Any serious paper patchers?

[Caster]

I've been on again, off again getting things together to paper patch for 308. Just curious if anyone does any smokeless paper patching.

[gjohnsoniv]

What is paper patching?

[Westwindmike]

I tried it on 45-70, but it was too frustrating to cut the patches. Shot good though!

[Caster]

What is paper patching?

The worlds first jacketed bullets were paper jackets. Not copper.

Paper patching along with smokeless powder allows one to use a cast bullet at jacketed velocities. There are folks P/Ping in the 3000 fps range. You can run a dead soft bullet at 2K easy enough. After that the lead needs to be a bit harder but not for the same reasons standard cast bullets do. At high velocities soft lead will bend and deform. The nose will slump and that'll make it wobble and accuracy is out the door.

Also, there is no fouling with paper, at least not as we know it. The only fouling you get is powder fouling from the last shot. The paper will remove all traces of fouling from the previous shot. There's a two fold blessing there. An unlubricated patch will lap a rough bore to a mirror, but the unlubed patch will generate heat very quick. 10-20 rounds and accuracy suffers from heat. A lubed patch solves that.

This is a serious game, paper patching. This is one of the deepest caverns of the reloading rabbit hole and not one to take on lightly or uninformed. Thus my lingering hesitation to start said endeavor. It is by far one of the more labor intensive crafts of our hobby. In the time you take to load a thousand 223s on your Dillion, one could roll and load 50-100 PP loads. The pride and accuracy is where it's at though. There's lots of benefits. A soft lead bullet at high velocity is devastating. For any of a nefarious mind, the paper separates at the muzzle (when done proper) making the bullet virtually untraceable. That's more a bit of trivia than a bonus. I'd say one of the more fun of benefits would be the duh factor as people try to comprehend how you manged a sub MOA group at a few hundred yards, easily done if all your ducks are in a row.

[gjohnsoniv]

Didn't they talk about that in the movie "Shooter?" Thanks for answering the question though.

[gjohnsoniv]

Just read up on paper patching, really quite interesting actually. Thought it was kind of cool that one guy used a cigarette roller to wrap the bullets. Might think about this if I ever get to reload 7.62x54R .

[Caster]

Didn't they talk about that in the movie "Shooter?" Thanks for answering the question though.

Yeah but they were talking about paper patching a jacketed bullet. It can most certainly be done with ZERO loss of accuracy. You have to size the bullet down and then patch it back up. The rifling engraves on the paper, the paper presses into the bullet but the marks left are not discernible in any way unless the star ship Enterprise shows up with their computers.

I would say patching with a cigarette roller wouldn't be the best idea. The patch has to be wet when you wrap it. If not, your results will not be good. Plus it would be difficult to get the right tension in a cig machine. Somethings just can't be done any other way than by hand.

[gjohnsoniv]

Apparently he was doing it wet, but I really don't know. Said he used Sprite and then rolled them with the cig roller.

Edited April 27, 2012 by gjohnsoniv

[Lumber_Jack]

This is an interesting topic. I'm here to hear any more you might find on the topic, Caster.

[1gewehr]

Didn't they talk about that in the movie "Shooter?" Thanks for answering the question though.

Remember that was Hollywood, where they don't have to pay attention to reality. What they described in the movie would not have worked like they wanted it to.

In the early 1900's, paper-patching was the highest technology for accuracy. It was only with the introduction of long, spitzer-point jacketed bullets that paper-patching lost favor. The jacketed spitzer is more efficient at longer ranges as it loses energy more slowly than a round-nosed bullet.

Here is an interesting forum on high-velocity patched bullets:

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/forumdisplay.php?f=62

[Caster]

BUT, you can paper patch a spitzer too, soo....then again, this ain't for the normal shooter.

As far as the link you mentioned, that forum is the ABSOLUTE BEST source of info on reloading and casting the interwebz has to offer. The amount of information there is a bit daunting when you first dive in. The things some of these guys know and do will make you re-evaluate how much you think you know. I have learned MUCH from there including but certainly not limited to, the perfect lube recipe [that I now make myself, never again will I buy bullet lube] A better way to tumble lube where it goes farther and isn't sticky and paper patching.

Anyone who's interested in things I talk about NEEDS to go there and do some reading. It's the only other forum I frequent.

Edited April 27, 2012 by Caster

[Jonnin]

all I know about it is my dad's muzzle loader used paper patched perfect sphere slugs. Had a place in the stock to store the patches. I think he got away from that and used a rifled sabot (?) after the coolness of playing at davy crockett wore off. I do not remember much of that, he did not shoot the ML too often, but it stuck with me that part of the loading process was that patch.

[dlm37015]

i have a harry pope 38/55 high wall that will scare you with paper patched bullets

i also load lot fof 35 whealen with paper patched bullets

i use a very fine onion skin paper and homemade glue

caster i have some of the paper left if you need any it was made for paper patching

also gonna sell the rifle it might be the best shooting rofle i ever owned

[Caster]

Ha! I knew DLM would know what I'm talking about!

I have it on good authority that green bar printer paper works very nice too. The kind with the holes down both sides.

I have to get a proper sizing die first as the bullet must be sized to just over BORE diameter before patching. My Savage model 10PC is going to be the first to run paper. I gotta,get me some cerrosafe and take a chamber and throat casting. I think I'm going to need a .302 sizer for the bullet and a .309 sizer to siize the patched bullet. The savage should be pretty impressive, it's very accurate. I'm hoping to get a 180g cast bullet up around 2600-2700 fps. That should be devastating to hunt with.

[dlm37015]

i have a mpuld for you to try its a 300 grain .i think i still have some hearters 308 slug moulds for paper patching