run in with the twra today ,carry question?

[ccarrier]

today i was fishing on boone lake. i had left my firearm in my truck due to a sign the state had put on the property i was on " no firearms,alcohol or open fires" (or something of that nature)

the twra officers check my license ( fishing and drivers) noticed my permit and asked if i was armed.

i told them no, bc of the sign

the twra officer told me it was ok to carry there and didnt know why the sign was there.

im confused.... any thoughts?

[Garufa]

That sign does not apply to HCP holders.

[hornett22]

not very comforting that they don't know why the sign is there.

[ccarrier]

it made me feel a little uneasy not knowing what i can and cannot do.

[Garufa]

it made me feel a little uneasy not knowing what i can and cannot do.

Welcome to carrying in TN.

[wcsc12]

That sign does not apply to HCP holders.

Interesting. Do the signs on TVA property that say no guns apply to HCP holders as well?

[MikePapa1]

Interesting. Do the signs on TVA property that say no guns apply to HCP holders as well?

Yes. TVA property is federal. At least, that's my understanding.

[Oh Shoot]

Yes. TVA property is federal. At least, that's my understanding.

Some is, like the actual dam sites, some is just has some degree of federal jurisdiction, like the lake boundaries. There is no federal statute about carrying on federal lands, only federal buildings. However, a federal agency can post a TN complaint sign to forbid carrying like any other biz.

There may be some TVA federal "rules" that apply though, like Dept. of Interior ones used to ban firearms in National Parks. Never seen any cited, though.

Who knows who put up the sign OP is referring to and under what guise. Perhaps it is even county "park" land? (in which case it isn't properly posted either).

- OS

Edited December 29, 2011 by OhShoot

[Fallguy]

Many state parks still have no firearms signs.....they do not apply to HCP holders.

They law kept them from being removed for money reasons that may have killed the bill otherwise.

I'm still not 100% sure about those signs at TVA property myself. That same sign is at the entrance to Beech Lake in Lexington. There is a TVA Dam there, but the only LE I've seen there is Lexington PD.

[Guest pfries]

This is from my posts on another forum I take part in

TVA: Norris Reservoir

TVA is still able to limit carry, as the rules read now you cannot carry on developed lands. To the best of my knowledge this has not changed since TFA touched with them on the subjec in October of last year. Link to very limited high lights below. I will try and find the email corispondance to post as well.

http://www.examiner.com/gun-rights-i...ontacts-needed

"With title 70 being amended and allowing carry on TWRA lands is was thought that boat ramps would also be allowed as well. According to TWRA law enforcement it is ok but beware. TVA does not allow it even though TWRA does. If you are at a TVA boat dock (even if it is posted with a TWRA sign) with your carry gun you can be fined, your firearm confiscated and they can also take your truck and boat. More on this later. Following are TVA regs."

"Officer Jack Paul asked me to respond directly to you about your questions regarding possession of firearms on TVA land.

Possession of firearms for lawful purposes generally is allowed on undeveloped TVA recreation land. Possession of firearms generally is not allowed on developed TVA property such as TVA dam reservations, campgrounds, picnic pavilions, day use areas, and boat ramps, except that firearms usually may be possessed at TVA campgrounds and boat ramps if the possession is associated with an in-season hunting excursion and the firearms are unloaded and properly cased. In specific situations, TVA land may be posted with signs about whether possession of firearms is allowed.

TVA has established these policies in accordance with its authority under the TVA Act to manage the land under its custody and control.

There are no published regulations on the subject. Rather, TVA implements these policies through internal TVA management guidelines and appropriate signage. TVA likely would consider it to be a trespass if someone were to carry a firearm on TVA property in violation of a posted TVA sign or contrary to direction from a TVA Police Officer or land manager.

Mark Hastings

Senior Attorney"

See page 35 on link

http://www.tva.gov/foia/pdf/code_of_conduct.pdf

327.13 Explosives, firearms, other weapons and fireworks.

(a) The possession of loaded firearms, ammunition, loaded projectile firing devices, bows and arrows, crossbows, or other weapons is prohibited unless:

(1) In the possession of a Federal, state or local law enforcement officer;

(2) Being used for hunting or fishing as permitted under 327.8, with devices being unloaded when transported to, from or between hunting and fishing sites;

(3) Being used at authorized shooting ranges; or

(4) Written permission has been received from the District Commander.

( Possession of explosives or explosive devices of any kind, including fireworks or other pyrotechnics, is prohibited unless written permission has been received from the District Commander.

Letter in ref. to law changes for USACE held properties

February 22, 2010

New Federal Law Pertaining To Firearms on National Park/National Wildlife Service Lands Is Not Applicable at USACE Projects and Facilities

All -- a new law regarding firearms on some specific federal properties takes effect next week. This is not new information for us, and we have been reviewing it for quite a while. Counsel has been fully engaged. We offer the following guidance:

1. Section 512 of the Credit Card Act of 2009 (Public Law 111-024) pertains to possession of firearms and allows an individual to possess an assembled or functional firearm in any unit of the National Park Service or National Wildlife Refuge System provided that the individual is not otherwise prohibited by law from possessing the firearm and the possession is in compliance with the law of the State in which the National Park/Refuge is located. This law becomes effective on 22 February 2010 on property under the jurisdiction of the National Park Service or the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service.

2. Public Law 111-024 does not apply to Corps projects or facilities. The passage of this new law does not affect application of Title 36 regulations (36 C.F.R., Chapter III, Part 327, Rules and Regulations Governing Public Use of COE Water Resources Development Projects). 36 C.F.R. § 327.13(a) prohibits the possession of loaded firearms or ammunition on lands and waters administered by the Corps unless one of the exceptions in 36 C.F.R. § 327.13(a)(1)-(4) applies. The full text of 36 C.F.R. can be viewed on the NRM Gateway at: http://corpslakes.usace.army.mil/emp...fs/title36.pdf.

3. 36 C.F.R. § 327.13 remains in full force and effect. It will continue to prohibit loaded concealed weapons on Corps properties regardless of the new law and notwithstanding any contrary provisions of State law. It remains Corps policy that we will not honor State-issued concealed weapon permits on our facilities and that District Commanders do not have discretion under 36 C.F.R. § 327.13(a)(4) to create blanket exceptions to this policy. A change of this nature to Corps regulations in 36 C.F.R. Part 327 would require formal rulemaking procedures under the Administrative Procedures Act (5 U.S.C. §§ 551-706).

4. It is incumbent upon us to communicate and reinforce our firearms regulation with our visitors and partners, which may include posting park entrances with No Firearms signs IAW the Corps sign manual (EP 310-1-6a and EP 310-1-6b) and taking other actions deemed necessary by Operations Project Managers as coordinated appropriately with other Corps elements. Information related to this matter will also be posted for public awareness on the NRM Gateway.

5. HQUSACE POCs for this matter are Stephen Austin, Natural Resources Manager, Operations (for Visitor Assistance policy and program administration information), 202-761-4489, stephen.b.austin@usace.army.mil; and Milt Boyd, Assistant Counsel, Office of Chief Counsel (for regulatory questions on federal lands) at 202-761-8546, Milton.W.Boyd@usace.army.mil.

Provided for your attention and appropriate action.

Michael G. Ensch, SES

[Guest WyattEarp]

not very comforting that they don't know why the sign is there.

not very comforting to know it was our tax dollars that printed that sign, lol.

[Oh Shoot]

...If you are at a TVA boat dock (even if it is posted with a TWRA sign) with your carry gun you can be fined, your firearm confiscated and they can also take your truck and boat. More on this later....

More on this later, indeed.

I doubt seriously that has EVER happened, or WILL ever happen, and if it does, will force a change in TVA "rules".

I'm thinking with TVA, as with most federal agencies, it's about time for the states to take control over federal entities in their own states.

- OS

Edited December 29, 2011 by OhShoot

[Mason]

It is my understanding from speaking with a TWRA agent (on Boone as well) that the signs are in place to prevent target practice on the boat ramps. As any duck hunter knows, TVA property is legal to hunt. I spend a ton of time on Boone lake and carry on my person when fishing and in my boat when wakeboarding & such. I have had conversations with TWRA agents with handguns in open view on my boat and have never recieved any comments. Also TVA properties are legal to hunt provided you follow all local laws.

OP, if you are in a boat would it not be covered under the castle doc. just like the car that you left it in?

Out of sight = out of mind.

[Guest pfries]

More on this later, indeed.

I doubt seriously that has EVER happened, or WILL ever happen, and if it does, will force a change in TVA "rules".

I'm thinking with TVA, as with most federal agencies, it's about time for the states to take control over federal entities in their own states.

- OS

That part was a quote from another poster, we do need clarification on this major grey area. I have personaly never had a problem although I do not use the "developed land" much and do not carry the few times we do go to areas that would be considered developed.

if he gets back with the more on that later I will be sure to update here as well.

[ccarrier]

i just like to keep myself "legal" so, i wanted to ask

[Guest bkelm18]

i just like to keep myself "legal" so, i wanted to ask

Park carry is probably the least understood area of carrying in TN. Mainly because local municipalities have the option of doing whatever the F they want, and State Parks have those stupid signs that they aren't required to change. Couple park property and TVA property and you've just got a cluster**** of confusing signs and laws.

[Oh Shoot]

Park carry is probably the least understood area of carrying in TN. Mainly because local municipalities have the option of doing whatever the F they want, and State Parks have those stupid signs that they aren't required to change. Couple park property and TVA property and you've just got a cluster**** of confusing signs and laws.

I have a overarching, comprehensive, and sophisticated defense plan should I ever be accosted about carrying past any sign -- "oh, I'm so sorry, I didn't see it, I'll be going now."

- OS