Damn Doctors don't know crap.

[Guest TN.Frank]

I've been having a lot of trouble with pain in my joints, muscle pains when I do just about anything, "brain fog" where I'll not have a word I wanted to say, ect. Things that clearly point to something like Fibromyalgia or Chronic Fatigue Syndrome and the stupid doctor, who I've been seeing for over 7 months can't find anything wrong. He's put me on countless meds with no effect. Now he's put me on Lexapro for depression. I'm not Frickin' depressed except for feeling like crap all the time. I took my first one this a.m. and I'm dizzy and feel kind of hyper, other then that I still ache. I don't think I"m going to take anymore of em' because I really don't think that it'd be going down the right road. I need something to stop me from hurting, not some damn "happy pill" that's going to have all kinds of crazy side effects and withdrawl symptoms when he finally finds out that Lexapro isn't going to work. What the hell does it take to find a doctor that'll listen to me and find out what's really wrong without using me as a human guinne pig.

[Mike.357]

Sounds like old age to me Frank. I got aches and pains I never had even two years ago. My left elbow pretty much feels like someone hits it with a ball bat daily. Shoulders feel like they weigh a ton. If it gets to looking like rain my knees kind of feel like they need a good greasin'.

Yep old age. It must be official as yesterday I got an AARP mailer addressed to me for the first time. Says my membership card is included, heck I did not even apply for it.

I don't want no part of 'em.

And watch going to them doctors. They will go out of their way to find something wrong with ya. And remember only half of the doctors out there finished in the upper half of their doctorin' classes. The rest of them ain't even average. You want to go see a doctor that ain't even average? Doctors only got a license to practice, when they get a license to perform I might go and see one. They ain't practicin' on me.

More caffiene works good for talkin'

Edited March 5, 2008 by Mike.357

[Guest TN.Frank]

Heck, I'm only 46,LOL. A little over a year ago I was working at Flowers Bakery unloading trucks doing all kind of heavy stuff. Sure, I'd feel it but not like I feel now. I can't even work on my car for a couple hours without feeling achey for the next day or two. That's just not normal for me. Something is going on and I'd like to know what it is.

[ZenDog]

Good luck. You might try to find a Fibromyalgia specialist in your area - or you might have to go to a larger community to find one.

I work with a lot of Fibro patients in my psychology practice. Lexapro often helps decrease their pain and fogginess-- but it can take a week or two to become effective. And some folks have side effects that are worse than their illness.

Hang in there.

[Guest gunslinger707]

I don't trust Doctor's Lawyer's or Preacher's in that order !!! lol

[Guest EasilyObsessed]

You may want to check your area for a DO (Doctor of Osteopathic Medicine). They have the same training as a normal MD but with a more holostic approach in the training.

Treating pain or sickness with drugs instead of working on the underlying cause is a growing concern in medicine today, but hopefully you can find a doctor who doesnt fall victim to the problem.

Consider that the majority of the people who come into a doctors office just want instant gratification in the form of a reduction of symptoms and that most people if told "To fix your blood pressure you need to exercise and eat better" are not going to follow that advice and would be better served just taking a pill. Having the motivation and willingness to actually find a true "cure" for whatever is causing you problems puts you in the minority.

Best of luck in finding a "fix" for your problems.

[Smith]

You got to remember Doctors are trained to medicate with drugs not necessarily heal. Which makes sense, because 95% of Med school research is funded through the Pharmaceutical companies.

http://www.usatoday.com/news/health/2006-01-24-med-school-trust_x.htm

http://www.marketmed.org/rx_truth.asp?fmmfont=fontmed

as well as a book “Maximum Energy” by Ted Broer. There are a number of others I can't remember the sources for.

The good ones will go above and beyond to truly fix a condition, rather than just suppress it. finding the good ones is tuff.

BTW read a label sometime. Side effects are often as bad or worse than the problem you're trying to get rid of!

Edited March 6, 2008 by Smith
added info and correction

[Guest EasilyObsessed]

Which makes sense, because 95% of Med school is funded through the Pharmaceutical companies.

Could you show me where that figure comes from? The medical students, residents, and doctors at Vanderbilt are not even allowed to accept pens or pencils from a Pharmaceutical Representative, more or less funding 95% of their education.

[DWARREN123]

In 2002 I started going to my doctor for upper stomach pain. In 18 months, 4 different doctors and 3 emergency room visits I was told I had a bad gall bladder, emergency surgery to remove it. I was given tests and medicine for everything but my gall bladder, paid out money, missed work and lived in bad pain for 18 months to finally find out what it was.

The doc who diagnosed me said it had started into ganggrene.

I do not trust doctors any more!

[NuTcAsE]

Here's how to fix the Medical System. Doctors should practice medicine like mechanic's fix cars. Pay them on flat rate and if they don't fix it the first time they get to do it again for free. That way they'll be more inclined to properly diagnose you and prescribe what will fix you. This will also do away with giving you the "as seen on T.V." pill of the week. Gov. health care ain't gonna fix it, they see a huge pile of money here and they want it, just ask a trucker, farmer or mechanic. Bottom line is "THEIR AIN"T NO PROFIT IN A CURE!"

[strickj]

What dummy said ;I mean NuTcAsE did I type that out loud

[Smith]

Could you show me where that figure comes from? The medical students, residents, and doctors at Vanderbilt are not even allowed to accept pens or pencils from a Pharmaceutical Representative, more or less funding 95% of their education.

Don't have the original article for the reference. It was in college for a paper, but here is a similar article documenting how many Med school leaders have direct ties to Pham companies. Goggle the topic. It is well documented. http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/10/16/AR2007101601409.html

BTW, most of the text books are written with major help from the companies. It is pretty well know the US is not holistic in it's medical approach. for example; mid-wives vs. OBGYN. The rest of the modern world uses Mid-wives for delivery care. Also have a much lower infant/birth related mortality rate than here. We do a lot more c-sections, induced births, ect.

It's not some big conspiracy, it's just the direction our Medical system has gone to stay on the "cutting" edge. we do have the best in the world, but I would like to see more holistic approaches in balance with the medication theories.

[Ricochet]

Do you drink diet cola's? If so it could be the aspertame. Just a thought. Aspertame is some mean stuff.

[Guest TN.Frank]

Nope, I can't stand diet anything. I'm thinking it's got to be Fibro or CFS since I've been tested for everything else(and I mean EVERYTHING) and all the tests are showing up negitive.

[Guest TNDixieGirl]

TN.Frank

On another forum I use, this very topic came up. I'm going to post a few of the responses they received over there. Maybe one of them will help in some way.

"My wife has fibro. She was using a cane for a while (she's only 36!). We finally found a doctor who recommend Cymbalta, which is an anti-depressant. I asked the doctor what was up with that, since my wife showed no signs of depression. He said no one really knew why Cymbalta worked, but it did.

We reluctantly tried it, and it's been the difference between night and day! She goes hiking and camping with no problems, uses her own power tools (my wife's a special woman), and does everything she ever did before and then some. She still has occasional bad days, especially when it's really hot or cold. But overall, she feels as young as a teenager again.

We consider Cymbalta to be literally an answer to prayer!"

"My wife has fought with this off and on for about ten years now. Right now it's an off time for her. As others have said, there is no definite test for it. It's more of a it's not this, and it's not that, so it has to be...

From what our research has dug up the mucous lining in and around the muscles seems to play a key role. In some patients, while the muscle is at rest, this lining becomes thick and sticky causing the muscle fibers to stick toghether...acting more like a glue rather than a lubricant. When the muscle moves again, the pain comes from the many, many adhesions breaking loose. This is only one of many "theories" we've seen.

There is a new drug out called Lyrica (spelling?). One lady I work with has fibromyalgia and this drug has made a huge difference for her. One lady my wife knows has found natural relief through tai-chi and yoga. For her, movement is life.

The link given above is a good one. There are several others also, I just can't recall them right now. Hang in there and ask your doctor questions. Ih he can't, or won't, answer them find another."

"Lyrica's not new; it's like Cymbalta. It's an anti-depressant that's been on the market a few years. It's the first drug in its class that's been officially approved as a fibro treatment. But a lot of doctors have been using anti-depressants to treat fibro, so I'm not surprised the FDA finally caught up.

There's some thinking now that the body's levels of seratonin might contribute to fibromyalgia. Maybe a person is more sensitive to muscle pain because the chemicals within the muscles that transmit that pain impulse are messed up. Maybe the Lyrica (and other anti-depressants) help so much because they regulate seratonin levels. Like my wife's doctor said, he doesn't know exactly how it works, but it does.

This is a very elusive disease to nail down, but its effects are very real. If anyone you know is suffering from it, don't give up until you find a doctor who's willing to take it seriously."

"Approx. 85% of fibromyalgia sufferers are female. It is pain in soft tissue (similar to arthritis in joints) that cannot be explained. If you can I would see a good Rheumatologist (sp)for a diagnosis. A lot of research has been ands is being conducted at OHSU (Oregon Health Science University). I'm sure you can get some good info on their site. Diagnosis is based on the identification of a specific number of "trigger points". Sick and tired (with considerable pain) pretty much describes it. Typically the pain prevents getting restful sleep."

Thats all for now. Just thinking maybe a tidbit of good info could be found in there somewhere.

Edited March 6, 2008 by TNDixieGirl

[Guest colrmccoll]

If you want to come to Knoxville, I can refer you to one which will attempt to heal rather than just treat.

[Guest TN.Frank]

I did try Lyrica for a while, all it did was help me sleep a bit better but it really did nothing for the pain.

I had Polymyositis (google it for more info.) when I was 16 years old and was on Prednizone for about a year until it went into remission. My primary doctor thinks that my tendon/joint pain might be a off shoot of that. Kind of an auto imune deal.

I know that the Lexapro really zones me out especially for the first hour or so after it kicks in, then I feel like I'm on speed or something for the rest of the day, you know, like those little White Crosses we'd take when we were younger(and dumber) and out and didn't want to sleep.

Since Polymyositis effects the muscles and Fibro is linked to the muscles I wonder if that might be the conection? Anyway, I'm going to try the lexapro for a few weeks to see if I feel any better.

[Guest jackdog]

there is a good side to pain. You know your still alive. In my fifties I fell off my regular exercise regimen, and started having aches, pains in joints muscles something awful. Three years ago I started back on a regular exercise program, And the aches and pains for the most part have disappeared. Not saying this is your problem, But

Doctors are a last resort for me. Changing up your diet might also be a good idea

[The Rabbi]

You got to remember Doctors are trained to medicate with drugs not necessarily heal. Which makes sense, because 95% of Med school is funded through the Pharmaceutical companies.

The good ones will go above and beyond to truly fix a condition, rather than just suppress it. finding the good ones is tuff.

BTW read a label sometime. Side effects are often as bad or worse than the problem you're trying to get rid of!

Uh, no.

The statement

95% of Med school is funded through the Pharmaceutical companies.

is not supported by the referenced article, whicj opens with

More than half of department chairs at U.S. medical schools and teaching hospitals have financial ties with the drug industry, a new study finds. These institutional relationships seemed to be just as widespread as those of individual physicians or scientists with industry.

I dont want to hijack the thread but pretending that industry does not have a vested interest in medical schools and vice versa is just plain dumb. How many LE agencies or military agencies are also involved with firearms companies? It is a symbiotic relationship.

As for side effects, by law drug makers must list every side effect ever reported, even if it occurred in only a couple of cases. That makes for a scary-sounding list but the reality is the vast majority of that never happens and the drug works as intended.

[Guest GregRN]

Rabbi is correct. I have heard of a medication that had murder listed as a side effect because someone in the trials was murdered. I can't remember the name of the medication.

Most doctors think that fibromyalgia and CFS are bogus. Mike357 is right about the aging thing, even if I'm 36. Every year makes a difference. There are always muscle aches and pains for everyone. Some people have more. The old timers somehow found a way to survive with it.

However, we have more technology now.

TN.Frank, have you seen a rheumatologist? Have you been checked for rheumatoid arthritis and lupus? Has anyone done blood tests like sed rate or rheumatoid factor or C-reactive protein? If not, do a search for those on the web and educate yourself.

You won't get an answer from an ER visit. The ER is to make sure that you don't have a life or limb threatening condition, and to stabilize it if you do. A chronic problem won't fit that category, although some ER docotrs will give it an attempt. You need a good family doctor or internist that you like. If you don't have that, switch. Just remember that doctors, like lawyers, don't have to believe you to be good. They just need to be willing to help.

[Guest EasilyObsessed]

It is pretty well know the US is not holistic in it's medical approach. for example; mid-wives vs. OBGYN. The rest of the modern world uses Mid-wives for delivery care. Also have a much lower infant/birth related mortality rate than here. We do a lot more c-sections, induced births, ect.

Yes, the US is generally not holistic in its medical approach, but it is in large part because that is what the population is demanding of their physicians.

Here is an example of what happens every single day in doctor offices around the county. A man comes in with high blood pressure and you tell him that to "fix" his issue he should begin exercising, reduce his intake of red meat, cut out fried foods, and eat more fruits and vegetables. He comes back two months later and his blood pressure was ever higher than before. You ask him if he has been following his new diet and exercising more and his response is: "Hey Doc, I really tried but then I got this new promotion at work and my....and ...... and ...." So, now, you have a choice of either sticking to your holistic approach, or you can give him meds. What would you do?

Regardless, that same person has a good chance of going around and saying one of two things: "All my doc ever does is try to get me to exercise and eat better and he never justs give me something to fix the problem" or "All my doc ever does is give me medication and he never actually get the root of the problem."

Damned if you do, damned if you dont. But, I can assure you that the doctors are not out there practicing with the intent of causing you harm. I will admit that there are probably some doctors out there who have $$$ signs floating in front of their eyes, but I can't recall having ever met one. If you do meet one, thank god you live in a country with such outstanding health care that you aren't forced to see them because they are the only doctor within 500 miles.

In regards to the OB/GYN vs. Midwife: If I didnt personally know multiple outstanding doctors specializing primarily in obstetrics who do have a generally holistic approach, I would absolutely recommend a nurse midwife. 100% with you on the holistic approach. Here is some data on infant mortality: https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/rankorder/2091rank.html I am not 100% sure why the CIA website is publishing this material, and how they even have 2007 figures since the newest statistics our research dept has are for 2005, but I would be happy to investigate mortality rate further if this is something of great concern to you.

I am (I hope incorrectly) under the impression that you think that doctors do not have a desire to improve the quality of care? Induction rates, VBAC (vaginal birth after cesarean) rates, primary cesarean rates, and adjusted cesarean rates are some of the things which I personally (well...I created the original queries, now I just hit a button ) calculate each month and those numbers are paid a great deal of attention to by the OBGYN chair as well as the division directors. There are also MANY other activities where the sole goal is improving quality of care. I would type them, but I just dont have the energy right now

There is, at least in my experience, a push right now towards a more holistic approach to medicine, but the majority of patients are not happy with that change. Lots of patients wont even take medication they are prescribed, more or less make an life-style change. If you really want a more holistic approach to medicine, try seeing a D.O., it is what they are trained to do.

[Guest TN.Frank]

"have you seen a rheumatologist? Have you been checked for rheumatoid arthritis and lupus? Has anyone done blood tests like sed rate or rheumatoid factor or C-reactive protein? "

Yes, to all of the above. After we'd tried a few things I got to thinking about a nasty tick bite that I got back in July. It took almost 2 months to totally heal up so I had them do a Lyme test, negitive, Lupus, which my older sister has, negitive, rheumatoid factors were positive BUT there's no signs of swelling or redness. Tuesday he took another blood sample to test again for that so we'll see. It does seem like the anti-depresants are helping a little. Not sure why, maybe they've just made my brain more resistant to pain or something. Anyway, I'll be glad when I feel more like I use to so I can get back to doing some of the things I really love. Drag Races start over here at I-40 Dragway on March 29th, BIG Bounty Race, I'll be there, if any of ya'll are going look me up, I'll be in my E.Blue Neon. Talk to ya'll later and thanks for all of your help.

[Guest desireeharper1]

they give antidepressants to people with chronic pain b/c pain can cause depression when you're down about not ever feeling good, and being down can increase your pain level (for some reason). i have chronic pain and finding lamictal helped greatly with mine. it's something they try if antidepressants don't work. antidepressants can take a month to get into your system, but lexapro is supposed to be a good one and the side effects should only last a few days until you adjust. it does sound like you have symptoms of fibromyalgia or maybe some kind of arthritis? you can always get a second opinion. anyway, don't give up, you don't want to suffer when there's treatment waiting to be found. especially since you shoot and that can probably irritate your joints without the right meds.

[Guest desireeharper1]

i was wondering about lupus too. i just googled autoimmune disorders and clicked on the link for wrongdiagnosis.com and lupus is listed there with rheumatoid arthritis, MS, and some others. i suggest wikipedia (reference encyclopedia online) when you're looking for med info on your symptoms or info on diseases. it includes everything from diagnosis, to treatment, meds, everything your doctor doesn't tell you that you forgot to ask about. it even confirmed my med dosage on some samples my dr gave me. good luck with this, if nothing else, you have a lot of people backing you here!

[bobmack]

hi,

i'll try not to get long winded here but ---if you haven't already, -- i suggest you get a cardio stress test.

several years ago i developed symetrical and uniform pain in both knees, elbows, shoulders , wrists, etc: along with weakness and listlessness ----doctor treated me for arthritis and prescribed 'viox' -----wrong , wrong, wrong.

anyhow, after a heart attack from blocked arteries and quintuple bypass surgery i have been fine for 6 years.

run [slowly] don't walk to a cardio specialist and prove or eliminate this cause.

could save your life ---i was lucky ---i survived.

good luck and good health,

bob