Machine Pulled vs. Collett Pulled

[Guest]

Hello,

Having now successfully fired my first 9mm reloads, I am ready to start picking up the components to reload 5.56/.223.

The source I am looking at has M855 as both Machine Pulled and Resized, and Collet Pulled - No Marks. The ammo with pull marks is $15 cheaper per 1,000. Will the marks make a noticeable impact on accuracy within the realistic usable range of 5.56?

I have a 1:7 twist, 16" PSA upper. Although, any ammo I buy or load I am trying to be sure it would work well in just about any AR I might acquire down the road, or a friend's rifle, etc.

http://www.iidbs.com...00&object-menu6

I was also thinking of picking up a small quantity of the M856 orange tracers just to try out for fun.

Oh the one other concern I had is I read on another site that the steel tip in the M855 can damage some steel targets. If using a quality target (even though I don't have any at all, currently), would this still be a concern?

Thanks.

Edited February 13, 2012 by Guest

[MacGyver]

M855 rounds have tungsten penetrator tips in them. If you shoot them at steel, it's going to put holes in your target.

The marks for pulling them won't affect your accuracy at the ranges you're likely to be shooting. I've shot pulled 168GR .308s out to 600 yards with accuracy at least as good as factory new.

[Guest]

M855 rounds have tungsten penetrator tips in them. If you shoot them at steel, it's going to put holes in your target.

Shoot... I liked the idea of 855 because it's heavier, and supposedly a little straighter trajectory (for what I read online anyway). But although I don't have any yet, I was wanting to at some point acquire a couple steel targets, or buy some real good steel and weld a couple up. Guess I should re-investigate M193 some more. Thanks for confirming that the penetrators will be an issue.

The M856 as far as I can tell does not have a penetrator core. However, from what I read, it is for use in M16A1's (1:12 twist) only in emergency situations under 90 meters because the 1:12 twist won't stabilize the bullet (63.5 grain). Bet that's the case for the M855 too.

Edited February 16, 2012 by Guest

[MacGyver]

Even with m193, you need to be careful using steel. Make sure you're using a quality target at an appropriate distance. There's a big difference between an AR500 rated target and a plate of mild steel.

[smopoim86]

M855 rounds have tungsten penetrator tips in them. If you shoot them at steel, it's going to put holes in your target.

The marks for pulling them won't affect your accuracy at the ranges you're likely to be shooting. I've shot pulled 168GR .308s out to 600 yards with accuracy at least as good as factory new.

Standard M855 green tip only has a steel core. I believe the tungsten core rounds have a black tip. The green tip will still work over a piece of plate more than standard FMJ.

Quoted from the "book of knowledge"

• Cartridge, Caliber 5.56 mm, Ball, M855 (United States): 5.56×45mm 62-grain FN SS109 ball cartridge, green tip w/steel penetrator and a lead core.
  
• Cartridge, Caliber 5.56 mm, Ball, M855 Lead Free (United States):62-grain green tip w/tungsten penetrator and a steel core. Primarily used during training in countries with strict lead disposal laws.
  
• Cartridge, Caliber 5.56 mm, Ball, M855A1 (United States):62-grain green tip w/19-grain steel penetrator tip and a solid copper core.
  

Edited February 17, 2012 by smopoim86

[TM01]

Sounds like you have found Hi Tech Ammo. I have used the pulled rounds they sell in both 55gr and 62 gr and they shoot just fine. I have never noticed a loss in accuracy. They have pretty good prices on primers also.

[Caster]

I buy ss109's from David and some of them have some pretty heavy pull marks. They will tear one raged hole all day long. The marks mean squat. If the base is uniform and the nose is straight, and the bullet is seated straight, they will fly just fine.

[Guest]

I buy ss109's from David and some of them have some pretty heavy pull marks. They will tear one raged hole all day long. The marks mean squat. If the base is uniform and the nose is straight, and the bullet is seated straight, they will fly just fine.

Are SS109's and M855 the same? If so, David if you see this, please PM or post info on your bullets and prices. I have not yet ordered anywhere (in fact am still stuck debating steel core vs lead.... lol)

Thanks!

[Guest canebreaker]

Why would you resize jacketed bullets? Read my other thread.

I've reloaded 38 spl, 357s, 9m, 308 and 30 carbines with no problems.

Maybe there is a bulge in the copper they want to get rid of.

[Guest]

So I guess within 3-400 yards, the M855 an M109's are going to fly relatively the same.... close enough to interchange them without re-zeroing?? (not for match/contest purposes)

If so, I'll just go with the cheap pulled-with-marks M855 for now, and if I do get steel targets later on, add some M109 to the mix (well, separated, of course :-) )

Assuming it's reasonably damp/wet outside, is there any restriction on using M856 orange tracer at outdoor ranges? I just thought it would be neat to try.

EDIT: Oh yeah.... the original thing I came on here about. My Hornady reloading book only goes down to 1:9 twist (I have 1:7) but eveb more interesting, they don't include a 62-gr bullet? Unless I am missing something.... Anyone know a good source for load data for the 62gn M855 and the 63gn M856?

Thanks!

Edited February 22, 2012 by Guest

[Guest canebreaker]

is there any restriction on using M856 orange tracer at outdoor ranges?

Some ranges have restrictions. Call before you go.

[dlm37015]

Why would you resize jacketed bullets? Read my other thread.

I've reloaded 38 spl, 357s, 9m, 308 and 30 carbines with no problems.

Maybe there is a bulge in the copper they want to get rid of.

the reason to resize pouuled bullets is in casr the got out of round

[dlm37015]

Are SS109's and M855 the same? If so, David if you see this, please PM or post info on your bullets and prices. I have not yet ordered anywhere (in fact am still stuck debating steel core vs lead.... lol)

Thanks!

bullets for tgo members m193 55 grain 70.00 per 1000 62 grain 85.00 per 1000

[Guest canebreaker]

Thank you DLM

[Guest]

Why would you resize jacketed bullets?

So you're saying SS109/M855 that is "machine pulled & resized" might have something wrong with the bullet? I guess they are as good as new once they are re-sized, or has the center of gravity possibly changed due to how the lead and jacket were resized?

Also not to change the topic but does anyone have a favorite recipe for M855? My hornady book doesn't address 62 and 63 grain bullets so I'm going to look for other sources. I'm using a 1:7 barrel but might have other barrels down the road.

Edited February 24, 2012 by Guest

[dlm37015]

no they are fine once they are resized when you pull them it makes them out of round when you size them it fixes that