought out points that involved research and life experience, and here you come along and want to make a smart a$$ statement about something in another thread. To me that is personal. So, if you have something to say PM me instead of starting a personal pissing contest just because you happen to disagree with me. Understand?

You made no factual argument other than to try marginalize Islam by using selective parts of "Christianity" out of context from 1000 plus years past to justify your statements. Your argument is not about the "facts" but an attempt to make this debate one solely based on prejudice and religious contempt, as you perceive it, by anyone who disagrees with you. Emotion based debates don't farewell. The comparison to the Trayvon threads is valid, because you did the same thing there. Deriding everyone who disagreed with you with as racial, prejudiced, and narrow minded the same as you have done here. It is a pattern.

Just Say-in.

[JohnC]

I've never said anything of the like. If you read a few posts up I clearly state the following, "Yes, Islam has radicals."

Is that not clear enough for you? There is no reading between the lines there and I don't think that makes me some kind of a Muslim lover. I've had plently more jihadists try to kill me than you, I can bet the bank on that.

My position is that AMERICANS have a RIGHT to practice their religion. Last I heard that was the way things are done here. I'm a patriot, so I don't give a good damn what religion someone is, so long as they are American they get to have the same rights as me. Above I clearly state facts and reasonable assumptions based on facts. There is nothing personal or misleading there.

Did you miss my first post? I also said "I believe in freedom of religion and I'll leave it at that."

[TMF]

You made no factual argument other than to try marginalize Islam by using selective parts of "Christianity" out of context from 1000 plus years past to justify your statements. Your argument is not about the "facts" but an attempt to make this debate one solely based on prejudice and religious contempt, as you perceive it, by anyone who disagrees with you. Emotion based debates don't farewell. The comparison to the Trayvon threads is valid, because you did the same thing there. Deriding everyone who disagreed with you with as racial, prejudiced, and narrow minded the same as you have done here. It is a pattern.

Just Say-in.

My post addresses specifically that article. I picked it apart to show that when you apply facts and reasonable assumptions the article becomes baseless speculation. I included passages from the Old Testament as I thought it relevant to put into perspective the passages from the Quran, which were used to show that Muslims must have murderous attitudes towards Jews.

After that I was told "If you think the good Muslims sums up the total of them all, then your stuck in a bias and not reality."

In fact, my opinion is that just because there are bad Muslims that doesn't sum up the lot of them.

Then I was told this: "Maybe you should start researching past the crap you use for retorts and start looking at the proof on other side. There is a ton of proof right from the radicals mouths in their propaganda, videos, etc."

Well I felt that my post showed that I did do research and put a lot of thought into my post, and it wasn't meant at all to be a "retort". In fact, I was responding to billyscott's request to prove my point; I put my money where my mouth is.

Then you came along and wanted to make it personal. I was debating the issue (which was the article from the OP). I continue to stand my beliefs that the article is baseless and seeks to incite emotion rather than reason. I don't see you challenging anything from that original post; just coming here to stir the pot.

[daddyo]

As much as I despise the Islamic "faith" because of its clear vendetta on "infidels", there are no exclusions from 1st Amendment protections for anyone who practices a religion that is bellicose in nature and generally anti-American.

It is fact that sharia law has already taken hold in some European countries, usurping the existing laws. Look at what's happening in Minnesota for a taste of what could happen to the entire country in a matter of years. They are proving that their religious laws trump commerce regardless of any economic impact. This is exactly why Arab countries are still underdeveloped and why they hate the free market system, subsequently the American way of life, which is built on capitalism.

Maybe it's time for an amendment to the Constitution regarding Islam because of the serious and real threat it poses to the American way of life.

[Guest bkelm18]

TMF, I would give up if I were you. I did. I learned that only white Christians deserve to have freedom in this country. And some people think liberals will destroy this country. I say both sides will have a hefty hand in its demise.

[TMF]

TMF, I would give up if I were you. I did. I learned that only white Christians deserve to have freedom in this country. And some people think liberals will destroy this country. I say both sides will have a hefty hand in its demise.

You're right. I guess I thought the forum guidelines were for well thought out responses in the spirit of debate. I see that if your comments are well thought out and relevant to the topic it is only okay if you agree with the majority. I guess it's time for me to leave.

[Smith]

Man you have a high opinion of your "arguments"! I questioned your premise and now we are at a pity party. Facts are one thing, broad generalized assertions based on ones personal observations lead here. The only way to debate a personal observation is to address the person who is the stated observer. It's only personal because your arguments are personal.

Just because I disagree with your premise does not make it personal, but that's where you framed it so thats where it went.

[Guest RevScottie]

That is a pretty poorly written article with an intentional bias against a people group based on their religious beliefs. The claim of there only being 200-300 Muslim families is made to support his grand conspiracy theory. In fact their are tens of thousands of Muslim families in the greater Nashville Murfreesboro area. There are in fact 12,000+ Islamic Kurds living in Nashville alone. Many of these people fled their own countries because of war, ethnic cleansing, etc and are now finding they are just as despised in the Land of the Free. There are far more ignorant, hateful, racist, Christians in the South than there are Muslim extremists.

Edited June 27, 2012 by RevScottie

[TMF]

The claim of there only being 200-300 Muslim families is made to support his grand conspiracy theory. In fact their are tens of thousands of Muslim families in the greater Nashville Murfreesboro area. There are in fact 12,000+ Islamic Kurds living in Nashville alone. Many of these people fled their own countries because of war, ethnic cleansing, etc and are now finding they are just as despised in the Land of the Free.

I tried to point that out in that first post. Apparently that was just wild lies on my part. The fact that I know nearly a dozen Kurdish families living down in that area is an outright lie. How dare I object to non-factual statements with facts. After all, the article was published on the interwebz so it must be true.

[Smith]

That is a pretty poorly written article with an intentional bias against a people group based on their religious beliefs. The claim of there only being 200-300 Muslim families is made to support his grand conspiracy theory. In fact their are tens of thousands of Muslim families in the greater Nashville Murfreesboro area. There are in fact 12,000+ Islamic Kurds living in Nashville alone. Many of these people fled their own countries because of war, ethnic cleansing, etc and are now finding they are just as despised in the Land of the Free. There are far more ignorant, hateful, racist, Christians in the South than there are Muslim extremists.

I've worked with the kurdish refugees since 97 and have been involved with the School of the Medes here in Nashville. I've not seen our heard from them that same sentiment. I do, however, hear that from white people and liberals who assume they know their experience and need someone to fight their battles for them. The ones I've dealt with are excited to be here and are burdened to help the families they had to leave behind make it here to share the experience.