Speaking of Gangs

[Dennis1209]

A little history. I lived in a little village established in 1699 named Cahokia, IL., it is actually listed as East St. Louis, IL. I bought a nice quaint modest home there in 1980. When I purchased the residence, it was a very nice subdivision, friendly neighbors, well kept lawns, absolutely no litter and well maintained homes, etc. Then about the year 2000 the neighbors started to do the Section 8 thing, and it was all down hill from there. It wasn't long before the crime in the subdivision escalated 10,000%. Gang bangers standing in the subdivision street blocking your egress and staring you down, crack and drug houses in the subdivision, an escalation of home invasions and burglaries in the neighborhood and intimidation outside your home. To add insult to injury, Illinois requires you have a FOID card just to touch a gun, and you better not have one ready to go in your vehicle. Four thousand dollars per year property taxes...

Now, I'm a combat veteran and one not willing to cower down to the evil of this world. However, I have a wife, family and property that will suffer if I make a choice to stand my ground. If the law and law enforcement can't control the gangs and crime, what makes me think I can protect my family and property? If I force someone trespassing on my property off, shoot a gang banger in my house, etc., there will be severe reprisals to pay for my family / myself. It's a NO win situation!

Myself and my family had to endure this escalating criminal environment for two additional years until I became eligible for retirement and move. Even though I lost 80% of the appraised value of my home trying to sell it for three years, I had the financial means to get the hell out of Dodge, and I was thankful. Moving to Tennessee was a God send for us.

So, given the millions of people experiencing this scary existence like I did, what's the solution, if there is one? Personal protection won't do you any good when there is an army of evil ready to do you and your family in if you protect yourself.

[sigbear]

I also moved to NW Tennessee earlier this year from the Liberal Republic of Massachusetts, however, my neighborhood wasn't gang infested like yours but it was getting worse every year. My wife was attacked in our own driveway by a junky yielding a 4' metal carpenters level, lucky she thought quickly and got in the car, locked the doors drove off and called the police. I hear ya, if I had caught him chasing my wife who knows how it would have gone down. My wife has since gotten her CCW. Don't even think about reprisals when it comes to protecting your family just use your head and things will be fine. Tennessee is a wonderful State with like minded folks and a whole lot smarter than where came from to.

Sigbear

[Slasher]

Unfortunately I don't think there is an easy answer to this but it is something that has been going on in Memphis for quite a while. Here is a link to a story back in 2008 that covers the whole thing with Section 8 housing and how crime spreads with it. American Murder Mystery - Magazine - The Atlantic

It is a pretty long read but worth it after seeing Memphis go down year after year as you watch it spread.

[FJCrusing]

This was from February of 2011 but is the 11 Most Dangerous Cities with Memphis being number 6.

The 11 Most Dangerous Cities - US News and World Report

[gl19gobang]

There are restrictions to property like no single wide trailers can be put on this lot, limits to the size of the house built on the lot, the house must be brick, the house must be etc..... But they cant say the property can never go to section 8?

A little history. I lived in a little village established in 1699 named Cahokia, IL., it is actually listed as East St. Louis, IL. I bought a nice quaint modest home there in 1980. When I purchased the residence, it was a very nice subdivision, friendly neighbors, well kept lawns, absolutely no litter and well maintained homes, etc. Then about the year 2000 the neighbors started to do the Section 8 thing, and it was all down hill from there. It wasn't long before the crime in the subdivision escalated 10,000%. Gang bangers standing in the subdivision street blocking your egress and staring you down, crack and drug houses in the subdivision, an escalation of home invasions and burglaries in the neighborhood and intimidation outside your home. To add insult to injury, Illinois requires you have a FOID card just to touch a gun, and you better not have one ready to go in your vehicle. Four thousand dollars per year property taxes...

Now, I'm a combat veteran and one not willing to cower down to the evil of this world. However, I have a wife, family and property that will suffer if I make a choice to stand my ground. If the law and law enforcement can't control the gangs and crime, what makes me think I can protect my family and property? If I force someone trespassing on my property off, shoot a gang banger in my house, etc., there will be severe reprisals to pay for my family / myself. It's a NO win situation!

Myself and my family had to endure this escalating criminal environment for two additional years until I became eligible for retirement and move. Even though I lost 80% of the appraised value of my home trying to sell it for three years, I had the financial means to get the hell out of Dodge, and I was thankful. Moving to Tennessee was a God send for us.

So, given the millions of people experiencing this scary existence like I did, what's the solution, if there is one? Personal protection won't do you any good when there is an army of evil ready to do you and your family in if you protect yourself.

[mikegideon]

I lived in Cahokia as a kid. It was always a blue collar town, but was a decent place to live when my parents moved us out of there (when I was in the 8th grade). Today, it's a horrible place. My cousin retired from a job with the village two years ago, and I have a couple of lifelong friends that still live there. The cops are good guys, but their hands are tied. Corrupt local government, and the state make the place what it is.

Glad you escaped. My cousin lost money on her house to. She lives in Missouri now.

[AMSting]

I was born in Belleville, which has the same problems as Cahokia. Last year I drove by the places I grew up in and wouldn't even think of living there now. I also won't drive through those areas again . At least my parents live in the country with good neighbors and dogs, so they are better protected than most. My dad even thought about moving here since he can't carry, but my mom won't leave.

As for what to do, carpet bombing comes to mind.

[Guest Lester Weevils]

Small world. I lived in Maryville for about a year and Cahokia for about a year in the junior high years before the family moved down to New Orleans for the next few years. Dads seemed to have to move a lot working for big corporations back then.

I didn't especially enjoy living in IL but it wasn't too bad. That was back in the greaser era. Some of the greaser punks were pretty tough out in the burbs even back then, but not as bad as today. East St. Louis has been dangerous a long time. You really didn't want to spend much time in East St. Louis even in the late 1950's.

Edited January 3, 2012 by Lester Weevils

[Dennis1209]

It's so sad and scary living in an environment like that if you can't escape. Your decent kids getting battered and harassed walking home from school. Can't play outside and go to neighborhood friends homes to visit for fear of getting jumped. Worry about your kids joining the gang to stop the beatings and harassment. Secure yourself inside your home the best you can to prevent a home invasion. If you're lucky enough to obtain a FOID card and have a self defense weapon, you're hesitant to use it for fear of the gang bangers retaliation on your wife, children, home and property. The "Peoples Republic of Illinois" trying to imprison you for self defense. What a life.

There are millions of decent law abiding citizens experiencing this on a daily basis. Many or most do not have the means to uproot and relocate to a better neighborhood. I know what I would have liked to do. But, it's against the law, would have put my family in mortal danger, and being employed, you can't be home when it occurs.

From the preceding responses, I assume no one has a recommendation or suggestion on how to curtail and eliminate the degradation and decline of civilized living?

Let's talk about it...

[gregintenn]

Welcome to Tennessee. I've been to Cahokia, and while I enjoyed visiting the indian mounds there, I didn't find the town itsself very inviting. To answer your question, I don't believe a whole lot can be done about the current moral decline of our society. I expect it will fall eventually, and something new will take it's place. Not the answer you were looking for, but if history repeats itsself.....

[Guest Mad4rcn]

I was born in Belleville, which has the same problems as Cahokia. Last year I drove by the places I grew up in and wouldn't even think of living there now. I also won't drive through those areas again . At least my parents live in the country with good neighbors and dogs, so they are better protected than most. My dad even thought about moving here since he can't carry, but my mom won't leave.

As for what to do, carpet bombing comes to mind.

​Have to start somewhere !!!

[Guest Eagle Heart]

Born and raised in St. Louis, stationed at Scott AFB 3 tiimes for a total of 7 years of my 21 year career, lived in Belleville, Swansee and Fairview Heights and on base during these times. Drove through all of this area while there and the longer we were there the more and more dangerous it became. The world has come to our door and it is as dangerous as anyone can imagine. Was in Memphis today and heard of several shootings which happened just recently. I now live in Crockett county Tennessee and there are only around 20,000 residents in the whole county and we have shootings in about the same percentage as the rest of West Tennessee. Stationed in Italy for 3 years and we were always being warned as Amerians to be aware of "The Red Brigade" activity against us. So hunker down, shoot straight and keep your powder dry....

[Guest lostpass]

One of the problems is that ST. Louis is a dying city. More unemployment, more poverty, more crime. A lot of the industry has left St. Louis and this has a direct impact on the surrounding areas. East St. Louis has been a scary place forever (I think they filmed Escape from New York there) but with the additional loss of jobs it is just getting worse.

Shame really, I've spent a lot of time in St. Louis and enjoyed it. I go back there now and places I used to feel good at are scary. On the other hand, a few places I felt scared at before I feel perfectly safe. But only because they are abandoned. I suspect the way cities go down is as follows: First people get transferred. Then people get laid off. Then people get out. At some point the only people that are left are the ones who couldn't leave. By then everything is too far gone to matter.

[inspecting1]

Gotta love a place where mickey D's has bullet proof glass.

[Oh Shoot]

Hot news flash: an America where half the population or less supports the rest can only go one way -- into decline.

Waste and corruption accelerate that inevitability.

I'd say we should be grateful for the illegal underground economy; probably the only thing keeping things from total breakdown so far.

- OS

Edited January 4, 2012 by OhShoot