Rifle for protection

[Guest Revelator]

What would be a good rifle to get for mostly protection purposes? This would not be for hunting or recreational shooting, though I would certainly shoot it enough to get proficient at it. I already have a shotgun, but I've been thinking about a rifle for defense outside of the home, like in a survival-type situation. Society breaks down, my wife and I have to get the hell out of the city, that sort of thing. Would a good old cheap Eastern-bloc AK do? Or should I spend a little more for an AR-style or maybe a Ruger Mini-14? I'm not real partial to caliber, though here in Memphis the only indoor range I know of where you can shoot a rifle allows only .223.

[gunsablazin]

I love my AR's,but own an AK as well, for your purposes it would be hard to beat the AK.

[The Rabbi]

What would be a good rifle to get for mostly protection purposes? This would not be for hunting or recreational shooting, though I would certainly shoot it enough to get proficient at it. I already have a shotgun, but I've been thinking about a rifle for defense outside of the home, like in a survival-type situation. Society breaks down, my wife and I have to get the hell out of the city, that sort of thing. Would a good old cheap Eastern-bloc AK do? Or should I spend a little more for an AR-style or maybe a Ruger Mini-14? I'm not real partial to caliber, though here in Memphis the only indoor range I know of where you can shoot a rifle allows only .223.

Hoo boy.

It depends on what you want to spend, how you're going to use it, and what you're after.

If it's something just to put away for a rainy day, I would want to spend the least possible for something that will work. That implies an SKS. Durable, cheap, uses cheap easily available ammo. Get some stripper clips and practice fast loading the gun.

Something with more capacity, an AK of some variant.

Something you will use for other stuff as well, an AR type. They are pretty durable, very ergonomic, and there is an amazing range of self defense ammo out there.

Or more retro, a lever gun like 30/30 stoked with Hornady Leverevolution.

Or just put a rifled slug barrel on the shotgun.

[nightrunner]

definetely an AR-15 but im sure there will be people on here who say that an AK is better....

also there is the sks. those three are the only rifles i would consider for your purpose.

im sure that given the situation you could make do with any rifle but i think the AR would be the proper weapon of choice.

[Guest 2HOW]

Most experts will say a .308 semi military rifle is a must when things go bad. I think a good AK or varient will be good in urban situations. A .308 if your in the country. or a 762x54 .

[DaveTN]

This would not be for hunting or recreational shooting, though I would certainly shoot it enough to get proficient at it.

like in a survival-type situation. Society breaks down, my wife and I have to get the hell out of the city, that sort of thing.

Well… you have ruled out target shooting, plinking and hunting. So all that is left is a combat rifle.

In a portable package 7.62 NATO is devastating compared to most other rounds and it comes in the same size package as a weak azz .223. It was a pretty easy choice for me… DPMS .308 Panther.

[The Rabbi]

True.

That's why the U.S. has won almost every military engagement in the last 40 years with the 7.62NATO battle rifle.

Oh, no. I guess we didn't.....

.308=expensive heavy ammo with large recoil. If people like it, great. I'd take 7.62x39 or .223 any day.

[Cruel Hand Luke]

.308 military style rifle like HK91 M1A FNFAL will shoot accurately far off, actually DO SOMETHING when it gets there, and shoot THROUGH the most stuff. Of course it is also the heaviest and ammo is pricey right now and the guns are not cheap either....

.223 /5.56 is lightweight, accurate, you can carry a bunch of ammo. You can take deer sized game with .223 -not ideal but doable- and they work pretty well on people when you do not have to shoot through stuff to hit them. It will shoot accurately at distance, but it loses steam fast after 300 yards. ARs are everywhere.....

7.62 x39 will shoot through stuff that .223 still thinks is cover. It will take deer easily -how many have taken deer with a 30/30? it is essentially the same thing. The AK platform is as reliable as anything made and more so than most things. It is also very robust and not nearly as maintenance sensitive as the AR or other rifles mentioned above. BUT it is realisticly a 200 yard and closer gun due to coarse sights. But how many shots do you REALLY see yourself taking past 200?

I agree with Rabbi (yes I really said that) on the SKS. It is cheap, reliable and has all the benefits of the 7.62x39 cartridge. Hard to beat the SKS on a budget. A lever gun or a pump might beok too, but they would be distant choices behind a good quality military style semi auto.

But you really cannot compare military use to civilian use. We kill people with bombs and belt fed guns not individual riflemen generally speaking in military combat. Yes we have done OK with 5.56 rifles, but that is such a small reason of why we win. We win because we have the best use of combined arms in the world. We have planes and helicopters and armor and ships and satellites and missiles and best trained and equipped (night vision,and other gear) ground troops all WORKING TOGETHER to accomlish victory. We darn sure do not win just because of the M16.......Our command and control orchestrate all these together better than anyone else and THAT is why we do so well.

Edited April 10, 2008 by Cruel Hand Luke

[Guest Revelator]

Is a high-capacity magazine SKS hard to find? Most of the ones I've seen have 10 rounds; I'd want more.

[Guest bkelm18]

Is a high-capacity magazine SKS hard to find? Most of the ones I've seen have 10 rounds; I'd want more.

Those are conversions. A true SKS does not take hi cap mags. It's not terribly hard to convert one but if you do, read up on 922r to keep it legal, but thats a whole 'nother discussion.

[nightrunner]

Those are conversions. A true SKS does not take hi cap mags. It's not terribly hard to convert one but if you do, read up on 922r to keep it legal, but thats a whole 'nother discussion.

cant an sks be modified to accept AK-style magazines?

i have done no research on the ak's or sks's as i have little to no interest in them but always appreciate newfound knowledge:D

[Paletiger13]

(TAVOR)Too bad we cant get them here in the States. If it wasnt impossible thats what I would want. Wish there was a way to get one. That would be my only choice if so.

AK variants are very good(reliable) compared to most AR-15's. A SKS would be good, but the high capacity mags take some getting used to. They seem to either jam alot from the mags and mag changes suck IMHO.

I say AK in .223 or 7.62x39mm.

[Guest bkelm18]

cant an sks be modified to accept AK-style magazines?

i have done no research on the ak's or sks's as i have little to no interest in them but always appreciate newfound knowledge:D

Yes they can, what I meant is that an SKS from the factory cannot take AK mags, they have to be modified in order to take AK mags.

[Guest Steelharp]

What kind of "protection?" Are you trying to protect 10 acres, or within the 12'x12' spaces in your home? I think a 9mm carbine or shotgun would be more than sufficient for within your own walls. If you're trying to repel an incoming horde on your property... you need friends.

[Guest darkstar]

I agree with Steelharp...carbine should be sufficient for home use. I have an M-4 type myself (5.56) It's not the first thing I would grab, but if I were over run with zombie brain eaters that's what I would go for...I know a lot of people consider a rifle as a good part of an overall home defense plan, personally I would use my handguns first, and the rifle would be more for a hunker down kind of thing, but what do I know? I haven't had 20 years of CQB training...the guns I used in the Army were a LOT bigger, and I haven't taken any special defensive carbine type classes either...I think an AR would be a good thing to get for the home though, or even more importantly to have fun with, because they are, in a word, FUN! I'm not knocking anyone's love of tactics and agree that protecting oneself is a very serious matter but don't most of us also like our guns because they are fun?

[nightrunner]

i once heard the practical application of guns for personal defense and it makes sense.

i use my handgun to protect myself.

i use my shotgun to protect my home.

i use my rifle to protect my property.

[Daniel]

I think an AR would be a good thing to get for the home though, or even more importantly to have fun with, because they are, in a word, FUN! I'm not knocking anyone's love of tactics and agree that protecting oneself is a very serious matter but don't most of us also like our guns because they are fun?

this is my opinion

[The Rabbi]

this is my opinion

And ask the man who carried one in battle.

I still think it will depend. If this is a rifle just to use a couple of times for familiarization and then put away until Ragnarok, the SKS makes the most sense. Cheap, easy to use, and reliable. And I wouldnt go converting it either. The N.Vietnamese did just fine, even using the rifle for sniping sometimes.

[Guest jackdog]

For a reeasonable price I have to agree with Rabbi, The SKS is a reliable weapon, and ammo is easy to get. After 3 tours of Nam and a few other places I've been to I,

'm not a big fan of ar type weapons.

[Daniel]

after i get an upper an sks is next on my list. then/maybe an ak. but eventually a 1911. hmm, i need a mosin, k98, and a 10/22. this could take awhile.

[ZenDog]

It is hard to have too much armament. But, I am a bicycle junkie, and I own 7 working bicycles- that isn't too many, yet, as far as I can tell!! Grain of salt time.

I think a 30 rd magazine is great for home defense/property defense. You can miss a few times and still have enough left to take care of business. With multiple bad guys in a Katrina/looting scenario, more is better. Get a few extra mags, keep them loaded, and you can shoot a lot of zombies.

I live close to Orange Mound/Whitehaven in Memphis, which are both tough, armed 'hoods. I consider it my duty as head of the household to think of this stuff- in a Katrina-type situation, lawlessness/looting might come my way after a few days.

You can get 2 decent AK's for roughly the price of 1 decent AR. I like them both, I own them both. In a Katrina-like situation, I hope I have access to both platforms.

My wife loves the AR due to the lack of recoil. She's kinda bony (I like 'em that way) and I think a weapon with a lot more recoil would be much more difficult for her to fire, or at least, to enjoy firing. When the zombies come, I want her to enjoy firing it.

I like shooting Ar's, I hate cleaning them-- lotsa nooks and crannies. The .223 won't penetrate as well as a 7.62X39 - if you are shooting at cars that can make a big difference.

Cancel cable, buy a smaller car, eat out less often, get a thermos instead of Starbuck's-- then you can buy more guns and more ammo more often.

[Guest Revelator]

I love this site. This is great information everyone, thanks. At first I wasn't concerned about caliber, but after people weighed in on things like weight and price of ammo it got me thinking. Any kind of safety/protection measures are going to be expensive, and since I'd want a lot of ammo (and who doesn't?) the cost is going to be a factor. But I also want it to be good quality and the two aren't always compatible.

I think it would be good to have a few hundred rounds of protection ammo--stuff you don't practice with but keep for emergencies. How long does it last? Like can you keep it stored for several years?

Also, while I want a rifle primarily for protection and defense, I would like to shoot it regularly for proficiency and also because it's just fun. In the big picture, I want a rifle for defensive use at more than a few feet, and I see this most likely happening during some kind of mass emergency. Maybe you have to get across town for supplies, or patrol the neighborhood, or just hit the road and get out.

After reading the responses and doing some research, I'm leaning towards an AK. I've always been turned off by the AK's image (weapon of choice for terrorists and war lords) but I can get over that. For price, durability, capacity and power, it seems like the best.

[The Rabbi]

Ammo lasts a long long time if stored properly. I have shot .45acp made in 1942 and it worked just fine. People tell me they have shot rounds made for WWI and they worked fine too.

In 7.62x39 there isnt much for personal protection vs range. You can get HP rounds. I am not sure they work any better than fmj stuff. I have a couple of boxes loaded with Hornady bullets, mainly for hunting. But that's a freak.

In the .223 there are lots of great self defense loads, like Hornady TAP in different grains.

The more you plan on using the gun, the more you can justify spending on it. At least for me.

[Smith]

After reading the responses and doing some research, I'm leaning towards an AK. I've always been turned off by the AK's image (weapon of choice for terrorists and war lords) but I can get over that. For price, durability, capacity and power, it seems like the best.

That's because they work and are cost effective when hiding in a jungle or cave.

[Guest Phantom6]

As someone else said, it depends on what type of area you wish to control.

For 150 yds. or less I'd pick my M-1 Carbine. That .30 cal. round is a nice one and the firearm is compact and battle proven reliable. As far as reaching out and touching someone the SKS with it's 7.62X39 round, makes for a good show-stopper. I'll take my AR-15, Ruger Mini-14 (or better yet my Mini-30 <7.62x39>) or my shotgun for CQB. But ............that's just me.