Handloads in your carry gun

[DaveS]

I researched and didn't find anything. How many carry "handloads" in their carry weapon and what bullet? I've heard this was a "no-no".

Opinions?

[Guest kcb37]

I do not, but the reason it's a "no no" is because factory loads are more precise, etc... Basically you are more likely to have a bad round with one loaded yourself.

I'm sure some are doing it, really nothing wrong with it, either way you can have a bad round.

[Guest Travtastik]

I always carry factory ammo. If I have to use it I don't want the chance of hearing "he loaded the rounds with the intent to kill someone" said in a court room. I also try not use anything that is labeled for LE/military use.

[Patton]

If you are on trial, the last thing you want to do is look like a "Gun Nut" to a jury. I don't want it to be brought up that I loaded up some of my own recipe of man killers. I've had a defense attorney say if he can argue the defendant used the same gun, caliber, and ammo the police use to protect citizens, it carries a lot of weight.

[Jonnin]

seems to be internet rumor. Everyone says it can get you into trouble, but no one has an actual case where it mattered. There are a few cases where it was mentioned, but a deciding factor between a clean shoot and some sort of "overkill" or "excessive force"? Nothing seems to exist.

I am tempted. I made some 9mm with a 380 hollowpoint pushed as hot as I was willing to go, but never loaded them for carry. I also made some 223 hollowpoints to mix in with all the FMJ rounds, just to mix it up, but that is home defense not carry really (I did put some in the mag). I made some makarov to carry as well. Never made enough to test enough to satisfy myself about using them though. Was more to get my feet wet making hot loads than anything else.

[DaveS]

Same thing I'm hearing. Bad guys lawyer will swear you loaded elephant rounds in your handgun. I have carried handloads, and not afraid to do so, as (knock on wood) I've never had a "bad" round. It's good to hear these different opinions.

[Patton]

Well, your not going to get charged because you had reloads in your firearm, but you better believe a juror will hear that you loaded up your own hot, deadly ammo. If I ever have to use deadly force for whatever reason I want to make every single juror believe I am just like them. This is what defense attorneys try to translate to the jury. What percentage of jurors reload? What percentage of them have bought ammo at Walmart?

[Lumber_Jack]

I load Hornady XTP for hunting rounds in 41 mag. But it doesn't seem economical for Self defense loads. $40 can load 2 hi cap mags and be done with it.

[lshel]

I handload most all pistol calibers, but carry factory ammunition in carry guns. I use reloads for practice firing and for hunting and animal predators.

[DaveS]

I'm using (handload wise) 200 grain XTP in .45 ACP, and commercial ammo is (for occasional carry) is Hornady45 Auto +P 200gr TAP FPD. My handloads are not nearly as powerful as the factory ammo.

[Guest 6.8 AR]

I do not, but the reason it's a "no no" is because factory loads are more precise, etc... Basically you are more likely to have a bad round with one loaded yourself.

I'm sure some are doing it, really nothing wrong with it, either way you can have a bad round.

Do you have any data to back that up? Only reason I ask is that of the close to ten thousand rounds I've loaded,

I have had two squibs and maybe two or three FTF in .45ACP. I have had Federal Hydrashocks and their Hi-Shock

hollow points, one or two each, FTF. My failures were when I just started loading .45ACP. None since then.

[Guest 6.8 AR]

Mine are the same or hotter than factory ammo.

[nightrunner]

If you have a hotter or "more effective" recipe, what to keep you from shooting the factory loads and reloading that brass with your recipe and keeping your mouth shut about it and claiming it was the factory load that you used?

[Dolomite_supafly]

DLM37015 will give you his experience regarding this. He used to carry handloads and when asked he said you will get sued over it. He said he has been there and got the t-shirt to prove it.

He now carries commercial ammo and keeps the specific box it came from in his safe.

I have carried handloads in the past but never will again. My particular handloads would have raised eyebrows out of my 9mm Glock. They were 147 grain HP's at 1,200 fps.

Dolomite

[daddyo]

I don't reload, but even if I did, I'd still carry factory ammo in my carry weapon.

Somehow I think a prosecutor would be bringing SAMMI specs into it if I were ever charged with homicide in a SD case.

[DaveS]

All good things to think about!

[DaveTN]

I don’t reload, but wouldn’t carry hand loads if I did. It’s considered a bad thing because of reliability, not lawsuits.

Someone will have to show me a criminal case that was filed in this state based on ammo. If I’m justified in shooting someone, I’m justified whether I used a .22 or a .50 cal.

If you find yourself in a criminal trial, chances are you have bigger problems than ammo.

Civil cases are a whole different story. But you can be sued civilly for anything. In Tennessee if you haven’t already been through a criminal trial the court is supposed to look at whether or not you were justified in the use of deadly force. If your justified it should end there, if you weren’t it will become a free for all.

[Jonnin]

If you have a hotter or "more effective" recipe, what to keep you from shooting the factory loads and reloading that brass with your recipe and keeping your mouth shut about it and claiming it was the factory load that you used?

Duhuh. I got it at a gun show, I think. I do not remember.

[JPS]

seems to be internet rumor. Everyone says it can get you into trouble, but no one has an actual case where it mattered. There are a few cases where it was mentioned, but a deciding factor between a clean shoot and some sort of "overkill" or "excessive force"? Nothing seems to exist.

Statistically there may not be many cases where this was an issue, but I sure don't want to be the 'lucky' guy to beat the odds. Stock, off-the-shelf personal defense ammo is all that goes into my carry guns. I will also NOT be carrying Zombie rounds, or putting Punisher grips on my 1911 - for the same reasons.

(I REALLY wanted a Batman back-plate for my Glock, but I passed that up too.)

Edited May 8, 2012 by JPS

[Guest Lester Weevils]

I'd be concerned re jury implications of handloads regardless whether it may be urban legend. No accounting for the average person's attitudes, and if lucky you get average persons on juries. From my limited experience serving jury duty, have wondered if the jury selection process tends to pick sub-average persons? Wondered maybe a person would be very lucky just to be judged by 12 average people? When I did jury duty it seemed the best potential above-average jurors were intelligent housewives and retirees who don't have to worry about missing work, plus the employees of selected big corporations who pay employees to do their duty in spite of a dollar a day jury pay.

Then the lawyers take an already-compromised jury pool and challenge any person who might accidentally have any scrap of relevant knowledge on whatever the case might involve. Sole proprietors and expert professionals who have real-world responsibilities can usually beg off the jury duty because of financial hardship or hardship to people who depend on such folk working their real job. The pool seemed weighted toward people who don't have anything better to do than get roped into a long drawn out criminal trial, and then the lawyers filter out anyone who might have a lick of sense. When I did jury duty was working nights so could afford to do it without losing money (but it wasn't very good about losing sleep). It seemed fairly easy to avoid the trials which might last forever or sequester juries where I would miss work for weeks or months.

If there did happen to be a reloader or carry permit holder or "gun enthusiast" in the pool, then such folk would most likely be dismissed from a self-defense case, unless such persons would want to be on the jury bad enough to answer lawyer questions deceptively, or if the lawyers are not "on the ball" that day. Seems vanishingly unlikely there would be any person especially knowledgable or sympathetic in what is left over after the jury interviews and challenges.

So anyway my reloads always go bang and seem accurate. I'd not worry about carrying them, except the possible jury implications if reloads actually ever had to be used for defense. Which hopefully will never happen.

Am not expert on ammo, but the main "impressive" factory ammo I've tested was some Corbon. Maybe there are other factory loads equally impressive because I haven't tested lots and lots of different defense ammo. A few other defense rounds I've measured, have velocity I could duplicate in that bullet weight while staying within the bounds of reloading book data. But some Corbon rounds chrono at velocity that seems nearly impossible to match while staying within the confines of reloading book data. So Corbon either uses special brass, or special powder, or other special tricks? Corbon probably does not irresponsibly sell radically-overpressure "potentially dangerous" loads. Just thinking, if a knowledgable reloader was on the jury and heard that Corbon was in the defense gun, maybe the juror would think, "Man, you really didn't want anybody to walk away from that! You could have cut the criminal some slack and shot him with reloads." IOW, the opposite reaction to what a typical man-on-the-street would think re factory ammo vs reloads.

I've asked before, whether typical consumer defense ammo is any way water-proofed? I don't see any indication that most defense ammo I've bought had visible water proof treatment around the bullet or primer. But maybe I don't know what to look for. If defense ammo is typically better sealed against weather, it would seem a practical point in favor of such factory ammo?

Edited May 8, 2012 by Lester Weevils

[gun sane]

Call me naive, but I can't imagine that a case would be decided by what kind of ammo a person used irregardless of other facts. "Well, sure the decedent was sticking up the convenience store and pointed his gun at the defendant, who drew his permitted pistol, ordered the decedent to drop his gun and dodged three bullets himself before firing in self defense. But he handloaded his own ammunition, thus ensuring that the decedent would be deader than factory made rounds."

[Patton]

Call me naive, but I can't imagine that a case would be decided by what kind of ammo a person used irregardless of other facts. "Well, sure the decedent was sticking up the convenience store and pointed his gun at the defendant, who drew his permitted pistol, ordered the decedent to drop his gun and dodged three bullets himself before firing in self defense. But he handloaded his own ammunition, thus ensuring that the decedent would be deader than factory made rounds."

Do you reall think you wil end up in such a perfect played out scenario? In less you hit a innocent bystander your good in that situation but think of George Zimmerman. People already think he is a vigilant, if it came out that he loaded up the bullet that killed Travone would it seam like maybe he was living for the moment to kill someone. I shoot my 38spl reloads better than any of the factory loads I've ver come across but it's not worth it for taking a chance.

[DWARREN123]

No data to support not carrying hand loads/reloads as SD/HD ammo. I carry hand loaded ammo in my carry gun. I use Speer Gold Dots.

I have had more bad factory ammo than reloads so I do not think that holds water either.

Just my opinions.