Magazine Loading -- First Round FMJ Followed by JHP?

[bigwakes]

Has anybody seen a comparison between hollow point and FMJ ammo? Like with ballistic gelatin.

Nope. It's never been done and there are no YouTube videos to look at the results.

[shaftbass]

My opinion is that if you feel the need to load a gun where the first round fired is going to do less damage to YOUR OWN BODY than the other rounds loaded in it because you feel like you may accidentally shoot yourself, you shouldn't own/handle/carry firearms.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0uytPO0UaDM

[xRUSTYx]

AND BOY! This must be a very close-to-the-heart subject because it appears everyone is treating the matter like you're talkin about their mama. Damn!

Man ... I sure know how to start interesting threads LOL

Certainly does sound like this is a matter close to the heart for most folks, but, ammo choice can be

My opinion is that if you feel the need to load a gun where the first round fired is going to do less damage to YOUR OWN BODY than the other rounds loaded in it because you feel like you may accidentally shoot yourself, you shouldn't own/handle/carry firearms.

You're right, I shouldn't own firearms, nor protect my family, due to the fact I have decided to carry an FMJ round in the chamber .... Christ, it goes from an ammo discussion, to someone saying I shouldn't carry or even OWN firearms BECAUSE of my ammo choice (that's essentially putting me in the same boat as a convicted felon). Take off your tin foil hat Reef ....

[shaftbass]

No tinfoil hat here. Handle the firearm safely and you won't shoot yourself. That's it.

It has nothing to do with the ammo choice. It's the reason for the ammo choice: You are concerned about accidentally discharging the firearm. It's pretty easy for that to not happen. See the video I posted above.

[xRUSTYx]

No tinfoil hat here. Handle the firearm safely and you won't shoot yourself. That's it.

It has nothing to do with the ammo choice. It's the reason for the ammo choice: You are concerned about accidentally discharging the firearm. It's pretty easy for that to not happen. See the video I posted above.

If an accident was "intentional" it wouldn't be an accident. For those that don't understand the correct definition of accident, lets take a look at dictionary.com

ac·ci·dent [ak-si-duhnt] Show IPA

noun 1. an undesirable or unfortunate happening that occurs unintentionally and usually results in harm, injury, damage, or loss; casualty; mishap: automobile accidents.

Many times you can't stop an accident from happening (in a negligent discharge case, you can for the most part), but I come back to my same rational of thinking.

I'd rather be prepared for an accident, than not prepared.

Everyday Life Example:

Wearing a seat belt while driving. While you don't think you'll have an accident while driving, ACCIDENTS happen. So, will you not wear a seatbelt simply because you don't want to? Sure, there are plenty of people that don't. I don't on short trips, but preparing or being prepared for something unseen is part of helping control the outcome in your favor as opposed to something worse.

Firearm Example:

There are plenty of people that won't carry cocked & locked, or even keep one in the chamber. I have seen TON's of these types of people come & go on TGO. While I do not agree with this stance and feel its more of a liability since they will need to take the time to rack it, that's their own prerogative. Telling them they shouldn't carry period is a bit over the top, because as an adult & permit holder, they are free to decide if/when they carry, and how they do so.

I carry an single FMJ round in the chamber, backed by JHP rounds. Not because I plan to be negligent, or feel my booger finger doesn't have enough training to keep my finger outside of the trigger guard. But because, I feel more confident with it there & feel it would do a better job of protecting myself & family.

You may entirely disagree, and thankfully, we live in a free nation and your are 100% entitled to your thoughts & opinions, I just felt you were taking it a bit far saying that because I prepare for an unfortunate accident (IE: Wearing a seatbelt) -- I shouldn't own firearms. If that same reason carried over to other parts of my life, I shouldn't own a car either.

[shaftbass]

That's fine. The way I read it, you carried the FMJ first so that if you shot yourself (either "accidentally" or "negligently" or whatever other word from the dictionary one chooses), it wouldn't do as much damage as a hollow point.

Perhaps I interpreted what you wrote incorrectly. If I did, then I apologize.

My feelings on gun safety are that if you imagine that if you have an accidental charge, it's going to kill someone you love. If you think like that, you will be so conscious of safety that you will never have an accidental or neglegent discharge, and therefore would have no need to worry what kind of round is coming out of the barrel first.

[Guest peacexxl]

You may entirely disagree, and thankfully, we live in a free nation and your are 100% entitled to your thoughts & opinions, I just felt you were taking it a bit far saying that because I prepare for an unfortunate accident (IE: Wearing a seatbelt) -- I shouldn't own firearms. If that same reason carried over to other parts of my life, I shouldn't own a car either.

This analogy only fits if you refuse to drive more than 10 mph because you don't want to get hurt. A guns and cars are both very dangerous tools but if you use them properly, you can minimize the risk while still taking full advantage of the these purpose built tools.

[daddyo]

Appreciate any and all comments!

Guess you didn't really mean this then?

[xRUSTYx]

That's fine. The way I read it, you carried the FMJ first so that if you shot yourself (either "accidentally" or "negligently" or whatever other word from the dictionary one chooses), it wouldn't do as much damage as a hollow point.

Perhaps I interpreted what you wrote incorrectly. If I did, then I apologize.

My feelings on gun safety are that if you imagine that if you have an accidental charge, it's going to kill someone you love. If you think like that, you will be so conscious of safety that you will never have an accidental or neglegent discharge, and therefore would have no need to worry what kind of round is coming out of the barrel first.

My feelings on gun safety are just that ... I'm always aware of where my carry gun is, and other firearms around the house. When our little one comes along in 6 months, I will take these precautions to an even more exclusive level. I'm pretty confident in my gun handeling skills. I clean, tear down my firearms all the time, and take extra care to make sure ammo isn't around, and firearms are fully empty before being worked on etc... Perhaps I feel just an added sense of comfort. Now, my comfort level isn't "complacency" per say, as I have 100% the same thinking whether it was a JHP or FMJ round, and carry myself accordingly, I just happen to feel better prepared.

You may entirely disagree, and thankfully, we live in a free nation and your are 100% entitled to your thoughts & opinions, I just felt you were taking it a bit far saying that because I prepare for an unfortunate accident (IE: Wearing a seatbelt) -- I shouldn't own firearms. If that same reason carried over to other parts of my life, I shouldn't own a car either.

This analogy only fits if you refuse to drive more than 10 mph because you don't want to get hurt. A guns and cars are both very dangerous tools but if you use them properly, you can minimize the risk while still taking full advantage of the these purpose built tools.

Using a firearm correctly has nothing to do with the type of ammo loaded. Gun safety is gun safety ... Ammo used, is ones own personal choice. Minimizing Risk = Wearing a seat belt, and in my opinion, keeping an FMJ round in the chamber.

Guess you didn't really mean this then?

Oh, I did ... I didn't think the thread would turn in to such a negative fashion though haha

I have to remember, many firearm owners have diehard opinions -- I see it on many of the forums I visit ... I should probably learn not to take things personal, and remember that everyone is entitled to his/her opinions

[bigwakes]

When I first carried I had similar concerns. I had a Glock 23 in a cloth $6 Uncle Mikes IWB holster, so I carried with no round in the chamber. I got so nervous about it that I switched to an HK USPc so I could have a safety. Then I figured out if the trigger is covered with a good holster there is nothing to worry about. I have now carried Glocks for over 10 years without worry or issue. One precaution I take is I never put the pistol into the holster while it's in the waistband. I always pull the holster out insert the pistol and put the entire holster with gun back in place. Call it paranoia or watching too many YouTube videos, but I prefer caution over pain.

I guess my point is that if you want to be cautious about accidents there is more than one way to do that. I will always carry JHP in my carry weapon for all the reasons listed in this thread.

[daddyo]

I'll be the first to admit that I ain't the brightest bulb, but I've handled firearms since I was a kid, and I've had one ND, which was no one's fault but my own and was because I was being STUPID. Nothing accidental about it.

[BlackHawk93]

In talking to them afterward, most said they weren't sure what was going on because they never thought about an emergency occuring in that context and it completely threw them off guard. Mental preparation means a lot and that's why we set things up to fake an emergency. Sometimes people expect things to happen in certain places but never expect them in others. This was a small county (less than 20k pop.) hospital and the administration had us come in because they hadn't been able to get the staff to take CPR training. Only 1 Dr. and 2 nurses in the whole hospital were certified at the time.

WOW. Just goes to show ya, huh? Thanks for the additional info. Very interesting, indeed.

I carry an single FMJ round in the chamber, backed by JHP rounds. Not because I plan to be negligent, or feel my booger finger doesn't have enough training to keep my finger outside of the trigger guard. But because, I feel more confident with it there & feel it would do a better job of protecting myself & family.

If you don't trust your gun handling abilities enough to keep a defensive round in the chamber maybe you should keep the chamber empty. Then when you pull the trigger accidently you wont have anything to worry about. Better than a FMJ going through alot of things you never intended it to.

Edited December 2, 2011 by BlackHawk93

[xRUSTYx]

If you don't trust your gun handling abilities enough to keep a defensive round in the chamber maybe you should keep the chamber empty. Then when you pull the trigger accidently you wont have anything to worry about. Better than a FMJ going through alot of things you never intended it to.

find me an article or example where an FMJ round passed through the intended target and hit something of "worthiness"