A.P.P.S. J Buford tune

[Guest jackdog]

My gripe is not the missed appointment or his stand against semi auto's.

Flat out the man lied to me he advertises a course that they really don't teach. Then he wasted my time. Anyone who would like to go his class has my blessing and I hope they get their monies worth. I can not abide people lying to me it is as simple as that.

[Rifleman]

I see your point.

[Marswolf]

Some of you may have seen Grayfox post. He's a retired police chief and carried a revolver. Still does on occasion and likes it. But he also carries pistols. Good blend of tradition and keeping up with technology. I don't think I'd go to a course taught by someone who just thinks pistols are a bad idea for self protection.

And I would pick and choose my instructors if given a chance. If I'm footing the bill, I will have that chance. No spin the wheel of instructors for me. While it may be true that even a blind squirrel finds a nut once in a while, I'd rather pick my squirrel training officer to be more than just lucky in teaching me what to do.

[Rifleman]

One more thing to keep in mind. All of these guys who run successful training outfits have type A personalities and rock solid opinions on what they teach from techniques to gear. (I would be worried if they didn't) That just comes with the territory.

Clint Smith, Gabe Suarez, Pat Rogers to name a few. Read some of their stuff, you will see what I am talking about.

[Guest Tracy Hightower]

A good instuctor should of course be able to teach a certain technique or method and will likely as rifleman said be opinionated on what he or she teaches.

Most importantly a good instructor should be able to tell you WHY they teach a certain method or technique.

[Guest jackdog]

I do not have a problem with someone who has an A personality. Nor to I have a problem with someone who teaches different techniques. But I do have problems with people who lose credibility by being untruthful. If you go back to an earlier post you will see that one of my criteria to training schools is how they may be perceived in a civil court of law. If I don't feel they are credible then I doubt that a jury would either

[Guest jackdog]

Mars I can easily see where a Glock or even a Kel_tec could be very dangerous in the wrong hands. I would love to see stats than compare Id's with different guns. Is Glock the worst gun for ID's, perhaps but it is not the gun, it is operator error or stupidity. Would I recommend a glock to a new shooter? maybe. Would I recommend a glock to Som one who has shot for years? perhaps. In both the above instances it would depend on the persons

ability to operate the the firearm safely. You be amazed how many people even ones that carry guns can not tell you the 4 main rules of gun safety.

The Key to me is safety instruction learn it live by it practice it daily and Id's would be far less.

[Marswolf]

One more thing to keep in mind. All of these guys who run successful training outfits have type A personalities and rock solid opinions on what they teach from techniques to gear. (I would be worried if they didn't) That just comes with the territory.

Clint Smith, Gabe Suarez, Pat Rogers to name a few. Read some of their stuff, you will see what I am talking about.

You know what they say about opinions.

Rifleman, I agree with you that people who run successful training businesses are almost always Type A personalities. The combination of impatience, insecurity, need to be noticed, high level of competitiveness, hostility and aggression that characterizes Type A people often makes them good businessmen. They stir people to action, sometimes wisely and sometimes not so wisely. That depends on other aspects of business judgment as well as their aggression. Being aggressive doesn't necessarily mean being successful in business, but it is a necessary component of business success.

The people I deal with have top of the line training. That's a given. Of necessity, I look at peoples' actions in the field from the perspective of required results. I deal with people in combat situations. They are all experienced combat-proven individuals, as well as being superbly trained. What I look for is aggressiveness but not impulsiveness. Pure type A people do not, make top soldiers (or LEOs). The very best combatants are a complex mixture of aggression to act plus the patience to analyze the situation before them before acting.

As combatants, type A people make great cannon fodder, but type AB people are the ones you want in a leadership role. They figure out what needs to be done - very quickly - then kick into their active mode and get the job done.

[Marswolf]

I would love to see stats than compare Id's with different guns. Is Glock the worst gun for ID's, perhaps but it is not the gun, it is operator error or stupidity.

We've done this Glock thing to death. It's like 45ACP vs. 9mm.

I don't think we'll ever see good stats. I don't think they can be gathered. But ask around at your gun club and see which guns seem to have the problem. Don't ignore reality because you can't quantify it.

I contend that some guns are inherently more dangerous than others. IDs / ADs are caused by operator error. But some guns make that action more likely to occur.

[Guest jackdog]

Mars, I do not disagree with you on your opinion of the Glock pistol. I was hoping that you had run across some data about glocks vs. other firearms.

I respect and value your opinion, But I can not see where a Glock would be more or less dangerous than The kel-tec, or a S&W M&P, Since they function in the same way. If Glocks are more dangerous, I would expect it has a lot to do with the large volume of Glock after market items that can be added.

I'm sure that like myself, one of your most important criteria for a carry weapon is it's reliability. For the present, I prefer the Glock in this regard.

Should I buy an XD. ( thinking strongly on doing this), and It proves to be as reliable as the Glock I may change what I carry.

By the way your response to Rifleman on AB personalities is right on target.

[Guest ProguninTN]

I took a class there. It was very good, and I would highly recommend it. Mr. Tune knows what he is doing. I will warn all, as stated by other posters, he is Anti-GLOCK. He is not Anti-Semi Auto, but he does prefer Revolvers. He advocates the rule of K.I.S.S. (Keep it simple stupid).

[Marswolf]

Thanks for the clarification Progun. How old is Mr. Tune?

[Guest Tracy Hightower]

I took a class there. It was very good, and I would highly recommend it. Mr. Tune knows what he is doing. I will warn all, as stated by other posters, he is Anti-GLOCK. He is not Anti-Semi Auto, but he does prefer Revolvers. He advocates the rule of K.I.S.S. (Keep it simple stupid).

Just my opinion but carrying a revolver for self defense and the KISS Principle do NOT go hand in hand.

The manual dexterity required in simply reloading a revolver is much more difficult than an autoloader especially under the stress of a gunfight. Most students I have seen that carry a revolver do not put in the time and effort to become proficient with reloading a revolver.

[Guest jackdog]

Tracy, I agree that reloading a revolver is more difficult than a autoloader.

But most defense situations only last mere seconds, so reloading would probably not be an issue. However we never know what situation we are going to be in or for how long so it is possible reloading could be an issue.

[Marswolf]

Well, that's it. Most of these confrontations only last one to three shots depending on the threat and your training. I'll bet that most packers don't carry a spare magazine or equivalent so reloading isn't an issue for them. Few people envision themselves shooting their way out of a street gang attack. More likely they will have one or two assailants in the Wal-mart parking lot.

While I disagree with Tune about this, for most people a revolver is enough to get them out of the bad situation they are in.

[Rifleman]

50% of assaults are perpetrated by MULTIPLE assailants. (I hate stating statistics without some resource, can anyone back this up?)

Multiple hits are often required to stop an attacker. What if there are three, four, a carload? What if you miss with the first four shots? Yes that can happen if someone is actively beating you with a 2x4. READ JIM CIRRILO'S BOOK!

Possibly more important than having more firepower is the ability to fix a stoppage with a fresh mag. Magazines can be very finicky, even a small amount of lint in the right place can send your gun screeching to halt. Carry a spare mag. Better yet also carry a spare gun in your pocket. S&W J frames are nice.

[Marswolf]

Around our area we pretty much see lone assailants on downtown streets. Occasionally a couple of young guys work together for rap music money. Most of those attacks end with no shots fired either because there is no gun to fire, or the thugs run.

You have to be aware of the area you are in. I wouldn't go in a gang area with just one magazine of 380 Auto. But My 40 USP with spare four magazines isn't necessary for a trip to the grocery store either.

You have to use some common sense.

[Guest ProguninTN]

Just my opinion but carrying a revolver for self defense and the KISS Principle do NOT go hand in hand.

The manual dexterity required in simply reloading a revolver is much more difficult than an autoloader especially under the stress of a gunfight. Most students I have seen that carry a revolver do not put in the time and effort to become proficient with reloading a revolver.

I concede it is a matter of perception. I have carried revolvers and semi-autos. Some may have difficulty reloading revolvers, while others may fumble with safeties on semi-autos. I enjoy being able to point and shoot. Although, I have done some practice reloading my revolver. I have also lubricated the slides on my autoloaders so that they won't be difficult to rack.

[Guest jackdog]

As a general rule I carry G23, spare mag, Kel-tec 380 and a Crkt m-16. There are times when I do not carry the G23. When this is the case I carry a spare mag for the Kel-tec. I know people that carry revolvers and shoot them very well. Once again a person needs to carry what they feel the most comfortable with that they can carry all the time.