Ruger 10/22 vs. S&W M&P 15/22 vs Keltec Sub-2000

[pattywak]

I currently have a 9mm pistol, but I'm looking into getting a long gun to start learning my way around them. I've done some preliminary research involving online research, reviews and videos along with some range time with a Sub-2000 and handling a 15/22 in the store. So far these are the three choices I'm looking at, with some pros and cons for each.

Ruger 10/22

Pros

+ One of the most highly recommended 22s I've come across.

+ TONS of aftermarket modification.

+ Cheap price.

Cons

- For some reason, my hand doesn't do well with the grip style. Much more comfortable with a pistol gripe style.

M&P 15/22

Pros

+ Similar battery of arms to a real AR - a platform I eventually want to move up into using.

+ I've held one in store and it was really comfortable to handle.

+ From what I know, can take AR mods - triggers, mounts, scopes, etc.

Cons

- Price: around $500 for one, lots more than the Ruger.

Keltec Sub-2000

Pros

+ I have shot this one in 9mm, and it was so much fun to shoot.

+ Felt great to handle, had no problems being a left handed shooter.

+ 9mm -> same round my pistol is chambered in, so there's some commonality there.

+ Could use this is some form of defense role.

+ Compact, folding design

Cons

- Ammunition price more expensive than 22Lr

- Price is still more than the Ruger.

Now, this was just a quick list I typed up. I'm looking at the 15/22 because I want to learn about ARs and their battery of arms, but I also like the Sub2K because it can be realistically used in some sort of defensive role while still being a fun plinker.

Any input from you guys? Anyone have experience with these three? The Ruger is very commonplace - I really want to see if anyone has input for the M&P and the Keltec. Thanks for looking.

[orientalexpress]

I had a sub 2000 and it functioned perfectly and was great as shtf gun. However the sights werent great, you were limited on optic mounting options and often times defeated what I felt was the purpose of the gun, a lightweight concealable emergency long gun.

I vote 10/22. You can get one for under $200. If you don't like the grip you can buy new stocks or anything else for that matter. Inexpensive. You can get an AR style stock.

I have never fired an mp15-22 but I speculate it won't be quite as accurate as a 10/22.

[mikegideon]

Google 10/22 stock and hit the images tab. There are tons of pistol grip options

[pattywak]

Google 10/22 stock and hit the images tab. There are tons of pistol grip options

I have seen those, but for me the M&P still has the edge in that department because it also shares the same battery of arms as full caliber ARs. I am keeping that in mind though.

[I_Like_Pie]

Hunter Bob vs. G.I. Joe vs. The Punisher

[mikegideon]

I have seen those, but for me the M&P still has the edge in that department because it also shares the same battery of arms as full caliber ARs. I am keeping that in mind though.

Nothing wrong with the M&P

[Garufa]

I have seen those, but for me the M&P still has the edge in that department because it also shares the same battery of arms as full caliber ARs. I am keeping that in mind though.

If you are set on an AR why not just go ahead get one with a dedicated .22lr upper or a .22 conversion?

[Guest Broomhead]

If you are set on an AR why not just go ahead get one with a dedicated .22lr upper or a .22 conversion?

Yeah, what he said.

BTW, even though it has been hotly debated to death, a .22LR can still kill.

[pattywak]

Nothing wrong with the M&P

Do you have one ? Any experiences?

If you are set on an AR why not just go ahead get one with a dedicated .22lr upper or a .22 conversion?

Money. That's the only reason. Otherwise I would go the conversion route.

Yeah, what he said.

BTW, even though it has been hotly debated to death, a .22LR can still kill.

Yes, I know, but for me having two systems that run the same ammunition (In this case, 9mm) would be a little more convenient.

[wareagle]

I say 10/22. Others are novelties. I Like my sub, but it is not a keeper. The MP is tacticool but not sure it would be a keeper either.

[Backon4]

I love my AR's but the sub2k is a blast. I take it with me just about everywhere.

[mikegideon]

Do you have one ? Any experiences?

.

No, but folks I know and respect have. I'm sticking with my story. Can't go wrong with a 10/22 either, and I DO have one of those.

[Tncobra]

Gave away my last 10/22 a few weeks ago, thanks to having a 15-22.

Easy to strip/clean, doesn't jam, cheap mags etc etc etc. Works like a real AR.

Hands down, best 22 auto I have ever owned.

[QuietDan]

One of each, in the order you list them.

Buy the Ruger 10/22 and you're in a rifle at a low opportunity cost. Save a little more, get the next, either selling the Ruger, or keeping it, depending on how much fun, how much funds, your interests at the time.

Any one of the three would sell easily at little loss, or perhaps a gain, unless you decide to keep 'em.

[pattywak]

As far as take down for basic cleaning and maintenance, which one of the three would be the easiest? Hardest?

[Guest nysos]

Granted this would apply for me. I would want one of each for its own reasons, as to which one I would get first? probably one of the .22's, because although the sub2000 would have a great purpose as a trunk gun, the other 2 would be cheaper to shoot more often. I already have an AR, so I would just be getting a dedicated 22 upper vs a whole new rifle. I would recommend if you get an AR, make sure to have a dedicated .22 upper vs the conversion. I have a nice barrel on my 556 upper and would not want to fowl it up with 22 lead that I would have to clean all the more.

From a cost standpoint, I would probably get a 10/22 first due to they are rock solid reliable, ruger's customer service, and all the after market support. If you had an AR already, I would say get the upper first so that you get more practice with that manual of arms.

[Tncobra]

As far as take down for basic cleaning and maintenance, which one of the three would be the easiest? Hardest?

I do a complete cleaning of my guns everytime I shoot. I dont think you can compare stripping a military pattern rifle to a civililian style. The AR type Smith gun is as simple as it gets. The Ruger is a bit more involved getting into removing stock ,the trigger/bolt etc.

I like to shoot not clean. Since the Smith is alot easier I took to shooting it alot more. My custom Rugers sat jealous in the safe. The Rugers are all gone replaced by one Smith.

Nothing wrong with the Ruger at all. I just like the Smith better.

No exp with the sub gun.

[mikegideon]

I do a complete cleaning of my guns everytime I shoot. I dont think you can compare stripping a military pattern rifle to a civililian style. The AR type Smith gun is as simple as it gets. The Ruger is a bit more involved getting into removing stock ,the trigger/bolt etc.

I like to shoot not clean. Since the Smith is alot easier I took to shooting it alot more. My custom Rugers sat jealous in the safe. The Rugers are all gone replaced by one Smith.

Nothing wrong with the Ruger at all. I just like the Smith better.

No exp with the sub gun.

This is a very good point. I shoot my AR's more than any of my other guns. One of the reasons is ease of maintenance.

[ttocswob]

Don't discount a large capacity semi-auto .22 rifle as a home defense gun. Low recoil, limited penetration, and you might even retain your hearing.

[Will Carry]

I had a Ruger 10/22 and sold it. The trigger was horrible and I had to crane my neck to look down the open sights, plus it jammed too often. I prefer the tube fed 22s like the Model 60 by Remington or a good bolt action 22 rifle. So I would recommend the Smith and Wesson....for what it's worth. My personal favorite is the Marlin model 100, one shot, one kill.

If you want to dress your 22 up like an AR and play G.I.Joe then don't get a bolt action rifle. If you want accuracy get an old Marlin.

Edited October 1, 2011 by Will Carry

[Guest Slamskie]

10/22 and if you want it to be Black Gun AR-ish you can do one of these, they are all 10/22's:

Edited September 30, 2011 by Slamskie
Fixed Pictures

[Guest Slamskie]

ok I don't know how to do pictures on here.....dang

Edited September 30, 2011 by Slamskie

[mikegideon]

http://www.tngunowners.com/forums/tgo-forum-support/28387-faq-how-do-i-post-pictures.html

[Guest Slamskie]

Thanks Mike....I was looking at that and now have it figured out!

[Oh Shoot]

Nobody mentioned Ruger SR10/22 ?

Or just make your own around a basic $200 10/22 by changing stock and etc.

For example, this Urban Bad Ass Rodent Eradicator only cost about $350 or so, including the original new basic carbine model (sold original stock); includes Volquartsen hammer and extractor, receiver buffer, Bushnell .22 scope with see through mounts, stupid flash suppressor, "Winchester" bipod, Butler Creek mag (now Ruger sells their own better 25 rounder).

- OS