Carmike Thoroughbred 20 Posted

[Viracnis]

I usually only do business with Shadybrook Cinemas in Columbia for my Moviegoing needs (when the wife doesn't fall for the "We'll just rent one on Pay Per View and stay in.") as they've got better service, friendlier staff and a cleaner theatre (this concludes the shameless plug for a good local business).

A friend Fandango'd some tickets for Carmike Thoroughbred 20 tonight for a 7:00 showing of the new Avengers movie and I'm wondering if anyone has been there recently and can tell me if they're properly posted? The idea of leaving the .45 in the car has very little appeal to me and I'd hate to drive all the way out there just to drive back to drop the gun off.

- Bob

[Hoghead]

I was there a few weeks ago and am pretty sure they are not posted at least not at the front door that I went in. I looked for it, but didn't see it. I was a little shocked, because it seems like most theaters are posted.

[daddyo]

It's never been posted as long as I've been going there.

If they didn't post after someone left their handgun in one of the seats back a couple of years ago, I doubt they will.

Edited May 11, 2012 by DaddyO

[daddyo]

.

Edited May 11, 2012 by DaddyO

[monkeylizard]

They are not posted.

Can a mod change the title to have a question mark? Just scrolling through the threads made me think they had just posted.

Edited May 11, 2012 by monkeylizard

[JayC]

Movie theaters are still in business? I figured the all went out of business when blockbuster went under... Much easier and cheaper to watch movies at home... And no worries about being posted.

[daddyo]

Movie theaters are still in business? I figured the all went out of business when blockbuster went under... Much easier and cheaper to watch movies at home... And no worries about being posted.

This. Neither do you have to deal with inconsiderate boobs who play with their cell phones, talk all through the film, and kick the back of your seat.

Oh, and don't get me started on people bringing infants and small children to see an R-rated flick....

[Viracnis]

Everyone above was correct. They were not posted with a gunbuster. They did have a popcorn buster, though! No outside food or drinks, but outside .45s are A-OK, as it should be. Thanks everyone for the replies.

And sorry about the lack of a "?" in the thread title. I'd have sworn I had one, but when I hit submit I noticed it was gone. Tried to change it, but too late then.

I've had some bad experiences with Carmike, so I was really surprised to have had a pleasant evening - except for the guy next to me pouring whiskey into his fountain drink (he was kind enough to offer to those around him before getting kicked out) and the couple behind me getting frisky under a blanket.

[JAB]

This. Neither do you have to deal with inconsiderate boobs who play with their cell phones, talk all through the film, and kick the back of your seat.

Oh, and don't get me started on people bringing infants and small children to see an R-rated flick....

Since the OP question seems to be answered, I will throw in this off topic comment:

When I was a kid I couldn't understand why my dad didn't like going to movie theaters. He'd go to drive-ins, sometimes, but I never saw a movie in an actual theater with him. Now that I am forty I am glad that there are still a few drive-ins left. Of course, they depend on the weather cooperating, etc. but I can see a movie at a drive-in, get something of the big screen experience and not have to worry about posting, etc. In fact, I can have a loaded shotgun in the back seat if I want (not that I do, necessarily - just that I could) and I don't have to worry much about rude/annoying people sitting beside or behind me. I just hope my favorite drive-in (Midway Drive-In in Athens) can stay open. They are still using projector film and either have to convert to digital this year or shut down as the movie studios will no longer be distributing movies on actual film.

All that said, there are still some movies that just cry out for the 'theater' experience - the sound, the immersion in the movie and just the overall ambiance. For those, I try to wait until the second or third week they are out so that the theater won't be quite so crowded.

Edited May 15, 2012 by JAB

[wtl]

Thoroughbred has this posted at the ticket booth. My wife pointed it out this evening. Doesn't seem to meet the requirements but I took my sidearm to the car anyway.


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[wtl]

Sorry for the second post on this 1+ year old thread, but I really didn't feel comfortable opening a new thread with so many existing threads discussing "properly posted".

 

However, being new to CC I would like to get some feedback on the above sign. Having read the statute it seems to me it doesn't come close to being properly posted. It should be a gunbuster sign or reference the statute directly or at least mention Tennessee law, and be worded similarly to the example in the statute. Additionally the statute seems to require it be posted at the entrance, and this sign is at the ticket booth inside. There are smoking buster and outside food/drink buster signs on the entrances, but no gun busters.

 

I've also seen a lawyer here suggest you don't carry past ANY sign, whether properly posted or not.

 

I figure if a business owner is really serious about not allowing legal CC, he/she should/will figure out how to properly post.

 

I'm heading to thoroughbred tonight to catch a movie with my daughter, and am trying to decide whether or not to carry.

 

I sorta agree with some who feel there are businesses which post improperly to discourage hoodlums with weapons, but maybe aren't really trying to prevent legal CC.

Edited July 25, 2013 by wtl

[Oh Shoot]

 

 

However, being new to CC I would like to get some feedback on the above sign. Having read the statute it seems to me it doesn't come close to being properly posted. It should be a gunbuster sign or reference the statute directly or at least mention Tennessee law, and be worded similarly to the example in the statute. Additionally the statute seems to require it be posted at the entrance, and this sign is at the ticket booth inside. There are smoking buster and outside food/drink buster signs on the entrances, but no gun busters.

 

The fact is there is no definitive answer.

 

First, we can't find an actual case of a TN permit holder convicted of a 1359 violation period.

 

But unless decided by case law one way or the other, the validity of being convicted for carrying past a statutorily non-conforming sign is simply conjecture. There is nothing in the statute that says the sign must be compliant for you to be found guilty, and there's certainly no penalty for the business to do it.

 

Contrast this with the carry in federal buildings statute, where indeed it does state that you can't be convicted if signs are not posted conspicuously at all public entrances.

 

Another important precedent awaits also, as 1352 says that your permit will be suspended or revoked for a conviction of 1359, so it's not just the 500 clams and conviction of a Class B misdemeanor at stake should it happen.

 

- OS

Edited July 26, 2013 by Oh Shoot

[wtl]

Thanks--good info to consider! I did not carry this evening (didn't get your response until after, but decided until I am confident I have a handle on the regs I won't carry past any sign--too new to this to be the reason case law gets established.)

 

39-17-1359-c(1) says "It is an offense to possess a weapon in a building or on property that is properly posted in accordance with this section."

 

To me, the plain reading of the above would suggest there is no offense if the property isn't properly posted, and section b seems pretty clear on the requirements. I'm no lawyer but I don't see how anyone could be successfully prosecuted without the sign meeting those conditions, and this particular sign in no way meets them.

 

That said, I'm not interested in being the test case either.

Edited July 26, 2013 by wtl

[Oh Shoot]

....

39-17-1359-c(1) says "It is an offense to possess a weapon in a building or on property that is properly posted in accordance with this section."

 

To me, the plain reading of the above would suggest there is no offense if the property isn't properly posted, and section b seems pretty clear on the requirements. I'm no lawyer but I don't see how anyone could be successfully prosecuted without the sign meeting those conditions, and this particular sign in no way meets them.

 

Yep, that's the logical assumption, but would be nice if it also said that it's not an offense if posting is improper. Remember, we have an AG opinion that says you can still be found guilty of park carry even if a prohibited park isn't posted at all, let alone merely improperly. And that's a Class A 'meanor, for c'sakes!

 

- OS

[RobertNashville]

It was my understanding that all Carmike cinemas had a no firearms "policy"; properly posted or not.

 

However, the only problems I've ever herd of were with those who openly carried; not a terribly smart move in a place with such a policy and given the fairly recent movie theater shooting in Aurora (now all the pro OC folks don't get excited; I occasionally OC but definitely not in a place where there is a no firearms policy!).

 

I rarely go to movies anymore...usually wait for them to hit DirectTV, Netflix and/or Amazon but when I do go to a movie I try to find a theater that isn't posted' legally or otherwise.

[sschrick]

as some others on this forum have mentioned before. . .concealed means concealed.

 

not saying I agree or disagree with this statement, just forwarding on the comments of others.

 

decision is up to you.

[Guest 270win]

This is why we need to get the legislature to remove criminal penalties for permit holders carrying past signs, in local parks, and schools.  Simple fix that would help the honest person with a permit.

[monkeylizard]

Additionally the statute seems to require it be posted at the entrance, and this sign is at the ticket booth inside.

 

That would be incorrect.

From TCA 39-17-1359

 

 

(b )  (1) Notice of the prohibition permitted by subsection (a ) shall be accomplished by displaying one (1) or both of the notices described in subdivision (b )(3) in prominent locations, including all entrances primarily used by persons entering the property, building, or portion of the property or building where weapon possession is prohibited. Either form of notice used shall be of a size that is plainly visible to the average person entering the building, property, or portion of the building or property, posted.

 

In the case of Thoroughbred, you could legally carry through the front doors, but not beyond the ticket booth, assuming the content of their posting would hold up under a 39-17-1359 challenge. If the content wouldn't hold up, the sign might as well say "have a nice day". We won't know until it hits a court case, and so far there haven't been any volunteers.

Edited July 26, 2013 by monkeylizard

[JayC]

Oh there have been lots of volunteers, just no DA willing to risk a career ending move...  So far we're only aware of 2 people being charged with violating 1359 both of which were caught attempting to get into the secure area of an airport (TSA caught them with a weapon in the carry on).

 

I've not seen a single case documented where anybody has been convicted under 1359 anywhere in the state...  So, unless you're trying to board a plane or you're a complete idiot try to cause trouble, the chances of getting charged under 1359 doesn't appear to be very high.

 

 

That would be incorrect.

From TCA 39-17-1359

 

 

 

In the case of Thoroughbred, you could legally carry through the front doors, but not beyond the ticket booth, assuming the content of their posting would hold up under a 39-17-1359 challenge. If the content wouldn't hold up, the sign might as well say "have a nice day". We won't know until it hits a court case, and so far there haven't been any volunteers.

 

[djerdl]

I noticed the same sign the last time I went there. The girlfriend pointed it out (under the guise of the searching bags section). I just shrugged, and we went on our way. I've always felt these signs are a way for businesses to straddle the fence, appearing to appease both sides. Meh, I probably won't go back there any time soon, since I don't go to the movies all that often, but I do think it's a shame to see these kinds of postings popping up.

[RobertNashville]

Oh there have been lots of volunteers, just no DA willing to risk a career ending move...  So far we're only aware of 2 people being charged with violating 1359 both of which were caught attempting to get into the secure area of an airport (TSA caught them with a weapon in the carry on).

 

I've not seen a single case documented where anybody has been convicted under 1359 anywhere in the state...  So, unless you're trying to board a plane or you're a complete idiot try to cause trouble, the chances of getting charged under 1359 doesn't appear to be very high.

Hard to tell much from those two cases or the lack of any other.

 

I don't know of any HCP holder that would willingly risk (even if it's a small risk) getting charged with the violation (and possibly losing their HCP) just to prove a point when all that's usually needed to end the "confrontation" is to leave the premises and/or secure they weapon in the person's vehicle.  The unfortunate thing is that it leaves the HCP holder in a perpetual state of uncertainty and in somewhat of a moral dilemma.

 

We know it's "illegal" to carry past a properly posted sign and the firearm community so often likes to refer to itself as being "law-abiding" citizens.  There is also a large or at least vocal segment of the firearms community in Tennessee (judging by the vocally animated "parking lot" discussions here on TGO) who carry banner of "property rights" on behalf of not just private but business property as well.

 

Given we are law-abiding citizens and claim to value property rights, how then can an HCP holder justify ever carrying past a sign or even just carrying on a property, posted or not, if you know that the property owner doesn't allow firearms on the property?

[JayC]

Robert,

 

You're preaching to the choir on this one....  I don't spend money at businesses that post even if it's not a legal posting, period.  They've made it clear to me they don't care about my safety, and I shouldn't encourage them to stay in business.

 

I also don't buy into the business owners are smart they purposely post signs that aren't legal BS either...  I'm a business owner, and I meet with other business owners all the time and they don't know *anything* about firearm laws unless they're HCP holders and often they still don't know anything about firearm laws ;)  If a business has taken the time to post a no firearms allowed sign they think it legally prevents you from carrying on their property, and you're in complete denial to think otherwise.

 

The one exception to this is some of the well crafted that state "No firearms except in accordance with state law" or something to that effect...  that is a properly crafted sheeple sign :)

 

But none of that changes the fact that 1359 is rarely enforced and we spend way too much time worrying about it on the forums :)  Instead of the parking lots bill part 2 we should be focused on removing government property and land from 1359, because that is the one entity none of us can avoid doing "business" with and they don't have the right to prohibit law abiding citizens from carrying.

 

Hard to tell much from those two cases or the lack of any other.

 

I don't know of any HCP holder that would willingly risk (even if it's a small risk) getting charged with the violation (and possibly losing their HCP) just to prove a point when all that's usually needed to end the "confrontation" is to leave the premises and/or secure they weapon in the person's vehicle.  The unfortunate thing is that it leaves the HCP holder in a perpetual state of uncertainty and in somewhat of a moral dilemma.

 

We know it's "illegal" to carry past a properly posted sign and the firearm community so often likes to refer to itself as being "law-abiding" citizens.  There is also a large or at least vocal segment of the firearms community in Tennessee (judging by the vocally animated "parking lot" discussions here on TGO) who carry banner of "property rights" on behalf of not just private but business property as well.

 

Given we are law-abiding citizens and claim to value property rights, how then can an HCP holder justify ever carrying past a sign or even just carrying on a property, posted or not, if you know that the property owner doesn't allow firearms on the property?

 

[Oh Shoot]

...we should be focused on removing government property and land from 1359, because that is the one entity none of us can avoid doing "business" with and they don't have the right to prohibit law abiding citizens from carrying.

 

Yep, fact that we can't carry on "our own" state and federal property is as glaring a 2A infringement as any.

 

- OS

[JayC]

I agree, I can't enjoy city parks here in Nashville, or go into a city community center because it's posted...  State, county, and city property should not be able to post except in the cases of courtrooms, and areas that regularly house prisoners.  Outside of those 2 exceptions we should remove the ability for any government entity to post in TN.

 

Yep, fact that we can't carry on "our own" state and federal property is as glaring a 2A infringement as any.

 

- OS

[Guest tdoccrossvilletn]

Since the OP question seems to be answered, I will throw in this off topic comment:



When I was a kid I couldn't understand why my dad didn't like going to movie theaters. He'd go to drive-ins, sometimes, but I never saw a movie in an actual theater with him. Now that I am forty I am glad that there are still a few drive-ins left. Of course, they depend on the weather cooperating, etc. but I can see a movie at a drive-in, get something of the big screen experience and not have to worry about posting, etc. In fact, I can have a loaded shotgun in the back seat if I want (not that I do, necessarily - just that I could) and I don't have to worry much about rude/annoying people sitting beside or behind me. I just hope my favorite drive-in (Midway Drive-In in Athens) can stay open. They are still using projector film and either have to convert to digital this year or shut down as the movie studios will no longer be distributing movies on actual film.



All that said, there are still some movies that just cry out for the 'theater' experience - the sound, the immersion in the movie and just the overall ambiance. For those, I try to wait until the second or third week they are out so that the theater won't be quite so crowded.

I thought midway was in or on the out skirts of etowah

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