Best Defensive Shotgun Ammo???

[Magiccarpetrides]

So I have been trolling around for some SHTF Self Defense shottie ammuntion probably gonna start carrying the 500 in the trunk. Was looking at this seems to be the best all around without a crazy name.

http://ammunitiontogo.com/catalog1/product_info.php?pName=50rds-12-gauge-centurion-law-enforcement-multidefense-buck

I like the idea of a small "slug" with multiple rounds of buckshot to guarantee a hit. What do the rest of you recommend?

[molonlabetn]

I've never tried it for myself to verify, but duplex loads that extreme wouldn't tend to pattern very well. I bet a duplex mix of #4 Buck and 00 Buck would work pretty well though.

For myself, I have always found that Federal Tactical loads pattern the best. I've always wanted to try some Dead Coyote HeviShot 00 Buck and T-shot...

[Magiccarpetrides]

I thought about slugs, but think that would not be a very good "crowd" control round...i can use my pistol for that kind of stuff. They have the Rhodesian Jungle that is bb's and buck...i like the .65 ball mixed in the Centurion though for knockdown power (i.e. 300+lb problems)

Might have to do a range report ;-D

Edited May 1, 2008 by Magiccarpetrides
is this necessary?

[Marswolf]

I am absolutely not suggesting that I am a shotgun expert. Other stuff? But I've always been fond of double-aught buckshot.

If I shoot it, I want it to hurt a lot or die.

[Guest 2Old]

I'd say that should work... if you shoot someone with one of those and it don't stop them, you'd better have a chunk of kryptonite with you.

[The Rabbi]

Until police got down with 00 Buck the preferred load, afaik, was #4 Buck. It is 27 pellets of .25 caliber projectile. Sort of like emptying a full 20-rd mag of 5.56Nato into someone all at the same time.

[molonlabetn]

Until police got down with 00 Buck the preferred load, afaik, was #4 Buck. It is 27 pellets of .25 caliber projectile. Sort of like emptying a full 20-rd mag of 5.56Nato into someone all at the same time.

Pretty much... I'd say more like 27 rounds of .22magnum at the same time though, considering the lower velocity.

If somebody would come up with a 2500-3000fps #4 buck load, they'd have my business! But, would probably have to reduce the number of pellets to 15 or so to keep from dislocating shoulders...

For comparison, a normal 000 Buck load is similar to discharging 8 .380acp rounds at once...

Edited May 1, 2008 by molonlabetn

[Guest darkstar]

I use the #4 buckshot. 00 is good stuff too. I like having more pellets (though they are smaller) but I'm not really sure it's all that much of a difference at close range. Either load is going to do some serious damage.

[Marswolf]

Until police got down with 00 Buck the preferred load, afaik, was #4 Buck. It is 27 pellets of .25 caliber projectile. Sort of like emptying a full 20-rd mag of 5.56Nato into someone all at the same time.

Oddly enough, #4 buck was the one round the fully automatic AA12 was having a problem with, the last I heard.

[nightrunner]

am i misinformed or is it not illegal to carry a loaded long gun(shotgun) in your vehicle?

[GLOCKMEISTER]

it all depends on what exactly your defending...

[Guest gsbell]

Hornady Tap or Federal LE133 00

Good stuff, excellent patterns with cyl bore guns.

[Magiccarpetrides]

If its illegal to put loaded in a trunk would probably be good to know about....course I could always keep it unloaded with ammo at hand....the pistol should buy enough time.

[nightrunner]

i always thought long guns had to be unloaded and have the gun and ammo stored separately i.e. gun in trunk and ammo in passenger compartment or vice versa

[Fallguy]

i always thought long guns had to be unloaded and have the gun and ammo stored separately i.e. gun in trunk and ammo in passenger compartment or vice versa

That is correct.....

Handguns too unless you have a HCP.

39-17-1308 Defenses to unlawful possession or carrying of a weapon.

(a) It is a defense to the application of § 39-17-1307 if the possession or carrying was:

(1)

Of an unloaded rifle, shotgun or handgun not concealed on or about the person and the ammunition for the weapon was not in the immediate vicinity of the person or weapon;

[nightrunner]

i assume it is still illegal even if you have a HCP?

[Fallguy]

i assume it is still illegal even if you have a HCP?

Oops...yes, should have went down one more sub-part

(2) By a person authorized to possess or carry a firearm pursuant to § 39-17-1315 or § 39-17-1351

There are more for different situations if you want click on the 39-17-1308 link.

[Guest 70below]

I thought about slugs, but think that would not be a very good "crowd" control round...

I disagree, most crowds would step back once just at the sight of a 12ga pump, let alone that most recognizable sound of a round being chambered. When the first moron steps forward and says "Git 'em" and you turn him inside out.....I think that is the end of the crowd. Back home, we used to carry 12ga pumps for grizzly bear protection in the woods and we would alternate slugs and 00 Buck in the magazine. My 870 I always keep tactically loaded with 00 Buck (due to availability more than anything) along with 4 extra 00 and 2 slugs for select loading at range in the side saddle.

[strickj]

I've never tried it for myself to verify, but duplex loads that extreme wouldn't tend to pattern very well. I bet a duplex mix of #4 Buck and 00 Buck would work pretty well though.

For myself, I have always found that Federal Tactical loads pattern the best. I've always wanted to try some Dead Coyote HeviShot 00 Buck and T-shot...

+1 on the Federal 00 buck shot.I have tried each of there loads in my 500 and they all have good patterns coming out of an 18 inch

[Guest mikedwood]

I like the 00, always have always will. But really in a 12 ga about anything that comes out of the barrel is going to give someone a bad day. Even the bird shot BB rounds that don't penetrate more than the skin there are just so darn many of them.

I had a friend that I dunno what happened, jealous husband (my guess) or he was on his cell phone and someone just came up to his car and shot him for no reason with a shotgun in broad daylight, side of the road (his story). It didn't kill him but OMG what a mess it made out of him and his car, a bloody mess. The round was birdshot.

Edited May 2, 2008 by mikedwood
added

[Magiccarpetrides]

Hmm...could mount a side saddle inside the truck and rig up something to hold the shottie where I could still get out my groceries :-D That way the ammo would be seperated. Could also stack the shottie 2 slugs and then buck....if you miss with the slugs you wont miss with the buck. Any one know why carrying a loaded pistol is ok, but a rifle or shotgun is not? And yes I have an HCP.

Mike: Was your friend hit in the chest I take it? I guess the guy only shot once? He really is lucky.

Edited May 3, 2008 by Magiccarpetrides
question to mike

[strickj]

You could use this

http://www.brownells.com/aspx/ns/store/ProductDetail.aspx?p=18303&title=SHOTGUN%20SPEED%20LOADER

[ame]http://youtube.com/watch?v=Tz0Q51IUV2M[/ame]

[Magiccarpetrides]

Lol that barney phife looking goober.....yeah let me carry a bunch of those sticks with me HAHAHA. Some ppl come up with some pretty retarded stuff.

[strickj]

Its a speed loader for a shotgun.No more retarded then a speed loader for a j frame.yeah he looks goofy but hes also being able to load 5 or 6 shells at once with it.Keep it in the trunk next to your 500:tinfoil:

[Guest Phantom6]

The absolute worst round you could use would be a slug round. The over penetraion factor is astronomical. If I am going to shoot a large animal at a distance of 60-75 yds I would choose a slug. Unless your house is larger than Al Gore's or John Edwards' however you will not be taking a shot on an agressor in your home at that distance. Inside your home or most buildings for that matter the greatest distance you will be shooting will be about 15-20 feet (hallway, living room or den) with most shots being taken at less than 10-12 feet. Think bedroom or home office room size.

Shotgun pellets produce wound trauma by crushing the tissue it comes into direct contact with as it penetrates. In order to produce wound trauma that will be effective in quickly stopping your ass-hat attacker, the pellets have to penetrate the BG body deeply enough to be able to pass through a vital cardiovascular structure (heart, major arteries or veins). This causes rapid fatal hemorrhage to quickly deprive the brain of oxygenated blood which of course is needed to maintain consciousness.

Birdshot (#6,#7, #8, #9) is what a lot of folks load home defense shotguns with. Granted, birdshot can destroy a tremendous volume of tissue at close range. The permanent crush cavity however is usually less than 6 inches deep, and 6 inches is not deep enough to reliably include the heart or large blood vessels of the abdomen. Although pretty ugly looking, a shallow wound in the torso such as this does not guarantee a quick stop, especially if the BGis intoxicated and/or psychotic. If the tissue crushed by the pellets doesn't include a vital cardiovascular structure (heart, major arteries or veins) there's no way for it to be an effective wound.

For personal defense (and law enforcement applications), the International Wound Ballistics Association advocates number 1 buckshot as being superior to all other buckshot sizes. According to their research, of all shotshell loads available on the market today, number 1 buckshot produces more potentially effective wound trauma than either #00 or #000 buck. More importantly, number 1 buck is less likely to over-penetrate and exit an attacker's body. Law enforcement typically will use #00 but they generally train more and need the larger pellets for a wider variety of applications.

BTW this is one of the many topics that we will be covering in depth in our defensive shotgun course coming up soon. Watch the following thread for further developments, class syllabus and scheduling- http://www.tngunowners.com/forums/showthread.php?t=7283