Anyone heard from Frank at ETS????

[Magiccarpetrides]

Didnt really know the appropriate section for this but I have been trying to get ahold of him on the 870 AOW's he has. Want one pretty bad. Noticed he hasnt been active on here since the 5th. Anyone know of a way to reach him or if hes still doin business?

[Guest EasilyObsessed]

Didnt really know the appropriate section for this but I have been trying to get ahold of him on the 870 AOW's he has. Want one pretty bad. Noticed he hasnt been active on here since the 5th. Anyone know of a way to reach him or if hes still doin business?

I believe Hero Gear sells the 870 AOWs.

[Guest eyebedam]

I talked to him last week. He said he will not be on the forum anymore because of the raffle incident. He is still in buisness and will be at the RK show this weekend. I can pm you his num tonight if you want.

[Magiccarpetrides]

Thanks for the info...I would very much appreciate his number.

Edited April 25, 2008 by Magiccarpetrides
waka waka waka

[TGO David]

I talked to him last week. He said he will not be on the forum anymore because of the raffle incident. He is still in buisness and will be at the RK show this weekend. I can pm you his num tonight if you want.

That is unfortunate but purely his prerogative. I should note that he was never asked or told to leave TGO; we simply could not maintain that association with him in light of what our attorneys advised us were possible snares in that raffle.

To each his own, I guess.

[Guest nj.piney]

we have attorneys ?

[Guest dotsun]

We have people.

[Marswolf]

I talked to him last week. He said he will not be on the forum anymore because of the raffle incident. He is still in buisness and will be at the RK show this weekend. I can pm you his num tonight if you want.

I didn't know about the raffle incident until after it was over (in terms of this board) I have my opinions separate of the board.

I never met Frank. He seems like an alright guy.

But I have dealt with legalities for much of adult life.

I will not go into details. Period.

But I think what he is doing may violate both Tennessee Code and also Federal Code.

I wish him well. He sounds like a good guy. I also hope the feds don't go after him for violations.

[Guest Rando]

I have met him a couple of times inc. the last show in K,town at the Expo. He is indeed a very nice guy and very knowledgeable about the firearm industry and can qoute numbers off the top of his head about everything( ie. he has a H$ll of a memory) I heard at the show about the raffle deal and would love to own any of the three guns in it, but didnt buy any tickets. I do know if all was as he said it was going to help a good cause as well as make a few people happy. I dont know how any of it would really be illegal as they were going to do all paper work for the new owners and make all legit before the winners took ownership of the guns. I do know that if there was a way to put it to somebody Uncy Sam would try it . I hope no one has ill feelings toward him about the raffle thing for he is a very nice dude and was happy to talk as long as I would stand there and fire questions his way. I would love to spend the day on the range with him and learn all I could regarless of the years I have on him.

Thank you Frank hope to see you again soon, Rando:)

[BigPoppa]

"The raffle deal" ?

Anyone ? back story ?

[Guest bkelm18]

"The raffle deal" ?

Anyone ? back story ?

http://www.tngunowners.com/forums/showthread.php?t=6519

[bteague2]

Having been at the past gun show in Knoxville and helping Frank out with his booth. He has talked to all of the Friends of the NRA people that do raffles. And I am more then willing to bet that he has all of his bases covered and I think that if he sat down with Tungsten's lawyer and explained it, like he does to people that stop by his booth or shop, he would convince him too.

[KahrMan]

I talked to Frank about the raffle after all this went down and he is not conducting it anymore. The raffle is being conducted in North Carolina or Virginia, I forget which state the rifle is in. Seems in Tennessee only non-profits can conduct raffles or some technicality like that. I enjoyed speaking with Frank. Seems like a first rate guy.

[Rightwinger]

If you need to communicate with Frank he checks the Tennessee "Hometown" forum on ARFCOM almost daily. He goes by OEF-VET there.

AR 15.com is not just for those with evil black rifles (but it helps to have a few).

http://www.ar15.com/forums/forum.html?b=8&f=38

[BimmerFreak]

Didnt really know the appropriate section for this but I have been trying to get ahold of him on the 870 AOW's he has. Want one pretty bad. Noticed he hasnt been active on here since the 5th. Anyone know of a way to reach him or if hes still doin business?

As mentioned, I have two of Franks 870 AOWs in stock.

If you want a dope deal on one of them, let me know.

I have 2 different brands of AOW/SBS inbound, and would like to clear out the ETS stock.

Pricing: http://www.tngunowners.com/forums/showthread.php?p=90787#post90787

**I would be happy to PM you Franks cell phone number. That way you can buy directly from him if you wish to.

Edited April 26, 2008 by BimmerFreak

[molonlabetn]

Frank is a good fellow who has given much to the firearms community here, so none of the administrative actions taken to distance TGO from the raffle should be construed as a reflection on Frank or ETS, only on the raffle itself. He is welcome here as a member, and we would be pleased to have him participate here. I personally enjoy reading his posts, and knowing him... but it's understandable if he doesn't wish to be active here, I didn't visit his booth at the gun-show today out of uncertainty and respect for his feelings towards TGO, as much as I wanted to. I sincerely hope that relationship heals.

In light of that, it would be better to abstain from discussing that specific raffle, since it is intentionally no longer a TGO issue.

[Guest Boomhower]

So how long must we beat this dead horse? I have my on opinions of this matter as well, but then again, I have a lot of opinions pertaining to this board.

[TGO David]

So how long must we beat this dead horse? I have my on opinions of this matter as well, but then again, I have a lot of opinions pertaining to this board.

I'm all ears.

Feel free to PM me privately if you would rather.

[Guest darkstar]

As the late, great Mr. Warren Zevon said "Send lawyers, guns, and money" but then again remember what Shakespeare said about lawyers in "Hamlet"

[Urse]

Frank is a good fellow who has given much to the firearms community here, so none of the administrative actions taken to distance TGO from the raffle should be construed as a reflection on Frank or ETS, only on the raffle itself. He is welcome here as a member, and we would be pleased to have him participate here. I personally enjoy reading his posts, and knowing him... but it's understandable if he doesn't wish to be active here, I didn't visit his booth at the gun-show today out of uncertainty and respect for his feelings towards TGO, as much as I wanted to. I sincerely hope that relationship heals.

In light of that, it would be better to abstain from discussing that specific raffle, since it is intentionally no longer a TGO issue.

I stopped by and talked to Frank today and he saw you at the show. And evidently when you saw him you and the mrs. and Tungsten and his mrs. took a hard left and walked in the other direction. Although he did mention that redhead1911 waved to him. Uncertainty or not, deliberate avoidance is a good way to breed contempt. Tungsten is fully within his rights to make desicions concerning possible illegal activities on this site. Once those desicions are made however then deal with the consequences. An out of state Friends of the NRA chapter is now holding the raffle for the rifles that Frank has. Evidently your concerns are not unfounded or else he would still be doing the raffle. All that said, I got the feeling today that you guys deliberatly avoiding him left him questioning whether or not you had any balls.

[Guest Verbal Kint]

All that said, I got the feeling today that you guys deliberatly avoiding him left him questioning whether or not you had any balls.

Wow. Great commentary there. What next? Are they going to meet at the flag pole, at 3:00, and beat each other up? That remark is as childish as the entire conspiracy theory that followed the raffle incident.

[Urse]

Wow. Great commentary there. What next? Are they going to meet at the flag pole, at 3:00, and beat each other up? That remark is as childish as the entire conspiracy theory that followed the raffle incident.

Easy little brother no need to get all defensive. I am not attacking anyone. I am merely stating what I think is a better way to deal with the situation. Frank made TGO a more interesting place to be and his input will be sorely missed. The interested parties(of which I am not one) should sit down and talk about this like men. I get the feeling that this is going to be one of those uber sensitive issues so I will take my leave. Good Luck!

[Guest utarch00]

From my understanding of the situation, the admin publically on this forum said that they did not want to be associated with ETS and they were pulling him Vendor status, no private lets talk about this before we proceed with plan of action. Since TGO does not want to be asociated with Frank, he does not want to be a participating member.

[R1100R]

That's what I have concluded from reading and talking with others. Actions were taken before discussions. I really like this board. I hope things can be worked out.

How about meeting at the Flag Pole at 3:00 and burying the hatchet.

[Guest Verbal Kint]

That's what I have concluded from reading and talking with others. Actions were taken before discussions. I really like this board. I hope things can be worked out.

How about meeting at the Flag Pole at 3:00 and burying the hatchet.

Honestly, what hatchet? You guys keep bringing personal feelings into this matter, all while hashing up an issue that's best left alone. The moderators have consistently stated that there was and is no ill will towards Frank and that they still welcome him here on the forums... just not in the vendor status that he once held. So again, what hatchet? If there is any animosity between the two parties, it doesn't lie here, and I'm not sure exists at all (until a party stands up and voices it themself).

It's really easy for me to stick up for my brother, as easy as it is for friends of Frank to stick up for Frank. But, as I said previously, let's leave personal feelings out of it and look at the facts.

The raffle idea involved gray areas, that were cautioned against when the board admin inquired about the legalities of the event. This site is personally owned and operated, and any potential repurcussions of illegal or questionable activities will come back and squarely bite the owner (Tungsten) in the ass. This website is housed and maintained at his place of employment through agreement with said employer. Ergo, not only is Tungsten put in a potentially liable condition... but so is his job for that matter, if the government (which it has all too cleary proven to do) chose to intervene and go on a witch hunt. Even if everything turned out A-OK, it still has an impact on the job environment. How would your employers react if the BATF, or other agencies, came knocking on the door because one of your hobbies may or may not have been involved in federal misconduct or at the very least questionable proceedings. I'm sure they'd love you for it!

Would you be willing to jeopardize your freedoms, occupation, and family's well-being on such a gray area -- let alone the continued operation of this forum for all of you to use? Would you even take the slightest chance of risking any of that??? I seriously hope not.

I'm sure Frank was on the up-and-up, and the raffle once fully conceived would/could be a good thing. I truly do. His past record here stands to support that. But when a legal professional warns you that you may be risking the site's wellbeing, as well as your own, it's time to sever the connection with that activity. Swiftly and effectively.

That's what TGO did. They pulled his vendor status, made a public statement saying that the raffle would not be honored here and that TGO had no part in it, and never once told Frank that he was unwelcome here or that he needed to leave.

Call it a CYA (Cover Your A$$) tactic, if you will.

If you still feel that Frank was wronged, or TGO acted out of line, you're entitled to your opinion. But stirring all of this up again is pointless. Guessing how one side or the other feels really holds no water, and just further fuels the fire. If Frank wants to comment, awesome. If he want's to come back, awesome! I, also, really enjoyed his posts and found them worthwhile. If he want's to distance himself, I personally think it's a shame... but totally understand and honor that decision as well.

Let's not keep re-hashing this issue and making it into something it's not. There's a lot of rumors being generated from this, second hand information being tossed around, and very few people know the entire details. Heck, I don't even know the full story.

Let it rest and move on.