On-Site Consumption of Alcohol - Carry Question

[Guest atomemphis]

Is the law written to address restaraunts only?

While in Dallas this weekend, I was presented with an interesting issue:

I was in a Hotel that had a bar. People are free to walk about the entire hotel with their drinks.

In TN, would it be illegal for me to carry in that hotel then? An example would be the Opryland Hotel (assuming its not posted as a no-carry zone, if it is).

Secondly, Movie theaters that have beer available for purchase and allow you to carry it into the screening room. The other type, has an 'adult beverage' serving location, where drinks must stay to prevent the passage of drinks to a minor. Both cases, we are onsite, and alcohol is served.

[Fallguy]

The law doesn't cover just restaurants.

In addition to the places you mentioned, there are also bowling alleys that sell beer at the concession stand, but allow you to carry back to the lanes.

Not sure if there is 100% clear legal answer.

I think it might be whether the place licensed to sell alcohol is the same premises as where they maybe drinking it. More than likely Yes for the Theater and Bowling alley. But at the motel, if the license to sell alcohol was issued to the bar within the motel as if it is was it's own establishment, maybe No.

Just another thing that really needs to be addressed in the Summer Study Committee about the Restaurant carry bill.

39-17-1305 Possession of firearm where alcoholic beverages are served.

(a) It is an offense for a person to possess a firearm within the confines of a building open to the public where liquor, wine or other alcoholic beverages, as defined in § 57-3-101(a)(1)(A), or beer, as defined in § 57-6-102(1), are served for on premises consumption.

( A violation of this section is a Class A misdemeanor.

© The provisions of subsection (a) shall not apply to a person who is:

(1)

In the actual discharge of official duties as a law enforcement officer, or is employed in the army, air force, navy, coast guard or marine service of the United States or any member of the Tennessee national guard in the line of duty and pursuant to military regulations, or is in the actual discharge of duties as a correctional officer employed by a penal institution; or

(2)

On the person's own premises or premises under the person's control or who is the employee or agent of the owner of the premises with responsibility for protecting persons or property.

[Guest nraforlife]

Now would that not be something if you could not pack your piece in your suitcase for a premium hotel stay...

[Marswolf]

Yeah, and apparently it's OK to pack in a mall that has a restaurant that serves alcohol - although it in the same "building"

[mdmoseley]

I thought hotels because they were considered a place of residence didn't apply. It seems like I remember that question coming up in our class. Obviously you couldn't go into the bar or the resturant as those are normally sectioned off anyway.

[Fallguy]

Yeah, and apparently it's OK to pack in a mall that has a restaurant that serves alcohol - although it in the same "building"

Yep...same building, but two different business' (premises'?). Just like store A could ban weapons and the mall, but store B might not.

But have to admit, not sure what the definition of "premises" is when it comes to this statute.

[Guest jcramin]

The two examples I wonder about are ....

The outside porch at HOOTERS ? Serves for onsite consumption, but NOT within the confines of a building its an outside porch ???

Parking lot at Joe's Crab Shack on Bike Night ? Serves for onsite consumption, but NOT within the confines of a building its a parking lot ???

[Guest atomemphis]

I'd say no to Hooters - the porch is the building, they'd argue.

But the parking lot? Good question.

[Fallguy]

I too would say no at Hooters. One reason is, unless you're going to jump the rail, you'd have to pass through the confines of the building to get to or leave the deck.

As far as parking lots, even where beer is being consumed...IMO I'd say you could carry as long as you are not drinking. The parking lot is definitely not within the confines of the building.

[Guest nraforlife]

More ways to end up on the wrong side of the law than not. Thanks TN legistators. If you must carry, and not that I am advocating breaking the law mind you, carry WELL CONCEALED and keep your mouth shut.

[strickj]

I too would say no at Hooters. One reason is, unless you're going to jump the rail, you'd have to pass through the confines of the building to get to or leave the deck.

As far as parking lots, even where beer is being consumed...IMO I'd say you could carry as long as you are not drinking. The parking lot is definitely not within the confines of the building.

Im not sure if its just Chatt,or state but for a restaurant to have a deck,patio,outside eating in general it must be closed off to the general public.Im pretty sure thats state though...

[Guest jcramin]

I too would say no at Hooters. One reason is, unless you're going to jump the rail, you'd have to pass through the confines of the building to get to or leave the deck.

As far as parking lots, even where beer is being consumed...IMO I'd say you could carry as long as you are not drinking. The parking lot is definitely not within the confines of the building.

NO Hooters Wolfchase has a gate on the porch and I wouldnt test this anyway because I belive the porch is part of the building even if the law states WITHIN THE CONFINES of the building which actually means with in the walls..

And if you remeber Hooters on Mt Mariah here in memphis the deck was open to the outside as you walked up you walked on the deck first before you even went in.

Edited May 13, 2008 by jcramin

[Fallguy]

NO Hooters Wolfchase has a gate on the porch and I wouldnt test this anyway because I belive the porch is part of the building even if the law states WITHIN THE CONFINES of the building which actually means with in the walls..

And if you remeber Hooters on Mt Mariah here in memphis the deck was open to the outside as you walked up you walked on the deck first before you even went in.

IMO I agree that the deck is still part of or within the confines of the buidling. Just like in the self-defense law where it says an attached porch is part of the dwelling.

...and in my defense, I have only been to two Hooters (Denver and Nashville on 2nd Av) in my whole life.

[Guest canynracer]

Just like the porch is a part of your "dwelling" it is the same for Hooters...you cannot carry.

As far as the Hotel is concerned, you are not at the bar portion, just because people can walk to their rooms with a drink, doesnt necessarily mean you cannot carry...I would bet you would get away with it unless you were in the resturaunt or bar specifically.

course, I dont wanna be the guinea pig on that one...

[Guest canynracer]

damn fallguy, you type fast...LOL

[Fallguy]

damn fallguy, you type fast...LOL

LOL...if I could only turn that into something profitable....

[Guest 270win]

Usually when renting a hotel room, it is considered your 'premisis' or 'domicile', even if for a temporary time of a night or two. That is why even in the states where our handgun carry permit is not honored, such as California, we can at least keep a handgun loaded in a hotel room because that is considered your temporary home.

TN does exempt carrying a handgun where it is your premisis with or without a license/permit. The state also allows you to carry where alcohol served within the confines of a building if you are on your premisis. I highly doubt anyone would have any problems. Would I openly carry in a hotel where liquor is served in this state? I would not to avoid the 1% of jerks that would give you grief over it.

You are probably not legal carrying on the patio portion of a restaurant because that is the area where alcohol is served for on site drinking. You can't leave the restaurant/bar building and patio with your drink generally because that site has the liquor license.

[Marswolf]

You are probably not legal carrying on the patio portion of a restaurant because that is the area where alcohol is served for on site drinking.

I think this is the crux of the matter. If you are in a location where you can order a drink to be served to you, then you can't legally pack there.

[Fallguy]

I think this is the crux of the matter. If you are in a location where you can order a drink to be served to you, then you can't legally pack there.

Now...there ya go....I think that is probably the most simple and correct answer. (As long as you are inside or on the porch/deck )

[Mike.357]

beer does not count, right?

[Fallguy]

beer does not count, right?

I'm afraid it does.

[Marswolf]

beer does not count, right?

I can spot a troublemaker....

[Mike.357]

well beer is not really like drinking, I think I could win that argument

[Guest atomemphis]

I think it could be possible to point out a contradiction in the TN state law, but it would take a lot of money and a court case.

it revolves around the TN 6% law - below can be sold anywhere BUT a liquor store, at or above MUST be sold in a liquor store and nowhere else.

Except restaraunts. Why the exceptions with an old & dumb law pertaining to alcohol? Obviously it would hurt the MAPCO if I could buy my beer and JD at the liquor store, since I wouldn't buy it there anymore, but beyond that, there's no real justification.

In our neighbors below (Georgia), beer of all alcohol content and wine can be sold in the gas stations, and anything can be sold in a liquor store, including mixers (no alcohol) and beer.

Nobody is dying from the combined sales locations, so why is it a law in Tennessee? Unnecessary legislation bothers me greatly.

[strickj]

well beer is not really like drinking, I think I could win that argument

Depends if your drinking a girlie mans Bud light or a real mans beer Natural Ice