Employee / customer?

[gl19gobang]

My wife works in a grocery store (pharmacy) and company policy does not allow employees to carry on the job.

What about when she is a customer in there buying groceries?

Anybody know or should we just find out from the store?

[Photoguy67]

I would find out from the store to be certain, however most places consider the person an employee on or off the clock.

[Guest WestonGray]

I was wondering the same thing the other day. Before I had my permit, I worked at a company that didn't allow carry by employees. Looking back, I was wondering what the case would be if I was off the clock. Not sure what the law says, but I'm sure they would try to say she is still and employee (even though not on the clock) and it is not allowed.

[Guest PapaB]

Ask them indirectly. The question to ask them is "Are the policies that cover us as employees, while at work, still in effect for us while shopping here on our own time?" If they ask her to be more specific, tell them the question speaks for itself. Do they have to follow the employee handbook (if there is one) while shopping, or are they like every other customer?

The answer should be no, whether it's carrying or the dress code or any other employee policy.

[Fallguy]

The store is going to be the only one that knows. There is no question of law here, only company policy. Even if she carried while on duty she is breaking no law, only company policy. Of course violating company policy has it's own consequences.

PapaB probably has the best suggestion. Have her ask about the policies in general, that if they apply anytime she is in the store or only when on duty.

[UncleJak]

OR....carry super concealed and problem solved!

[daddyo]

Common sense would tell me that if an employee is forbidden to carry while on the job, then he/she would be forbidden to carry WHENEVER on company property.

[Guest WestonGray]

Common sense would tell me that if an employee is forbidden to carry while on the job, then he/she would be forbidden to carry WHENEVER on company property.

I don't think that's really "common sense" a big part of companies dictating certain behaviors is because they are legally responsible for the actions of their employees while acting in agency for the company. They might not care what she does when she is there on her own time since she's not representing the company.

[Fallguy]

I don't think that's really "common sense" a big part of companies dictating certain behaviors is because they are legally responsible for the actions of their employees while acting in agency for the company. They might not care what she does when she is there on her own time since she's not representing the company.

I have to agree...I wouldn't automatically think that a policy related to conduct on the job applied to off the job, but on the property.

I mean it very well may, but I don't think it's "common sense" to assume so.

[daddyo]

Let me rephrase it then: I'm not going to risk my career by putting it to the test.

[Fallguy]

Let me rephrase it then: I'm not going to risk my career by putting it to the test.

Well I don't think that is the intention here either...that is why most everyone is suggesting to ask.

[walton6467]

I agree with DaddyO, I think if you work there and are barred from carrying on the clock, you'd be expected to maintain the same behavior off the clock as well.

While you aren't on duty, you are still an employee of that company and while on that property, there is an expectation of a certain amount of decorum.

While I hope it never happens, in the event that you are there in the store off-duty, and feel necessary to defend yourself with your firearm, the second thing to happen would be that you'd be fired. You'd have to sue to get your job back and TN is a right to work state, we can all be fired at any time for any reason, or none.

My best advice would be not to shop there off-duty and armed. Like DaddyO says I'm not going to risk my career.

[Fallguy]

Not to get this more off track but....

So if a company has a policy that says females can not were dangling ear rings or must wear their hair up or such when on duty...that automatically means they have to wear studs and can't let their hair down just when there in their period?

If you work at a place that doesn't really have any public traffic like an office, factory or such...then yes, I would tend to agree that any policy covers you while you are there period, because even if off-duty you are probably not there as a member of the public. But if a place is open to the public, grocery store and such, I still maintain that a policy, even though it may/could, doesn't automatically apply when you are there as a member of the public. At least not without getting clarification.

...and yes, in TN and employer can fire you for no reason, but AFAIK if they actually do give a reason, they have to be able to back it up. That is why most HR people I have talked to say it is better most times to just let someone go without a reason than listing one.

[daddyo]

Where I work, the company policy says "no weapons". There is no disclaimer that says "unless you are not on the clock".

[Guest ArmyVeteran37214]

I would find out from the store to be certain, however most places consider the person an employee on or off the clock.

This...my employer is the same way. I just shop at another location, if I need something from there.

[Fallguy]

Where I work, the company policy says "no weapons". There is no disclaimer that says "unless you are not on the clock".

Fair enough.

Do you ever go there shopping and/or as a member of the public?

[daddyo]

Fair enough.

Do you ever go there shopping and/or as a member of the public?

It is not a retail operation, but I do enter the building sometimes on the weekends. I do NOT carry.

[Bubba0031]

It may or may not be applicable to the OP but most likely is to someone here. All of the discussion references being "on or off of the clock". There are some personnel who are salaried. Are they always "on the clock" and therefore subject to their employeer's policies all of the time?

[zapfbroad]

If the company prohibits carrying weapons then that will in most circumstances extend to 'off the clock' (or salaried) employees. Except in deep concealment cases yay. If the employee is open carrying/printing discernibly with cc then another employee could allege that they were concerned for their safety. In the same way that someone can allege harassment by overhearing two employees making a sexual/racist joke or if another employee had a poster in their office of swimsuit models or a satirical cartoon of racial prejudice. it's creating a potentially hostile or unsafe work environment. Yes it's a double standard for employees vs. customers but that's life. Some businesses may say it doesn't extend to non-employee only areas I.e. salesfloor, public restrooms. Others would find issue with it being on premises at all. If it is a multi state corporate store it may be a more sweeping prohibition against than an independant or small chain. While a store manager may have a sympathetic inclination to a hcp holder an employee calling an hr hotline 'in fear of their life' from your sweet wife could stir a massive hornets nest as hr reps scurry to ward off lawsuits, etc. It's a murky subject all around that has no yea or nay answer unfortunately as it's mostly company/store dependent. My workplace has no clear policy about guns but when I asked my former boss/friend who is in another region for the company now his opinion he said you can't carry a gun on your hip on/off the clock. How about mah boot then partner? No answer. Previous company, immediate termination if in vehicle on company property or at company gatherings, meetings or sponsored events, etc etc. It's all about perceived company liability..good luck. Having worked in pharmaceuticals I believe they don't take anywhere near the necessary precautions to provide adequate workplace safety from the tremendous number of holdups that occur. I know an rph that was fired from walgreens for firing on a armed robber, I know another that has a permanent nerve disability in his left arm from being shot. Licensed employees should be allowed to open carry on the clock imho. At the end of the day, the pay/benefits pkg she's getting at that place can't be so far out of market she can't get the same at another retail place anyways, worse case. But she'd be alive if shtf at that job.

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[robbiev]

Not to get this more off track but....

So if a company has a policy that says females can not were dangling ear rings or must wear their hair up or such when on duty...that automatically means they have to wear studs and can't let their hair down just when there in their period?

I agree with what I think your point is. The difference is, I doubt anyone would care if you came onto the property while off duty with earrings or hairstyles that violate company policy. If someone came onto the property with a gun (and got caught)...they would probably make a case out of it.

[Fallguy]

It is not a retail operation, but I do enter the building sometimes on the weekends. I do NOT carry.

I hear ya...and in that case I probably wouldn't either. As I said above, if it's not a place the public generally goes in the first place, then yeah, whether your working at the time or not...I'd say any policy still applies. But if it is a place the public goes, while any policy could still apply, it's not as automatic to assume so.

I agree with what I think your point is. The difference is, I doubt anyone would care if you came onto the property while off duty with earrings or hairstyles that violate company policy. If someone came onto the property with a gun (and got caught)...they would probably make a case out of it.

LOL...well true, maybe not an "exact" comparison. But maybe you did get my point...which is mainly that if you work at a place open to the public, it's not necessarily a given all company policies apply when you are there as a member of the public and not working.

[daddyo]

I guess the point is that once you are hired by a company, you are considered an employee 24/7 until you either leave or you are let go.

I don't consider myself unemployed when I leave at the end of the day and then employed again when I get to work the next morning. LOL

[Fallguy]

I guess the point is that once you are hired by a company, you are considered an employee 24/7 until you either leave or you are let go.

I don't consider myself unemployed when I leave at the end of the day and then employed again when I get to work the next morning. LOL

LOL...I don't disagree.

You may not have meant it the way some of us took it, but I think it was the term "common sense" that sort of stood out. Sort of like it was a silly question in the first place....and in your situation it probably is. But if you work at retail location I think it's at least possible some policies may not apply while there as a customer.

[daddyo]

LOL...I don't disagree.

You may not have meant it the way some of us took it, but I think it was the term "common sense" that sort of stood out. Sort of like it was a silly question in the first place....and in your situation it probably is. But if you work at retail location I think it's at least possible some policies may not apply while there as a customer.

Well, I truly apologize to everyone if it came across that way. It was not my intention.

[Fallguy]

Well, I truly apologize to everyone if it came across that way. It was not my intention.

No harm, no foul...as far as I'm concerned.

The back forth in this thread much more civil than I've seen in lots of others...