In your opinion, what do you understand it takes for a person to get to heaven

[Guest bkelm18]

I live my life according to my own principles, not those of anyone, or anything, else.

[E4 No More]

There's only two possibilities: you are either right or you are wrong, but it mostly boils down to this:

Proverbs 12:15 The way of a fool [is] right in his own eyes: but he that hearkeneth unto counsel [is] wise.

But for the "debate" this thread is surely to start with many fools commenting on things that they are ignorant of, (as in, they have not studied), I choose:

Proverbs 26:4Answer not a fool according to his folly, lest thou also be like unto him.

Good day, gentlemen.

[Oh Shoot]

Life isn't fair. Sometimes you luck up and get the fires of hell.

Guy dies and St. Peter meets him at The Gate.

Pete tells him, hey we're running a special deal, you get to look at both heaven and hell and decide which way to go. Feller says, cool, let's do it.

So he looks at heaven, yep, peace and love, lions lay with lambs, folks playing harps sitting on edge of clouds. Live forever, all that. All his family there, recognizes back couple generations, inlaws, the whole linup. Feller thinks this surely one boring place to spend eternity, especially with a family he didn't even like but about half of.

So he takes a look at hell. Wow! Most beautiful golf courses he's ever seen, the best booze, Cuban cigars, hot loose chicks, casinos, great fishing and hunting, lots of great like-minded folks to hang with, like that.

Tells Ole Pete, "well, thanks for the previews, looks like hell's the place for me!"

So zap, he's in hell, but everything's changed, it's fire and brimstone, constant torture, upside down in pig doo, all that. Little imp walks by, guy say, "Hey bud, what happened to the babes, the golf courses, casinos, all that?"

Imp just grins and says, "St. Pete needs to quit showing that old beta version."

- OS

[strickj]

Live life good and help others when and where I can. If that's not enough to get me into heaven, then the hell with it.

[Mike.357]

Sucks for all the folks who drop dead instantly from a heart attack. On the way to confession.

- OS

Thats what the last rites sacrement is for. You can be forgiven posthumously.

[Guest nicemac]

Thats what the last rites sacrement is for. You can be forgiven posthumously.

Where do you find that in scripture?

[Oh Shoot]

Thats what the last rites sacrement is for. You can be forgiven posthumously.

Oh, good. I always see them being given in movies just before they croak.

On second thought, why all the confessionals along the way, if you've got a lock like that going for ya?

- OS

[Oh Shoot]

Where do you find that in scripture?

Hey, the Pope is above all that sort of thing.

[Guest bkelm18]

'Bout time...

[Jonnin]

A long time ago I went over this in a class of some sort. What stuck with me were 2 comments made:

1) it is enough to do as others have said, to believe, a basic John 3:16 answer, whoever believes is saved, and so on.

2) the above is enough to get you in, but it is only the beginning. Nothing else that you do will make you any more saved, true, but if you truly believe, your actions, lifestyle, and so on will change. It is not possible to just believe without actions, to ignore the rest of the Word and live unaffected by such a gift.

I am no great guru on the mountaintop so I will leave it there, I have no answers, and anything I tend to say from here just creates more questions

[Mike.357]

Where do you find that in scripture?

Don't get me started. I answered the OP's question and commented on OhShoots response.

What little i think i know would have been learned in parochial school religion classes.

Going to confesion is how we could keep the slate clean.

Receiving sacrements is supposed to be good for you.

Edited January 23, 2012 by Mike.357

[Guest nicemac]

Don't get me started. I answered the OP's question and commented on OhShoots response.

What little i thin i know would have been learned in parochial school religion classes.

Understood.

[Raoul]

I thought only the Mormons got in to heaven? Oh wait...that's South Park.

[Caster]

Has anyone ever thought of the possibility that no one is going? I certainly believe there's a God, but why would I not be surprised to see him come back one day and say to man:

Okay, I promised I'd come back and I did. Well, I was going to do all this really cool stuff for you guys. Things your paltry minds could not have fathomed. I look at you now though and I ask myself...Why? Man is so pathetic, why should I bother. So I'm back to announce, I have officially changed my mind. I get to do that see, because I am GOD. You had much promise when I made you, but I gave you freedom of choice and this is what you've done with it. I'm ashamed of you, and I'm going somewhere else. You're on your own, best of luck to you.

A lot of people would cry or scream and hate him for it. I wouldn't. I wouldn't blame him at all, and would continue to hold him in high regard knowing there can be nothing to gain from it.

Edited January 23, 2012 by Caster

[Mike.357]

I have done a fine job of not taking bait

[Oh Shoot]

I have done a fine job of not taking bait

"Whosoever keeps his mouth and his tongue keeps his soul from troubles." - Proverbs 21:23

"You're a better man than I am, Gunga Din!" - R. Kipling

- OS

[Caster]

As far as the OP's question: I'm not convinced of any organized religion's set parameters for passage to heaven. Going by the common standard, a monster of a human being that has murdered and raped children can feel genuine sorrow in his heart, confess, repent and be baptized and maintain a clean life until his death and he gets a pass but because I watched some porn when I was dumb kid, swear like a sailor when I get angry and enjoy a stiff drink or five in the privacy of my home I could very likely get the boot? No, it doesn't work that way and I ain't buying it. I understand failure to accept the truth doesn't make the truth any less true, but I refuse to believe that. No God worth serving will allow the atrocities a man has committed to pass unpunished solely on the fact that the guy asked him not to. The just and righteous God that is the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob; Father of Jesus Christ himself cannot be a just God and allow it to be. Likewise, what to do with a man who has helped others when he can, has NEVER hurt anyone and despite his temper has never so much as raised his hand to another in anger. This is my personal line in the sand with the word of MAN. Sorry to any who feel insulted by this, but this is the reason I am convinced that organized religion on the whole, is a joke.

"God, I know you're real, but many of your self proclaimed followers are a joke. They mock you and defile that which you made holy. "

[Guest nicemac]

I have done a fine job of not taking bait

Or, you have no idea why you believe what you believe.

[mikegideon]

Where do you find that in scripture?

I think that one was whipped up by the Vatican

[Guest bkelm18]

Or, you have no idea why you believe what you believe.

Or you're just looking for an argument by belittling a person's beliefs. Grow up.

[Wazzu]

I believe there's a form at the gate. It asks if you've ever started a thread about religion on a non-religious forum. If "yes", you're cast to the demons for creating disorder, panic, and despair.

By that logic, if your house is on fire I should only let you know about it if you're logged into a forum on house fires?

[Guest nicemac]

I think that one was whipped up by the Vatican

You are correct.

[Oh Shoot]

Or, you have no idea why you believe what you believe.

I ain't gonna speak for Mike, except to assure you that he's quite clear regarding his theological beliefs. So don't be mean.

Since you've only been around less than a year, I guess you haven't read many of the older religious threads in the pre-ban proselytizing rule era. He's learned to play things closer to the vest. So that makes one of us.

So where is Jamie anyway? Has he ascended or descended or something?

- OS

[Guest nicemac]

Or you're just looking for an argument by belittling a person's beliefs. Grow up.

I was not belittling anyone's beliefs. I just asked why he believes that (by wanting supporting scripture). That is the way mature people respond. Not by telling people to grow up simply for asking a question.

[Guest nicemac]

I ain't gonna speak for Mike, except to assure you that he's quite clear regarding his theological beliefs. So don't be mean.

Since you've only been around less than a year, I guess you haven't read many of the older religious threads in the pre-ban proselytizing rule era. He's learned to play things closer to the vest. So that makes one of us.

- OS

I am in no way trying to be mean. He was very clear that these were his beliefs. I wanted to know what he bases that (obviously religious) belief on.

I have only been in this forum for a year, but have been around internet forums since before most people on this forum had ever heard of the internet. They are all always the same. This subject causes much disagreement. I will gladly withdraw my question and leave this topic cheerfully for others to discuss if it can't be discussed rationally and if questions are forbidden.

Edited January 23, 2012 by nicemac