Zimmerman Trial Updates - Ongoing

[gregintenn]

Greg, if Zimmerman was a mall ninja, maybe I might agree, but this was in a neighborhood that Zimmerman was the local and Martin wasn't

and Martin looked suspicious to him. When all the voids in the scenario become clear and someone can prove Zimmerman started a fight

to kill Martin, I will be the first to say I am wrong. I doubt it happens.

I'm not trying to defending Martin, nor am I saying you're wrong. I'm simply stating that this might not be as cut and dried as some here seem to want to believe. I'm not sure there isn't some guilt from both sides. I'm also not sure there is. What would you do if someone was following you around at night. I wouldn't care for it at all.

[TMF]

I agree!

I don't believe we will ever know the facts of this incident. At this point, I don't have an opinion of whether or not Zimmerman is guilty. I do know that if I were walking around at night, and a mall ninja type fella kept following me, there'd soon be a confrontation. I expect everyone here feels pretty much the same way.

I wouldn't have an opinion either if it weren't for my own prejudices. The first time I heard about this story my prejudices caused my opinion to be in favor of Zimmerman... this was based on the headline "White man not charged for shooting unarmed black teen". A headline like that makes me believe two things: The media is trolling for readers and there must be more to the story. When I heard the 911 tape I went in the other direction. I think the SA was able to find evidence that points to criminal liability, otherwise we're in for a 10 minute deliberation when the jury goes to decide.

I think the jury will have a pretty good idea what led to his incident once everything is laid out for them. I don't think prosecution will attempt to argue that Zimmerman was NOT in fear for his life at the time he shot Martin. If their entire case revolves around whether he used reasonable force at the time he defended himself then Zimmerman will walk. This, I believe, is why the original DA wouldn't press charges. So it is logical for me to assume that the prosecution now has evidence regarding events that led up to the shooting that implicates criminal wrongdoing or intent. Otherwise the prosecution is in for an epic embarrassment. Considering these lawyers understand the law and the goings on of court cases much better than I, it causes me to believe there is a lot more going on here than a guy shooting another guy who launched an unprovoked attack.

Or maybe there are groupings of professional lawyers out there that are that stupid, I dunno. It doesn't seem logical though.

[bubbiesdad]

Exactly. And that’s what’s driving my opinion. The difference is if it was you or I a gun would have been in our hand and Zimmerman would have backed away or went for his gun and got shot.

Martin used the only thing he had available to him; and it cost him his life.

The only law I’m aware of that has to do with drawing a weapon is aggravated assault. I’m not aware of any law that says I can’t have a weapon in my hand. We would find out because if it escalates to the point of me unholstering a weapon, whether I point it or threaten anyone with it or not, I’m calling the Police and waiting for them to arrive.

Martin was being chased by a man with a gun, we don’t know if he saw it or not, but short of someone shooting at you, you just don’t get much more justified than that. It’s a little tough to make a justification argument in a case where the unarmed victim was shot to death and the perp is on trial for murder.

You have already stated that being followed is enough for you to feel the need to draw.

[mikegideon]

You have already stated that being followed is enough for you to feel the need to draw.

That might make ME feel the need to draw as well. Of course, once he asked me what I was doing, I would put my gun away. I refuse to believe that Zimmerman set out to kill Martin. I refuse to believe that Zimmerman attacked Martin and wasn't able to land one good lick.

[Guest 6.8 AR]

I wouldn't have an opinion either if it weren't for my own prejudices. The first time I heard about this story my prejudices caused my opinion to be in favor of Zimmerman... this was based on the headline "White man not charged for shooting unarmed black teen". A headline like that makes me believe two things: The media is trolling for readers and there must be more to the story. When I heard the 911 tape I went in the other direction. I think the SA was able to find evidence that points to criminal liability, otherwise we're in for a 10 minute deliberation when the jury goes to decide.

I think the jury will have a pretty good idea what led to his incident once everything is laid out for them. I don't think prosecution will attempt to argue that Zimmerman was NOT in fear for his life at the time he shot Martin. If their entire case revolves around whether he used reasonable force at the time he defended himself then Zimmerman will walk. This, I believe, is why the original DA wouldn't press charges. So it is logical for me to assume that the prosecution now has evidence regarding events that led up to the shooting that implicates criminal wrongdoing or intent. Otherwise the prosecution is in for an epic embarrassment. Considering these lawyers understand the law and the goings on of court cases much better than I, it causes me to believe there is a lot more going on here than a guy shooting another guy who launched an unprovoked attack.

Or maybe there are groupings of professional lawyers out there that are that stupid, I dunno. It doesn't seem logical though.

So, if they probably won't argue that he wasn't in fear for his life, what should he have done? Used his Droid to defend himself? Damn! If a gun

is not appropriate when you are in fear for your life, what is? He should walk.

The charges are bogus. The special DA is a buffoon. This case is only going to move foreward because of politics and the race card. The

only thing done right by the justice system on this case was by the original DA, and the cop recommending charges. He did his job, too.

A very prominent liberal law professor even agrees with that.

[Ebow1]

I don't think you have to like skittles, because, technically, he never did eat them.

[Guest Gwith40]

If you listen to the testimony of the state's star witness, Deedee, she claims that Martin made it back to the house. She also claims she was on the phone with Martin as he was confronted by Zimmerman. (keep in mind this statement was given some time after the incident, and in listening to the tape, she sounds coached)

However, if you take the testimony of Deedee at face value, it actually helps Zimmerman's case. Why? Because if Martin made it to the porch, he had to double back to confront Zimmerman. Recall, also, from the police report that Martin's phone was not working when the police attempted to track the calls on it. They had to charge the phone and then found it was password locked. Kind of convenient for the phone to happen to die right around that time.

Early on, Martin's mom claimed "that man killed trayvon on the porch". Clearly, that isn't true, but again, it sounds like Martin made it back to the house, which he could have easily done, and returned to confront Zimmerman.

Thus far, everything appears consistent with what Zimmerman told investigators.

Unfortunatley, much of what the public believes about this case originated in the false media narratives that started early on. There are still people on this site that believe Zimmerman's father was a judge.

This case reminds me of several other sensational cases that turned out to be false. Think of Richard Jewell, The Tawana Brawley case, The Duke Lacrosse case. If you listen to Alan Dershowitz explain what is required in an affidavit, it is hard not to conclude that Angela Corey has committed some serious ethical violations in this case. It is very, very clear that the prosecution left known information out of the charging document. I am not going to hold my breath waiting on the state of Florida to punish Corey but it should happen.

[Guest profgunner]

Having reviewed most of the information in the public domain, I offer the following scenerio. Zimmerman initiated the original contact by confronting Martin, who fit the profile of individuals (read young, black males) recently discovered committing acts of vandalism in the neighborhood. Martin, possibly (probably?) toking on a doobie at the time, retreated into the shadows in an attempt to avoid further scrutiny. Zimmerman called the cops at this point and is advised not to follow Martin. Ignoring this advice, Zimmerman follows Martin into the shadows and attemps to further question him about his activities. Martin decides that he is not going to take this and proceeds to whip Zimmerman's a*s. Zimmerman, getting the worst of it, pulls out the KelTec and fires one round into Martin's chest. Game over.

-Steve

[Guest profgunner]

Having reviewed most of the information in the public domain, I offer the following scenerio. Zimmerman initiated the original contact by confronting Martin, who fit the profile of individuals (read young, black males) recently discovered committing acts of vandalism in the neighborhood. Martin, possibly (probably?) toking on a doobie at the time, retreated into the shadows in an attempt to avoid further scrutiny. Zimmerman called the cops at this point and is advised not to follow Martin. Ignoring this advice, Zimmerman follows Martin into the shadows and attemps to further question him about his activities. Martin decides that he is not going to take this, steps to Zimmerman, and proceeds to whip his a*s. Zimmerman, getting the worst of it, pulls out the KelTec and fires one round into Martin's chest. Game over.

-Steve

[mikegideon]

Burglaries, not vandalism, right? Martin's THC levels were too low for him to be high. At least hours since he partook. I don't believe Zimmerman had any contact before the call to the cops on the non-emergency number.

[Guest profgunner]

Burglaries, not vandalism, right? Martin's THC levels were too low for him to be high. At least hours since he partook. I don't believe Zimmerman had any contact before the call to the cops on the non-emergency number.

I think you are right about the burglaries. As for THC levels, I am not speculating that Martin was high, just that he may have been smoking a joint when the first encounter happened. This would probably have caused him to initially move away from Zimmerman (wonder if they discovered a roach in the grass? and I'm not sure how elevated the THC levels would be if he died minutes after smoking). As for the call, I think you are correct in that it went out to emergency number and not the police dispatcher. Edited May 21, 2012 by profgunner

[mikegideon]

It had been hours since Trayvon had any pot. THC levels spike in the bloodstream, and then descrease with a half life. It's somewhat predictable. His blood levels were low, below legal impairment levels (where they have them). He called police dispatch on the NON-emergency number. Witnesses called 911. Z never did.

[RobertNashville]

After all the evidence is finally examined, I believe the charges against Zimmerman will be dismissed because there was insufficient evidence to sustain them in the first place and that the prosecutor will be investigated for misconduct by bringing those charges and by withholding exculpatory evidence. Almost since the charges were filed this has smelled like another "Duke Lacrosse Team" case - as more evidence has come out, the smell has become almost overwhelming.

If this prosecutor is violating FL's laws and/or acting out of political pressure or on a personal vendetta then I hope she winds up just like Mike Nifong (Duke prosecutor).

[TMF]

So, if they probably won't argue that he wasn't in fear for his life, what should he have done? Used his Droid to defend himself? Damn! If a gun

is not appropriate when you are in fear for your life, what is? He should walk.

I'm actually agreeing with you in regards to the prosecution's inability to prove, beyond a reasonable doubt, that Zimmerman was not in fear of his life. It would be difficult, if not impossible, to get a jury to all agree beyond a reasonable doubt that getting your head slammed repeatedly into the pavement wouldn't make someone fear for their life. There must be some evidence we don't know about. Otherwise these would be the dumbest people in their profession.

It hurts my delicate sensibilities that you didn't read my post and understand what I was saying. One more like that and I'm crawling into a bottle of Jack.

[Guest 6.8 AR]

I knew you were. I imagine the only evidence we don't really have a grasp on is stuff that will be ruled as

in-admissable anyway. If a jury hears this, and I doubt they will, the only ones it won't end well for, are the

race baiters. Their so-called cause will be set back decades. Good thing because their cause is rotten to

the core, anyway. Angela Corey has already proven herself to be incompetent. Her affidavit was a joke

and may get her in trouble. That's what we get when we allow racist baiting bastards of society to make

the narrative up as they go. The state of Florida fell prey to it, also. There are some things that shouldn't

be tolerated.

[RichardR]

I just had an interesting conversation about this very topic with my sister-in-law (she's 27 & leans liberal on most things) anyway she automatically took up the "evil white guy hunts down and kills an innocent unarmed black kid" mantra that the media played up.

After explaining to her about how in reality this wasn't a racial incident (ie; Zimmerman was hispanic & that he couldn't provide a solid racial description to the police dispatcher in the tapes) her opinion seemed to change to a more reasonable one.

She still thinks that the kid was some how justified in attacking Zimmerman for following him, but she did admit that if someone was violently smashing her head against concrete that she probably would have shot them in self-defense too.

[mcurrier]

Developing -

POLL: 40% Now Say Trayvon Martin Shot in Self-Defense; 24% Say It Was Murder… Developing…

Article and video news report -

http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/lifestyle/general_lifestyle/may_2012/40_now_say_trayvon_martin_shot_in_self_defense_24_say_it_was_murder

[mcurrier]

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[RobertNashville]

POLL: 40% Now Say Trayvon Martin Shot in Self-Defense; 24% Say It Was Murder… Developing…

While I've tended to believe Zimmerman's version of events, most of what I've said in the various Zimmerman/Martin threads is that there shouldn't be a rush to judgment because we weren't there and we have so few facts as I indicated here:

...The only thing I'm "predisposed" to do is not snap to ANY judgment about anybody's guilt or innocence. You weren't there...I wasn't there...the 911 operator wasn't there but I'm fairly certain that if the DA feels he has enough evidence to get a conviction he'll proceed with charges; if he doesn't then I suppose I'm predisposed to think that the shooting was justified.

To be sure, I wasn't the only one warning people not to rush to judgment. In any case, that didn't stop some from declaring who was guilty and who was innocent (mostly coming down on the side of Martin) - then again, I suppose some always will rush to judgment no matter what!

I think we now see that as actual evidence and facts start to come to light people's views seem to be changing.

Edited May 22, 2012 by RobertNashville

[mikegideon]

The main thing we should take away from this... the media can't be trusted to deliver unbiased news. I had a personal interest in watching this case and digging for facts, because it could effect gun laws. You're average Joe just swallowed the media's crap.

[TMF]

To be sure, I wasn't the only one warning people not to rush to judgment. In any case, that didn't stop some from declaring who was guilty and who was innocent (mostly coming down on the side of Martin) - then again, I suppose some always will rush to judgment no matter what!

I think we now see that as actual evidence and facts start to come to light people's views seem to be changing.

Just so I understand, its okay to rush to judgement that Martin was a punk kid that had it coming but it's not okay to rush to judgement that Zimmerman was an overzealous wanna-be? "Most" folks on this thread believe that Zimmerman is innocent of criminal wrongdoing. There are only a few of us that don't think he is. Believe what you want but it goes both ways.

[mikegideon]

Just so I understand, its okay to rush to judgement that Martin was a punk kid that had it coming but it's not okay to rush to judgement that Zimmerman was an overzealous wanna-be? "Most" folks on this thread believe that Zimmerman is innocent of criminal wrongdoing. There are only a few of us that don't think he is. Believe what you want but it goes both ways.

Most of us believe that the jury is still out. We also believe that the media intentionally distorted the whole thing, and the race baiters piled on. The anti's believe Zimmerman is guilty, because NOBODY should be allowed to carry a gun.

The polls speak for themselves, after a lot of the evidence has managed to sneak past the media filters.

That's the way I see it.

And By the Way... Martin didn't just have the hoodie. He had the grill, the middle fingers on Facebook, the burglary tools, the minor drug issues, etc. He was a thug in training, that was allowed to graduate early. I'm not sure of Zimmerman's guilt, but I AM sure of that.

Edited May 22, 2012 by mikegideon

[Caster]

I ain't been following this, but I am curious: How long till we get a verdict? Days? Weeks?

Who's taking bets on riots if he's acquitted?

[mikegideon]

I'm guessing it won't go to trial until after Skankosaurus is reelected. Looks like the plan, anyway.

[Caster]

I'm guessing it won't go to trial until after Skankosaurus is reelected. Looks like the plan, anyway.

That makes sense. If he gets reelected, they'll hang the guy. If he doesn't they let him go, start a bunch of riots and blame the new president. Got it!