Man claiming SYG in TX after initiating confrontation

[MattCary]

There's something funny in this story. The guy doing the shooting and videotaping is a "former firefighter" and victims are a fire chief and another firefighter.

Just gut reaction on my part, but perhaps these folks had an ongoing prior beef?

Also, on a side note. When someone walks into your party armed, don't say like "don't think when I come back out here I won't be equal to you, baby." It's not going to sound as cool as you intended it in the paper the next day.

[JayC]

My point is you can start a confrontation and still be clearly justified in using self defense.... The case in this news article doesn't seem to be an example of that... But you can't say just because somebody starts a legal confrontation they loose the ability to claim self defense.

As for the Zimmerman case... I don't think we know enough about what happened between the end of the 911 call, and the shooting, to say who was the aggressor and who started the physical assault.

But, I will say at the end of the 911 call Zimmerman had not done anything illegal up until that point in my mind.

Following somebody is not a crime.... Walking up to somebody and asking them what they are doing in your neighborhood late t night isn't a crime...

The key to that case is the couple of minutes between the end of the 911 call and the start of the 911 call where Zimmerman is screaming for help. Until we hear testimony or see evidence relating to that timeframe, it's hard to say if Zimmerman is guilty or not...

I will say I'm leaning towards not guilty, because I don't see likely scenarios where Zimmerman broke the law.... While Martin a known drug user who appears to have been suffering physical effects from purple lean abuse - including brain and liver damage is much more likely to have been the aggressor in my book.

How can you draw any kind of parallel between a person committing a felony and then pulling on gun on you to an innocent kid walking down the street being chased down and murdered? In your scenario you didn’t start the altercation that led to the justification for the use of deadly force, the criminal did when he made the decision to break into your wife’s car, and then pointing a gun at you.

My apologies if I wasn’t clear.

With all due respect; start posting your examples of where the shooter picked an innocent person walking down the street, started a confrontation, killed them, and a court ruled they were justified. I would imagine Zimmerman’s attorneys are looking for those cases also.

[TMF]

My point is you can start a confrontation and still be clearly justified in using self defense.... The case in this news article doesn't seem to be an example of that... But you can't say just because somebody starts a legal confrontation they loose the ability to claim self defense.

Well I don't think there is a set formula, but if by initiating a confrontation with a certain intent or if you escalate it to the point of physical confrontation you're stepping into manslaughter/murder territory.

For example, someone cuts you off in traffic and you give them the finger, maybe even exchange some words at a traffic light. Now if the guy decides to take it to the next level and get out of his car and you do the same, you're gonna most likely be charged if you end up shooting him, because the likely outcome of having a (legal) roadside argument is a physical confrontation, even if he hits you first.

This is all anecdotal, but think about it like this: will a prosecutor be able to convince a jury that you knew the likely outcome when you went armed to a confrontation? If so that is going to show intent.

Bottom line, folks that have a HCP should pay attention to incidents like this. Whether or not you think it's right, you will find yourself in deep doo doo if you start something that you end up finishing with your gun. That is a simple equation.

[Guest 6.8 AR]

You are convicting a man on assumptions? The only assumption with Zimmerman can be what he said happened

unless there is an eyewitness that can fill in the gap, from what other eyewitnesses saw. With the presumption

of innocence still the law, how can you convict him, DaveTN?

[Guest 270win]

This guy in Houston will probably go to prison for a long time or get the death penalty. This was not self defense. He should have called the police for his noise complaint.

[mikegideon]

6.8 AR posted this in another thread. Mas breaks it down really well...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=EsQeTKnD_f0

[mcurrier]

Florida task force begins review of self-defense law

Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/us/2012/06/12/florida-task-force-begins-review-self-defense-law/?test=latestnews#ixzz1xaj9F2T6

[mikegideon]

Knee Jerk, Circle Jerk... it's some kinda jerk.

[mcurrier]

Knee Jerk, Circle Jerk... it's some kinda jerk.

Yep.

[TMF]

Florida task force begins review of self-defense law

Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/us/2012/06/12/florida-task-force-begins-review-self-defense-law/?test=latestnews#ixzz1xaj9F2T6

I wonder who makes up this "task force".

[mikegideon]

I wonder who makes up this "task force".

Does it matter? It's all BS anyway. What can they accomplish?

[TMF]

Does it matter? It's all BS anyway. What can they accomplish?

Morbid curiosity. I have a feeling they aren't objective on the matter. What it will accomplish is that it will be used as a tool to strong arm law makers into repealing SYG legislation.

[Guest 6.8 AR]

I saw a bit of that task force where Trayvon!!!'s mother was talking. I changed the channel.

[Guest 6.8 AR]

Morbid curiosity. I have a feeling they aren't objective on the matter. What it will accomplish is that it will be used as a tool to strong arm law makers into repealing SYG legislation.

That is the plan for some. I doubt it will accomplish anything good or bad. The press will be looking for anything remotely similar

to SYG for the sole purpose of killing it. The FOX commentator even repulsed me the way he sounded.

Edited June 12, 2012 by 6.8 AR

[DaveTN]

He was convicted of murder.

http://www.foxnews.c...could-get-life/

[Volphin]

Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.

[TMF]

Don't start sh!t with your mouth and end it with your pistol. Tough guys take note. If this would of happened in TN I assume the results would be similar.

[DaveS]

My point is you can start a confrontation and still be clearly justified in using self defense....

How so?

Dave