Camera/Taking Picture Help

[Guest db99wj]

I need some help, I'm using a Point and shoot, Canon PowerShot SD790 IS Digital Elph, 10.0 MP camera. It is what I have, not buying new equipment. Will save that discussion for another day. So let's not go there. The camera has different settings, Indoor, Kids and pets, Night snapshot, portrait, ISO3200, Underwater, Aquarium, Fireworks, Beach, Snow, Foilage, and Sunset.

Anyway, taking pictures in a gym, or other large high ceiling venue like a warehouse that has been converted into basketball or volleyball courts, with the existing lighting.

Auto with flash = Dark pictures

I've found with the flash off, the camera picks up the light better, but actions shots are blurry.

I used the "Indoor" setting this past weekend and it did ok, but the ball would be blurry, the girls arm would be blurry, etc.

How can I get a picture, of action, but in low light?

Like I said, I know I should buy a new camera, but I'm not, that is on down the road. The camera takes great pictures, except in a large gym, or warehouse. It's my work camera, and this can help me take pictures in warehouses as well.

Here's a pic of my 12 year old daughter

Light is fine, but blurry

[Guest bkelm18]

You might try upping your ISO, but I'm no expert.

[strickj]

Options:

1) Buy a new camera

2) Shine a million candle power spotlight on them.

3) Yell "FREEZE" when you get ready to take a pic.

Please report results of 2 and 3!

[NRA]

iso and shutter speed

[analog_kidd]

You'll probably have to fiddle around with the camera settings. Set the ISO up high, starting around 800 or 1000. The higher you go, the grainier the picture will be, so keep going till you find it unacceptable.

Set the camera for shutter priority and start with 1/250 of a second and work up. You'll want a fast shutter speed to stop the action. Try mixing high ISO with high shutter till you get the combination that works for you.

[quietguy]

First, turn your flash off in these situations. It is a fart in a whirlwind.

Second, make sure you have your Image Stabilization turned on. It will drain batteries faster, but helps.

You'll probably have to fiddle around with the camera settings. Set the ISO up high, starting around 800 or 1000. The higher you go, the grainier the picture will be, so keep going till you find it unacceptable.

Set the camera for shutter priority and start with 1/250 of a second and work up. You'll want a fast shutter speed to stop the action. Try mixing high ISO with high shutter till you get the combination that works for you.

This is pretty sound advice, but you may be able to back the shutter speed down to 1/125th and get acceptable results. Not likely, but it all depends on the speed of the objects.

Just doing a quick search, your camera doesn't appear to have a Shutter-Priority mode, so you will have to work from the Manual mode to optimize the image.

Set your aperture to the lowest number (should be somewhere between f/2.8 and f/4.9 depending on your zoom setting). I would set my ISO to 1600 and shutter speed to 1/125. Adjust the shutter speed until you get the image quality you are looking for. If the images are too grainy, then you have to drop both the shutter speed and ISO until you get things the way you want them (just show up a bit early and take some random shots at the approximate distance.

Also, gym lights can make colors render incorrectly. You can play with your white balance to fix that.

You aren't going to get professional results with your camera, but it has enough capability to do much better than your posted image.

Edited January 18, 2012 by quietguy

[East_TN_Patriot]

Basically, strikj is correct. The only way you can make this work with a basic point and shoot is to get enough light illuminating the scene. Proper exposure requires the correct amount of light to hit the sensor plate in the amount of time the shutter is open. To "freeze" action, you need a fast shutter speed, but that means that the aperture window needs to be open wider to let more light hit the sensor in that shorter amount of time. If you keep the shutter speed fast, but don't open the aperture further to let in more light, you'll end up with an underexposed photo. If you open it wider, then you can use a faster speed. Your point & shoot camera settings do all of this adjustment for you based on the light available. The camera detects the light levels and determines what the best balance of aperture opening and shutter speed will properly expose the sensor. In a darker inside room, the camera automatically opens the aperture and slows the shutter speed, which is just enough to cause your photo to be blurry. I hope that makes sense.

[Guest db99wj]

Dang. I need to buy a camera, it's for the children!

Thanks for the advice. Will play with it and see if I can get them better.

[quietguy]

Dang. I need to buy a camera, it's for the children!

I wouldn't get too worked up. Those types of environments are hard to shoot regardless of your camera. Try the tips above to see if you can get acceptable results, and I think you will be happier with the outcome. As with most technology, the most important thing is know how to maximize what you have and be aware of its limitations. You could spend $20k on equipment, and if you don't know how to use it the results will be the same.

[Oh Shoot]

If you must shoot at lower shutter speeds (like under 1/100 sec) get a monopod to at least take away most of the camera movement that YOU create. Action will still blur but at least stable objects will be sharp.

- OS

[quietguy]

If you must shoot at lower shutter speeds (like under 1/100 sec) get a monopod to at least take away most of the camera movement that YOU create. Action will still blur but at least stable objects will be sharp.

- OS

As OS stated, this will help with static objects, but not motion blur. The rule of thumb is that for handheld shots, your shutter speed should be greater then your focal length (which in a point-and-shoot camera usually has to be calculated based on your zoom factor) to eliminate image blur. The image stabilization feature of your camera should allow you to exceed this rule by one "stop" (either an aperture, shutter speed, or ISO setting).

Action blur, you have to be at a high enough shutter speed to exceed the motion of the subject. This effect is evident in your posted image. See how clear number 15 in black is compared to the other players?

Another item you have to take into consideration when analyzing your images is depth of field. When you set the aperture to its lowest setting, only certain objects will be within the focal capabilities of the lens. Notice how ref is out of focus, but has a different blur than the players on the court? This is caused by limited focal depth. The greater the f/stop, the deeper the depth of field.

[Oh Shoot]

...The greater the f/stop, the deeper the depth of field.

Always true, but in vast majority of digital cams, for tech reasons related to the senor size, the depth of field is greater at any given f/stop than with a 35mm film camera. Matter of fact, even shooting wide open (lowest f/stop, widest aperture), you often can't fuzz out the background as much as you'd like. But that's why there's Photoshop.

- OS

[quietguy]

Always true, but in vast majority of digital cams, for tech reasons related to the senor size, the depth of field is greater at any given f/stop than with a 35mm film camera. Matter of fact, even shooting wide open (lowest f/stop, widest aperture), you often can't fuzz out the background as much as you'd like. But that's why there's Photoshop.

- OS

This is true, but a little misleading. The determining factors are aperture, focal length, and image size (the sensor in digital photograph, the film surface in traditional photography). The greater the magnification in relation to the image size, the flatter the depth of field. Optically, the magnification is more important than the size of the sensor.

[Oh Shoot]

This is true, but a little misleading. The determining factors are aperture, focal length, and image size (the sensor in digital photograph, the film surface in traditional photography). The greater the magnification in relation to the image size, the flatter the depth of field. Optically, the magnification is more important than the size of the sensor.

Well, that's true too, but with equal focal lengths and f/stops, most all digicams will still give more depth of field than a 35mm film cam. (Actually, I haven't kept up with higher end ones in regard to sensor sizes, may not be true with the better SLR digicams now?)

This can be quite helpful in some situations (macro extreme closeups) but quite frustrating in others (blurring out beyond just the pretty lady sitting on fence).

- OS

[Guest Lester Weevils]

Yep it may even possibly be a corrolary of heisenberg uncertainty principle. Except in excellent illumination, the "grainy" information loss at high shutter speed might look about as equally fuzzy as the "motion blur" information loss at slow shutter speed.

There may be a tendency toward different flavors but equivalent amounts of fuzzy either way?

Heisenberg shows up lots of places, not just the subatomic realm. Free lunch might not be impossible but it is pretty dang rare.

Am not being rigorous and completely serious, but ain't completely joking either. The imaging issue does not seem radically different from the Heisenberg dilemma where a short fourier time window shows poor frequency discrimination but a long fourier time window shows poor temporal resolution.

Sometimes there can be a "sweet spot" somewhere in the tradeoffs, but sometimes there ain't.

[Oh Shoot]

Yep it may even possibly be a corrolary of heisenberg uncertainty principle. Except in excellent illumination, the "grainy" information loss at high shutter speed might look about as equally fuzzy as the "motion blur" information loss at slow shutter speed. ...

Yeah, everything is a trade off still in this regard. When you "push" film you increase "grain". Same with digital increases "noise".

Somewhat I guess related to the Heisenberg thing is the "circle of confusion" and how it relates to perception of sharp/blur in depth of field.

Btw, the "blur" or "fuzz" itself created by depth of field has its own characteristics and look, collectively referred to as "bokeh". Wiki is down for protest, but here's a decent synopsis:

Bokeh

- OS

Edited January 18, 2012 by OhShoot

[strickj]

People are getting awfully techie for a P&S camera here

You might wanna try the Aquarium setting. That should turn your flash off and up your shutter speed and iso to it's max.

Or you can try to get within flash range of the players. The flash will freeze the motion and all but eliminate your blur

[peejman]

Set the camera to shutter speed priority mode, I believe it's "Tv" on the dial. Set the shutter speed to 1/250 and see what happens. If the images are still too dark, increase the shutter speed one click at a time until it is. If you can't get good images at a shutter speed faster than 1/100, do a little post processing to lighten them or petition the gym for better lighting.

[Guest db99wj]

Ok, the point and shoot thing isn't going to work, I did figure out how to get some faster pictures, less blurry, but it is not great, and the shutter speed is still a little slow. Also, it is a one and done picture, want the ability to take multiple shots in a row. So I have decided to upgrade, nothing fancy, nothing too expensive, and even looking at some of the Cannon and Nikon DSLR kits at Sam's for around $700-$800.

Then a friend/cousin on wife's side, announces he is selling some stuff, and it includes a Canon Rebel XT dslr 10.1MP w/kit lens, which I am assuming is 2 lenses, probably a 18 to 55mmand a 55 to 250mm. I can't find an XT that is 10.1mp, they are all 8.1mp. The XTi is a 10.1 and the XS is a 10.1. Either way, used, and he rates his an 8 out of 10, is start from $300 to $345 dollars for used and go up from there to "like new" models. I can get this for $200.

He is suppose to take some pictures of the camera....with the camera.....and send them to me later.

Sound like a good deal?

[peejman]

$200 for that is an excellent deal. I'd buy it in a second. Take the extra cash and buy a good lens.

Read this...

[Guest db99wj]

Awesome. Got to make sure it is what it is first.

[Guest db99wj]

Dang deal fell through. will be going a different route, but will be buying a DSLR soon.

[Guest db99wj]

Ok, picked up a Cannon EOS Rebel T3 Refurb model, 12.2 DSLR. I like the way it feels, biggest complaint is the grip and the "plastic', but it seems fine to me and is comfortable in the hand for me. The picture quality seems very good from the camera anyway, haven't downloaded any pics yet. Got a lot of settings that I have no idea what they do. It is a little slow if you just pick up and try to shoot, but if you are anticipating a shot, and you have the shutter button half way down, it will take a pic very quickly.

I also got an 8gig memory card, do I need to format it? It says that I should in the manual, but it seems to recognize it. I have room for 1400 plus pics.

I couldn't get it to take a picture earlier in a low light situation, was just messing with it taking random pics under the auto mode.

Any suggestions, or comments appreciated.

[mcurrier]

Got a lot of settings that I have no idea what they do. It is a little slow if you just pick up and try to shoot, but if you are anticipating a shot, and you have the shutter button half way down, it will take a pic very quickly.

I also got an 8gig memory card, do I need to format it? It says that I should in the manual, but it seems to recognize it. I have room for 1400 plus pics.

I couldn't get it to take a picture earlier in a low light situation, was just messing with it taking random pics under the auto mode.

Any suggestions, or comments appreciated.

If you place the camera in manual-focus mode (switch is on lens), it will fire virtually instantly when you depress the shutter button. Zoom in to the area where the action will be taking place and focus and then you should be good to go for that general area (distance-wise). Using auto focus in low light and/or during action is going to slow down when the camera reacts and actually triggers the shutter.

Format the card in-camera before use the first time so that it is 'formatted' correctly for use with that camera. Not absolutely required, but I salvage a lot of images for people who don't do that and their card either corrupts or locks up and then they lose their images. After removing card from camera and downloading images to computer for storage.editing, reformat card upon inserting in camera again if you intend to clear the card out and make room for new photos. Use the "format card" option in the menu, not "erase card/images", that will eventually lead to problems with corrupt/lost images.

1400 plus pics on an 8GB card sounds like you have the resolution set to around "medium". As a professional, I shoot just about everything in RAW mode. You may want to set the camera to LARGE/FINE JPG or to MED/FINE JPG to get usable images for reprints 8x10 and larger. If you have the quality set too low, you'll just be shooting images that are good for the web, Facebook and maybe 4x6 prints.

Do not put the camera control dial on the green box, that will eliminate almost all manual control and slow the camera down. Go with P(rogram) at first, but then eventually learn how to use manual to control the shutter speed and aperture to get the desired results that you are looking for.

One rule regarding lenses and blurry images, your shutter speed needs to be set to roughly the same number as the focal length of the lens you are using to avoid blurry images do to a too slow shutter speed and camera shake while the shutter is open. If you are using a 100mm lens, then the shutter speed need to be at least 1/100 of a second. Image stabilization somewhat negates this, but not much. This rule is very important if not using flash.

There are volumes more of information, but this is the quick and dirty to get you started.

Edited June 15, 2012 by mcurrier

[RichardR]

I had a 10 mp Canon powershot like yours and I could never figure out how to get it to take good action shots either, it took great static shots though. Anyway about 6 months ago I upgraded to a Kodak Ezshare Z5010 and it is much much better camera all-around, while it has a ton of various noob friendly settings, my favorite feature on it is the ability to hold down the button and take a string of photos one right after the other, which makes capturing the action of my kids soccer games a lot easier.

The optics on the Kodak are also way better than on the Canon, the Kodak is a 25-525mm Schneider-KREUZNACH lense, which I guess is supposed to be pretty good for a point & shoot, the digital autofocus and image stabilizer are both a lot faster than on the Canon, resolution is also 14 megapixels compared to the Canon's 10 mp.

Anyway I only paid $199 for the Kodak at Walmart & I am very happy with it.