Seriously Modified Beretta 92

[luvmyberetta]

Here's my Beretta 92FS with an Inox (stainless) slide and barrel, proper Inox guide rod, SGS compensator, hardwood grips with stainless hex screws, Elite hammer, Beretta D hammer spring, short reach trigger, & trijicon night sights. More to come soon...

[Caster]

Just my opinion, which means squat: The first three pictures, Gorgeous! The last three....not so much.

Seriously, classy looking pistol.

[Guest Papabear]

Looks nice, how do you like the SGS compensator? I have been toying with the idea of getting one for one of my 92's.

[luvmyberetta]

Looks nice, how do you like the SGS compensator? I have been toying with the idea of getting one for one of my 92's.

The compensator makes a drastic reduction in felt recoil. It makes it feel like you're shooting a .22 instead of a 9mm! It's the exact same compensator used on the fully auto 92's in all the "Underworld" movies & they're really rare. I would never have believed the difference the comp. makes until I tried it. If you buy one, make sure you buy one that has the steel busing insert. Otherwise your compensator may not last too long. There are some great as well as some not so great replicas floating around out there.

Edited June 1, 2012 by luvmyberetta

[TN Outlaw]

[luvmyberetta]

Just my opinion, which means squat: The first three pictures, Gorgeous! The last three....not so much.

Seriously, classy looking pistol.

No problem. You were at least polite about it. The compensator finish is a near perfect match for the slide, but the camera flash makes it stand out like a sore thumb in the photos. It looks better in person.

Edited June 1, 2012 by luvmyberetta

[Guest Lester Weevils]

That looks nice.

How does the short reach trigger work? In your pictures it looks about the same distance, cocked or un-cocked, as on my two inox 92's?

Many years ago I got a really cheap apparently brand new made-by-beretta black anodized aluminum compensator that was about the same size as yours. Bought it at a gun show from one of those crusty old guys with a table full of assorted old gun parts randomly piled up in boxes. It was in a baggy labeled "92fs compensator". Maybe the fella was trying to rip me off but I think he honestly didn't know anything about the gadget. I asked him some questions and he claimed he didn't know anything about it. My guess is that he bought a bunch of assorted junk from some other dealer and the compensator happened to be included. Anyway, he didn't charge much for it.

It was a neat gadget. The beretta factory compensator had an identical profile as the 92fs slide profile so when installed on a black 92FS it looked like a long-slide 92. When installed, the only visual clue it was an addon part was a slight line between the compensator and the slide. As best I recall the beretta factory compensator had gas slots rather than gas holes. As best I recall when the gun would recoil the compensator would follow the barrel into the frame until the barrel would lock, then the slide would continue back as in your picture.

The kit also came with a barrel that had to be used with the compensator. The barrel was maybe a half-inch longer and threaded over the extra length. That is how the compensator and barrel mated to make a system. At that time I was too ignorant to know how to measure the threads, but it was a fine thread probably metric and non-standard to USA third-party threaded barrels of the time. I had bought a third-party stainless threaded barrel for 92, but the USA third party barrel's threads were much grosser and incompatible with the beretta compensator's threads. IIRC the kit also came with a longer recoil guide rod that was necessary to make the system work. IIRC, you would assemble it by putting the barrel in the slide, then screw on the compensator all the way back on the barrel until the compensator profile was lined up with the slide profile, then insert the longer guide rod to make sure everything stayed lined up.

The only problem-- The barrel was chambered for 9X21. Years later somebody told me that in the past some USA shooting competitors were using 9X21, so I guess it makes sense that an italy-oriented part might end up in a junk box at a TN gun show. I kept that compensator kit for years thinking I'd either get around to loading some 9X21 to shoot thru it, or maybe find a third-party 9X19 barrel with the correct length and thread to match the compensator. But finally just gave it away to a friend who expressed interest. Dunno if he ever got any use out of it.

The only bad thing about that design was that if somebody was to have the habit of frequently disassembling for thorough cleaning, it would take longer un-screwing the compensator every time, then re-attaching it after cleaning. Also, the fine threads were easy to bugger-up and you had to be careful threading it on to avoid messing up the threads in the aluminum. But it was a nicely-made gadget.

[TN-popo]

How does the short reach trigger work? In your pictures it looks about the same distance

That's what I was thinking.

I'd like to hear more as well.

[Caster]

The compensator makes a drastic reduction in felt recoil. It makes it feel like you're shooting a .22 instead of a 9mm! It's the exact same compensator used on the fully auto 92's in all the "Underworld" movies & they're really rare. I would never have believed the difference the comp. makes until I tried it. If you buy one, make sure you buy one that has the steel busing insert. Otherwise your compensator may not last too long. There are some great as well as some not so great replicas floating around out there.

Whoa, whoa, back up. Now see, you didn't mention, and I didn't think about the sci-fi cool factor. I was looking at it through the narrow minded dogmatic view of a combat/carry handgun.

*Caster's Official Recantation* Pictures 4 thru 6...now cool too!

Edited June 1, 2012 by Caster

[luvmyberetta]

How does the short reach trigger work? In your pictures it looks about the same distance, cocked or un-cocked, as on my two inox 92's?

The only problem-- The barrel was chambered for 9X21. Years later somebody told me that in the past some USA shooting competitors were using 9X21, so I guess it makes sense that an italy-oriented part might end up in a junk box at a TN gun show. I kept that compensator kit for years thinking I'd either get around to loading some 9X21 to shoot thru it, or maybe find a third-party 9X19 barrel with the correct length and thread to match the compensator. But finally just gave it away to a friend who expressed interest.

OMG! That's a high dollar item you gave away! The barrel and comp's go for several hundred dollars used. I've been looking for one of those Beretta comps for a while, but haven't been able to locate one in my price range. The last set I found in good condition was around $450 used. The 9x21 barrels are used in Italy because citizens are banned from using 9mm Parabellum because it's considered as a police and military round only.

The short reach trigger is identical to a standard trigger, but the pivot holes are drilled in a slightly different spot which sets the trigger angle about 1/8" further back. It may not sound like a lot, but once installed you can clearly feel the difference. You have to see the two triggers sitting side by side to see the difference. Trigger reset is quicker because your finger doesn't have to move as far forward between each shot too. When the trigger breaks, it's nearly touching the frame and has zero over travel. Beretta Vertecs have SR triggers factory installed.

[TN-popo]

Whoa, whoa, back up. Now see, you didn't mention, and I didn't think about the sci-fi cool factor. I was looking at it through the narrow minded dogmatic view of a combat/carry handgun.

*Caster's Official Recantation* Pictures 4 thru 6...now cool too!

Caster sees Underworld and thinks "sci-fi cool factor."

TN-popo sees Underworld and thinks "Kate Beckinsale factor."

[Caster]

See her without her make up and wardrobe team she's nothing to really brag about. Of course, that goes for 99% of hollywood; Chemicals, dyes, paints, hair extensions, surgical modifications, airbrushing, lighting, smoke and mirrors.

[Guest Lester Weevils]

OMG! That's a high dollar item you gave away! The barrel and comp's go for several hundred dollars used. I've been looking for one of those Beretta comps for a while, but haven't been able to locate one in my price range. The last set I found in good condition was around $450 used. The 9x21 barrels are used in Italy because citizens are banned from using 9mm Parabellum because it's considered as a police and military round only.

The short reach trigger is identical to a standard trigger, but the pivot holes are drilled in a slightly different spot which sets the trigger angle about 1/8" further back. It may not sound like a lot, but once installed you can clearly feel the difference. You have to see the two triggers sitting side by side to see the difference. Trigger reset is quicker because your finger doesn't have to move as far forward between each shot too. When the trigger breaks, it's nearly touching the frame and has zero over travel. Beretta Vertecs have SR triggers factory installed.

Thanks for the good info on the trigger and compensator. Wouldn't be surprised if my friend still has the compensator, and maybe hasn't even experimentally put it on his pistol. I don't seem him often nowadays. Also gave him a third party stainless ported barrel I think was about 5.5" long, maybe a little longer. Can't recall the brand name and its not in the cheaper than dirt catalog nowadays. I don't think it was bar-sto because those were always kinda expensive, if recalling correctly. Cheaper than dirt used to sell I think three kinds of stainless 92 barrel along with the same thing for some other brands. They seemed solidly made and were pretty cheap. Maybe $50 or less, can't recall. I think there was a threaded 5.5" barrel, a ported 5.5" barrel, and maybe a simple "long barrel" in the 6" ballpark but may be remembering wrong.

That stainless ported barrel worked "ok" but it fed slightly less reliable than 100 percent reliable beretta barrel, and seemed slightly less accurate than the factory barrel, but perhaps a person expert in fitting and polishing could have fixed those issues, dunno. Probably some compensators work better than others. This one had 2 or 3 slots cut in the top-front, possibly canted backwards a little. Maybe it worked good but I don't recall being able to determine much difference in muzzle flip with that barrel compared to the factory 92. It didn't cost much and was just curious about it. But the 92 is such a soft shooting gun unless one had an auto version or one is trying to get real good at rapid fire.

I don't think that beretta-style factory compensator would be difficult to build. Its surprising no small time guy in a garage sells a clone if the price is so high on the old models. The biggest hurdle would be the threaded barrel. Probably buy a threaded barrel with the proper specs from somebody who does it well. Or buy the barrel and thread it yerself. I'm guessing maybe the threads were so fine on the beretta compensator, so that the compensator profile could fit "real close" to the slide without requiring super human quality control on the thread placement on the barrel and compensator. With a fine-enough thread, even if you were almost a whole rotation off in order to line up the compensator, there wouldn't be too much a gap between slide and compensator? Just guessing. I suspect a grosser thread would be more long-term durable and less likely to get buggered up. I don't recall that beretta compensator having a steel sleeve to reduce wear from hot gasses, but its been a long time and maybe it did. Or alternately maybe the thing was made out of a fairly tough aluminum alloy.

If you found a factory 9X21 compensator you could afford, would you actually buy or reload 9X21 ammo so you could use it? Just curious.

[luvmyberetta]

You can use standard 9mm ammunition with a 9x21 comp. I think standard 9mm parabellum has a 9.01 diameter and 9x21 has a 9.03 diameter so the caliber difference isn't a problem. All you need is to have a standard Beretta 92 barrel threaded to accept the comp and you're good to go.

I don't know if the model you have is suppost to have an insert or not. The model I have on mine does. They make some like the SGS style above without a steel bushing inside, but some have said they wear out much faster. Right now there's a member on the Beretta forum who goes by "WAL" that's reproducing copies of the one you had, but using steel. He does some mean mods and good work too. Here's a link... see pages 6 & 7 for his pics of it... http://berettaforum....pensator&page=6

Edited June 2, 2012 by luvmyberetta

[Guest Lester Weevils]

You can use standard 9mm ammunition with a 9x21 comp. I think standard 9mm parabellum has a 9.01 diameter and 9x21 has a 9.03 diameter so the caliber difference isn't a problem. All you need is to have a standard Beretta 92 barrel threaded to accept the comp and you're good to go.

Thanks that makes sense. I had been thinking of finding such a barrel for a long time but never got around to it. I have a little lathe now so could perhaps do it myself. I think it would have to be a barrel a little longer than a standard factory barrel as best can recall. I don't think a standard barrel would extend past the slide far enough to have a big-enough length of threaded section, but may be remembering wrong. I just never did it because could probably have hired it out to bar-sto or somebody but would have been kinda expensive.

Have you ever read whether beretta ever made the comp kits with 9X19 barrels, or was it 9X21 only? Just curious.

[luvmyberetta]

Thanks that makes sense. I had been thinking of finding such a barrel for a long time but never got around to it. I have a little lathe now so could perhaps do it myself. I think it would have to be a barrel a little longer than a standard factory barrel as best can recall. I don't think a standard barrel would extend past the slide far enough to have a big-enough length of threaded section, but may be remembering wrong. I just never did it because could probably have hired it out to bar-sto or somebody but would have been kinda expensive.

Have you ever read whether beretta ever made the comp kits with 9X19 barrels, or was it 9X21 only? Just curious.

I think they did. Beretta made a lot of competition, target, and other model pistols and kits that are very rare and most guys haven't even heard of. You should be able to use a standard 4.9" barrel with a threaded bushing adapter or if you can find a Beretta 5.9" target barrel and cut to fit. Check out the Beretta forum and look up member "WAL". He does a huge amount of mods for people and machine work that others wouldn't attempt. I'm saving up to have a conical bushing installed on one of my pistols to make it more accurate. I've seen guys shoot 1/4" groups or better at 50 yards with this mod.

[Guest Lester Weevils]

I think they did. Beretta made a lot of competition, target, and other model pistols and kits that are very rare and most guys haven't even heard of. You should be able to use a standard 4.9" barrel with a threaded bushing adapter or if you can find a Beretta 5.9" target barrel and cut to fit. Check out the Beretta forum and look up member "WAL". He does a huge amount of mods for people and machine work that others wouldn't attempt. I'm saving up to have a conical bushing installed on one of my pistols to make it more accurate. I've seen guys shoot 1/4" groups or better at 50 yards with this mod.

Thanks for the good info.

It may be that a standard length barrel would be long enough. Have read the conical bushing threads which are interesting. You posted some targets from shooting your Cougar and you could probably benefit from a bushing's enhanced accuracy. My shooting is good enough to hit paper but thats about it. About the same scattershot on all the pistols, and the stock 92 groups a little tighter than most pistols in my hand. A bushing wouldn't benefit me.

Main things lately considered re 92 mutilation--

-- Maybe try to make some real thin aluminum grips to get a little better reach. As best can tell internet searching, none of the beretta grips are "remarkably thin" like those CZ Custom CZ75 aluminum grips, which really are drastically thin compared to most. But one time I had the grips off one of the 92's experimentally aiming it, and the grip is "fairly fat" with no grips at all, so it might be wasted effort to bother shaving off a quarter inch of girth or whatever. One of these days keep meaning to take a 92 to the range with just duct tape temporarily over both sides to find out if thin grips would make any ergonomic difference after firing a hundred rounds. If no grips at all (except duct tape to keep stuff from falling out) made no improvement, then obviously it would be a silly exercise to try to make thin grips.

-- A couple of folks have drilled out their front sights for fiber optic rods. It is a fascinating possibility. The neatest looking job, one guy cut a slot in the sight wide enough to hold a fiber optic rod and dressed the rod against the profile of the front sight so that it looked very good. You get better light collection if the top of the rod can get light. Was thinking that maybe a good experimental practice platform would be to order a replacement factory front sight for the Stoegar Cougar and then find out if I can successfully do the job on the Cougar without butchering it up. Thataway if I screw it up could replace the front sight with the new cougar factory part. Cutting on the 92 slide would be tragically irreversible if I botched the job. They say a standard 92FS slide doesn't have enough metal to cut a dovetail to hold a fiberoptic sight, so the options are limited to either machining the front sight to hold a fiber, or buy a heavier slide that can be dovetailed, or buy a newer slide that already has a dovetail. If could avoid butchering the slide, adding a fiber rod to the front sight would be considerably less expensive than the other options.

Edited June 3, 2012 by Lester Weevils

[kieefer]

Very nice

[luvmyberetta]

Thanks for the good info.

You posted some targets from shooting your Cougar and you could probably benefit from a bushing's enhanced accuracy. My shooting is good enough to hit paper but thats about it. About the same scattershot on all the pistols, and the stock 92 groups a little tighter than most pistols in my hand. A bushing wouldn't benefit me.

Main things lately considered re 92 mutilation--

-- Maybe try to make some real thin aluminum grips to get a little better reach. As best can tell internet searching, none of the beretta grips are "remarkably thin" like those CZ Custom CZ75 aluminum grips, which really are drastically thin compared to most. But one time I had the grips off one of the 92's experimentally aiming it, and the grip is "fairly fat" with no grips at all, so it might be wasted effort to bother shaving off a quarter inch of girth or whatever. One of these days keep meaning to take a 92 to the range with just duct tape temporarily over both sides to find out if thin grips would make any ergonomic difference after firing a hundred rounds. If no grips at all (except duct tape to keep stuff from falling out) made no improvement, then obviously it would be a silly exercise to try to make thin grips.

-- A couple of folks have drilled out their front sights for fiber optic rods. It is a fascinating possibility. The neatest looking job, one guy cut a slot in the sight wide enough to hold a fiber optic rod and dressed the rod against the profile of the front sight so that it looked very good. You get better light collection if the top of the rod can get light. Was thinking that maybe a good experimental practice platform would be to order a replacement factory front sight for the Stoegar Cougar and then find out if I can successfully do the job on the Cougar without butchering it up. Thataway if I screw it up could replace the front sight with the new cougar factory part. Cutting on the 92 slide would be tragically irreversible if I botched the job. They say a standard 92FS slide doesn't have enough metal to cut a dovetail to hold a fiberoptic sight, so the options are limited to either machining the front sight to hold a fiber, or buy a heavier slide that can be dovetailed, or buy a newer slide that already has a dovetail. If could avoid butchering the slide, adding a fiber rod to the front sight would be considerably less expensive than the other options.

A few guys have reported that installing Beretta Vertec grips on their 92's gave them a thinner grip. As far as sights go, it's probably best to find a slide with a dovetailed front sight or to ship it off and have it professionally drilled out and get a sight installed. A dovetailed sight will let you experiment yourself a little more without damaging a slide. Regular Beretta slides must be shipped off to have the sights swapped out. There are also some companies that make really good quality sight paint. I put Ghost Inc. paint on mine over a year ago and it's still bright & works very well. I'll never put out money for Trijicons again.

I would love to get a conical bushing for my 8045 Cougar, but as far as I know they can't install them in a Cougar. You must have a barrel that's longer than the slide and the long L.A.P.D. Cougar barrels are too hard to locate and too expensive when you do find them. On a good day, I can overlap bullet holes at 15 feet free standing. The target below was at 20 feet with my Cougar. I had a few flyers from trying to practice a quick mag change & anticipated it early, but I don't think it was too bad. After adding on some custom grips, I can do a little better now. The bottom pic is what the Cougar looks like now with the custom grips added.