CCW in church with ND

[DaveTN]

Some here are no smarter than the people they are making fun of. It’s not a “magazine safetyâ€, it’s a magazine disconnect. Would it have saved this young woman? Yes, but that is not its purpose. Some manufacturers, like S&W with the M&P, offer their guns with or without it. If you think it was designed to make it a “lawyer gun†then you are free to buy one without it. If you think it may be beneficial for your carry application; it is available. No need to argue about it; buy what you like.

Prayers go out to this young woman. Only Gods hand could protect her from someone stupid enough to pull the trigger on a loaded gun.

[Grunt67]

Or, never go in a closet with a loaded firearm.

This dunce was an accident looking for a place to happen. Found one.

[chances R]

Since you can't fix stupid you sure can regulate it for the protection of society. A magazine safety would have prevented this common accident. If states have already passed laws to allow carry in public places then they are responsible to make sure the legally armed citizen knows how to safely handle a loaded firearm. It appears clear to me that Florida granted a permit to someone who does not know how to handle a firearm in public. I am upset. If that was my girl who was shot in the head at church then I would be leading the crusade to ban firearms by stupid people and yes that may mean a real gun safety exam.

I understand your being upset...I would say we all agree this is senseless; a shame and real tragedy. But more laws, or regs is not the answer. We have addressed this before, but a permit is simply the beginning, much like a driver's learner's permit. Mistakes with either a car or a handgun can result in loss of life needlessly. I don't have THE answer, except we all owe it to each other to be responsible gun owners and encourage others to do the same. This includes educational programs and pointing out to others irresponsible gun handling.

[mikegideon]

Some here are no smarter than the people they are making fun of. It’s not a “magazine safetyâ€, it’s a magazine disconnect. Would it have saved this young woman? Yes, but that is not its purpose. Some manufacturers, like S&W with the M&P, offer their guns with or without it. If you think it was designed to make it a “lawyer gun†then you are free to buy one without it. If you think it may be beneficial for your carry application; it is available. No need to argue about it; buy what you like.

Prayers go out to this young woman. Only Gods hand could protect her from someone stupid enough to pull the trigger on a loaded gun.

S&W has had mag disconnects since the Model 59, maybe even the 39. Don't think it was lawyer driven.

[Wheelgunner]

@ chances R -- I think bklem18 and I are in complete agreement with you about more laws not being the answer. That's what we were getting at -- the sarcasm just didn't translate well into online text.

[True Grit]

All I am saying is that if we don't take action to prevent similar tragic accidents that we will wind up losing what freedoms we currently enjoy. If this means carrying more guns with magazine disconnects or more stringent CCW requirements then it is worthwhile. Please remember that this is a forum to share ideas and learn from each other. There are always two sides to every issue Unrestrained freedom leads to lawlessness and trampling on the rights of the minority.

[Caster]

All I am saying is that if we don't take action to prevent similar tragic accidents that we will wind up losing what freedoms we currently enjoy. If this means carrying more guns with magazine disconnects or more stringent CCW requirements then it is worthwhile. Please remember that this is a forum to share ideas and learn from each other. There are always two sides to every issue Unrestrained freedom leads to lawlessness and trampling on the rights of the minority.

Well, adding those "features" would be a move toward the rights of the manufacturers to make a good living because I sure as heck would never buy one or be forced to carry one.

There's no need for stricter carry laws, infractions by carry permit holders are very low. Plus, no matter how strict, stupid people somehow always manage to stumble through.

As far as unrestrained freedom and trampling the rights of minorities????? *sigh* Since the dawn of man, the strong have walked upon the backs of the weak. It's foolishness and arrogance to think it will ever change. Trampling rights sounds like ACLU rhetoric to me.

[c.a.willard]

Magazine disconnects are already required in new guns manufactured after 2006 in california, I think weapons designed prior to this and still in production are exempted but realatively new designs such as the M&P require it to be legal for sale in CA. That is probably why so many manufacturers now have models with mag disconnects, come to think of it i think they have a law against ND's to. Oh i got an idea lets become like California because there laws have solved the stupid problem (Heavy amounts of sarcasm)

[Caster]

That's true but honestly, who really cares about Kalifornia?

[c.a.willard]

Also just my 2 cents, but AD's do happen to not just ND's. A malfunction of the shooter is a ND a malfunction of the weapon is a AD. For example a runaway gun is multiple AD's.

[Guest bkelm18]

Some here are no smarter than the people they are making fun of. It’s not a “magazine safetyâ€, it’s a magazine disconnect. Would it have saved this young woman? Yes, but that is not its purpose. Some manufacturers, like S&W with the M&P, offer their guns with or without it. If you think it was designed to make it a “lawyer gun†then you are free to buy one without it. If you think it may be beneficial for your carry application; it is available. No need to argue about it; buy what you like.

Prayers go out to this young woman. Only Gods hand could protect her from someone stupid enough to pull the trigger on a loaded gun.

Yes it's called a magazine disconnect, but it's still a safety feature. Would it have saved this woman? Perhaps. But if you're too stupid to keep your finger off the trigger unless you're ready to shoot, no amount of laws, regulations, training, or safeties, is going to stop you from being a moron.

[Caster]

Also just my 2 cents, but AD's do happen to not just ND's. A malfunction of the shooter is a ND a malfunction of the weapon is a AD. For example a runaway gun is multiple AD's.

Well, if one is paying proper attention, it doesn't have to be anything more than a malfunction. After you load a gun, It should [iN THEORY] be able to go off in your hands and not hurt anyone. If it can't, I question where you're pointing it.

[c.a.willard]

Im just saying for all the people out there saying AD's can't happen, ive seen rounds unintentionally discharged with no shooter error, i would call that an AD. Others may not to each their own i guess. Either way this guy was about as negliigent as is possible.

[Guest lostpass]

I like "The gun went off" part.

When it is a car wreck "the driver failed to notice the red light" or "The driver lost control"

With a gun it is "the gun went off" not "The owner accidentally depressed the trigger" or something.

Apparently, guns are magic things that shoot of their own accord.

[monkeylizard]

Must have been a high cap Glock revolver again. I can't believe those things are still legal.

[Glenn]

Don't put your finger on the trigger on the trigger unless you want to shoot. Idiot

Glenn

Not only should you keep your finger off the trigger, you should read your own posts read your own posts before posting them posting them.

Glenn

[Guest ArmaDeFuego]

Exactly how would regulating it have prevented this from happening?

Thats my question. Every time someone does something stupid the gun control lobby screams for more regulations & more laws. I dont see how thats gonna help anything.

[strickj]

Or, never go in a closet with a loaded firearm.

This dunce was an accident looking for a place to happen. Found one.

Or just never go into a closet with another man. Icky

[Caster]

Or just never go into a closet with another man. Icky

Now that's some usable advice. Words to live by.

[True Grit]

Thats my question. Every time someone does something stupid the gun control lobby screams for more regulations & more laws. I dont see how thats gonna help anything.

There are plenty of examples of laws and regulations saving lives. Just look at the statistics for fatalities because manufactures placed airbags in cars, seat belt use and lowering the speed limit. Just because we are taking about making gun carrying safer everyone screams 2nd amendment rights. We will lose this right if we can't prevent innocent lose of life. I support stronger background checks, closing the gun show loophole, stricter CCW requirements, no guns in bars and churches, stiffer penalties for carrying firearms without a permit and safer guns that have lower capacity magazines, magazine disconnects and manual safeties. I see no need for high capacity for SD.

I am not anti gun or a Brady nut. I carry a revolver every day.

[Tnscooter63]

There are plenty of examples of laws and regulations saving lives. Just look at the statistics for fatalities because manufactures placed airbags in cars, seat belt use and lowering the speed limit. Just because we are taking about making gun carrying safer everyone screams 2nd amendment rights. We will lose this right if we can't prevent innocent lose of life. I support stronger background checks, closing the gun show loophole, stricter CCW requirements, no guns in bars and churches, stiffer penalties for carrying firearms without a permit and safer guns that have lower capacity magazines, magazine disconnects and manual safeties. I see no need for high capacity for SD.

I am not anti gun or a Brady nut. I carry a revolver every day.

wow, sure you are. Thank God we live in a place where we have the freedom to express ourselves as you are but how long do you really think it will be before they "your buddies" take your freedom of speech the way they have applied the regulations you speak of. There are places for people like you, like CA or NY where you can live with these regulations on guns that you speak of and feel all warm and fuzzy, but like you it isnt good enough and they want to complain about people several states away and try and impose their commie beliefs on everyone else. Out west they used to tar and feather people like this and run them out of town, not really sure if that was civilized or not anymore. Here is one for ya, the only regulation that should come from this is how much jail time he should get for his criminal neglegence.....

[Caster]

There are plenty of examples of laws and regulations saving lives. Just look at the statistics for fatalities because manufactures placed airbags in cars, seat belt use and lowering the speed limit. Just because we are taking about making gun carrying safer everyone screams 2nd amendment rights. We will lose this right if we can't prevent innocent lose of life. I support stronger background checks, closing the gun show loophole, stricter CCW requirements, no guns in bars and churches, stiffer penalties for carrying firearms without a permit and safer guns that have lower capacity magazines, magazine disconnects and manual safeties. I see no need for high capacity for SD.

I am not anti gun or a Brady nut. I carry a revolver every day.

Brady nut by your own admission. This is how they get in man, they get "greater good" ideas in your head. Once they're in, you can't get them out.

You don't see a NEED for high capacity so you would set yourself against it? You would probably support national Id's and a national gun owners license too yeah? I wipe crap like this off my shoes before I go in at night. No guns in bars???? That's the same filthy hippy rhetoric the Brady camp spews everyday. Like some permit holder is going to belly up to the bar and get hammered like the old west. Churches are private and as long as the CHURCH [not you or any law making body] says it's cool, it's just like any business that welcomes permits or forbids it with proper posting. How are you going to get a stronger background check??? Go back to waiting periods?? AND gun show loop holes huh? There IS NO GUN SHOW LOOPHOLE!! When will you people get that in you thick head. It's no different at a gunshow than in your own living room. If two law abiding citizens with no priors want to sell/buy a gun to/from one another, it is perfectly legal. SO, that would mean you want to do away with private sales? Well, I'm one who's willing to fight about that.

Good Day True Grit, do some soul searching, your priorities are misaligned.

[Caster]

Scooter's right, the only thing that needs doing is let that sucker do a year in jail for being an idiot.

[daddyo]

I am not anti gun or a Brady nut.

Maybe, maybe not. But you are clueless when it comes to constitutional rights and how intrusive our government has become. Do you think that you're safe in a "bar" or in a church? Has there ever been anyone hurt or killed in a "bar" or in a church? Of course. Sounds like you need to take some time to really think about what you're saying.

Are you familiar with the analogy of the boiling frog?

Edited February 14, 2012 by DaddyO

[mikegideon]

There are plenty of examples of laws and regulations saving lives. Just look at the statistics for fatalities because manufactures placed airbags in cars, seat belt use and lowering the speed limit. Just because we are taking about making gun carrying safer everyone screams 2nd amendment rights. We will lose this right if we can't prevent innocent lose of life. I support stronger background checks, closing the gun show loophole, stricter CCW requirements, no guns in bars and churches, stiffer penalties for carrying firearms without a permit and safer guns that have lower capacity magazines, magazine disconnects and manual safeties. I see no need for high capacity for SD.

I am not anti gun or a Brady nut. I carry a revolver every day.

You ARE a Brady nut. Glad you could find a gun that fits all your criteria. Does it have the instructions stamped on the side as well?