Carry .357 sig?

[Guest TNScrambler]

Normally I carry my little PF9 Keltec with JHPs, however I have been looking for something with a higher round count in a "compact" size. I had a XDM .40 that I liked but it was just too big for me to try to CC alot. So, I ended up trading it for a glock 32, holds 13+1 and is nice inbetween size from the PF9 to the XDM. Anyway, I plan to pick up a G23 .40 cal barrel for it to make it much cheaper to shoot, however what is yalls opinion on carrying it with .357 sig?

I am just worried about if I had to use it going through and hitting someone else? Anyone else CC with this caliber? Should I wait to till I get the .40 cal barrel to CC with it? Opinions?

Thanks,

Justin

[Lumber_Jack]

Check out this thread for some ongoing discussion on the topic

http://www.tngunowners.com/forums/handguns/55962-sig-357-a.html

I think overpentration is a consideration, but only marginally so. especially considering the assailant is wearing clothes or even a jacket.

Another good read The Myth of Energy Transfer

Edited July 5, 2011 by Lumber_Jack

[Guest Burgan]

I see this as going into a .357sig vs .40 CC thread. Personally I would carry the .40 over the .357sig. But mainly just because of the ammo cost difference. I beleive last time I looked the .357sig was like $.05 more than .40 per round if you buy in bulk. I don't have my chart in front of me of all the updated PPR of bulk purchases, so that may be off, but I do know the .357sig is more expensive.

[Jonnin]

Why not a P-11 or p-40 if you like your kel-tec? Its almost the same as the p-9 but with a double stack mag, in either 9 or 40 caliber (harder to find the 40s but not impossible).

I dont understand the 357 sig caliber. If you want a faster .40 caliber, why not just use a lighter bullet? The diameter difference is minor, so what you are really doing is pushing a smaller slug at a higher velocity.... which you can do in the .40 just as easily. According to ballistics by the inch, in a 3 inch barrel, the .40 with a 135 gr corbon is 1200 FPS, the 357 with a 125gr corbon is 1300 FPS. That difference is TINY given the 10 grain weight difference. The 40 caliber gives you the option of using slugs up to nearly 200 grains or very light slugs, either one. The 357 sig has a much smaller range of slug weights, and you can find lightweight slugs that move at a high velocity, but all in all they overlap nicely and you can make the .40 do the exact same thing for less cost. The 357 is probably more difficult to reload with that neck on it, the 40 is simple. While I admire the effort to replicate a 357 mag in an auto, the 9mm already does that with the high performance +p+ loads. The 10mm also can approximate a 357 mag. The reason a 357 mag seems so potent is most of the data on the web is from a long barrel revolver... compare by barrel length and several automatic rounds are very close to it.

So, I say stick with the .40 or a quality 9mm that can handle the hot loads, and forget about sig and 10mm (10mm is nice but its pricy and hard to find hot loads for it). I carry a 40 because I couldnt find a 45 pocket pistol that I liked, while many small 9s can be found in .40 too. I like a heavier bullet and that is why I picked the 40 over a 9, no other reason.

[Guest TNScrambler]

Thanks for the links, will be some good reading.

As for choosing a P11 or P40..... I already have the Glock 32 chambered in .357 Sig....that said I do plan to get a Glock 23 barrel to run .40 cal through it, I'm just trying to gather info and decide if I want to carry it as .357 or .40. I do like the P11/P40 platform and have shot both. This gun is going to be for occational CC, for when I'm going somewhere that I think I might need bigger than 8 rounds of 9mm or during the winter while wearing more than a t-shirt and shorts, for this I want to carry at least a .40 but when shooting the P40 I was limp wristing it....I know that i could practice and some adjusting I could get better, but if it came down to using the gun in a defensive situation I don't think I would remember all the practice and it would probably jam on me (due to my error, not the gun). So, the glock, even in the higher powered round of .357 sig has not jamed or had an issue with limp wristing even after I tried to limp wrist it. (I don't even want to get into Glock is better or not, that is not my opinion or purpose of this discussion...besides this the first Keltec I've ever had and the first Glock).

Also, my PF-9 has not been 100% reliable yet, I have fired two different types of ammo through it and it seems to be hit and miss, Winchester White Box seems to be worse, however I still can't get through 50 rounds without 3 or more FTE, I let a friend's girlfriend shoot it yesterday and she limp wrist-ed it and it FTF....when I shoot it it feeds fine, but will occasionally FTE. So, I'm planning on carrying the G32 for a bit while I get the PF-9 sorted out, I am planning on doing the "fluff and buff" per the guys over on the keltec forum and see how that does.

[Guest Burgan]

Ok now that I'm home before work I looked to see what the price difference is for .40S&W vs .357SIG. It was higher than I originally said. Also, I'm adding in the .357 Magnum price just to give you an idea of how expensive it is:

Bulk ordering prices on average:

.40S&W = $0.23 per round--------------$230 per 1000 rounds

.357 Magnum = $0.34 per round

.357SIG = $0.36 per round--------------$360 per 1000 rounds

Basically it's .02 more expensive than the magnum and 0.13 more than the .40.

[Jonnin]

In that case, yes get that .40 barrel, for the reasons I gave, 40 is the less expensive and more flexible round and the differences are too small to justify the price increase. If you shoot much, you will quickly come out ahead of the investment.

For the record reloading .40 is around $5 a box for me, or $100 per 1000, and though I did not think it was a popular round for range time, I have picked up about 1k rounds of it over the past year without even trying, so its nearly as easy to get as 9mm if you have access to a range where you can loot brass.

Edited July 5, 2011 by Jonnin

[RobertNashville]

My Glock 31 is my primary carry weapon (switched to it from a Kimber PRO CDPII .45ACP).

I'll let others here argue about whether it's a "better"/"worse" round than some other; I'll just say that I like the .357 Sig round a LOT for a number of reasons.

[Fallguy]

I carry a Glock 32 as well.

[Erik88]

I always thought it was strange that the Air Marshall's carry the .357 SIG but apparently they are not concerned with over penetration, even on an airplane.

The only reason I will probably never buy anything in 357 SIG is due to the cost. I hear really good things about the round but not enough to justify the cost. That's just my personal opinion. If I was wealthy I would probably consider it.

[hipower]

My first Springfield XD was a 4in in 357 sig. I bought it because I got a super low price on it during one of the up/down phases the cartridge seems to go thru. I shot it quite a bit and got accustomed to the noise, stiff recoil, and the muzzle blast. Not really any worse than a lot of 40's I've shot. Found it to be a very accurate gun/cartridge for me. And the round has an awesome muzzle flash at night.

But that's what finally relagated the gun to range status for me. I figured if I every shot in a defensive situation, I'd be destroying what little night vision I still have.

Like the gun and the round, but think I'm better served with something else for home or ccw. JMO

[ghawk249]

I carry my g 32 or a regular basis. I like the round because it is more accurate than the g23 and has less muzzle flip. I carry mine in a UBG regulator holster. I have a xd 40 and g32 and my wife likes the g32 much better.

[Guest razorblade]

Carry a Sig P229 in .357Sig every day. Love it.

[JPS]

I have a Glock 33 that I really like -I also find .357 sig to be a very accurate round. I practice with my G26 to keep ammo costs down.

[Jonnin]

My first Springfield XD was a 4in in 357 sig. I bought it because I got a super low price on it during one of the up/down phases the cartridge seems to go thru. I shot it quite a bit and got accustomed to the noise, stiff recoil, and the muzzle blast. Not really any worse than a lot of 40's I've shot. Found it to be a very accurate gun/cartridge for me. And the round has an awesome muzzle flash at night.

But that's what finally relagated the gun to range status for me. I figured if I every shot in a defensive situation, I'd be destroying what little night vision I still have.

Like the gun and the round, but think I'm better served with something else for home or ccw. JMO

Some of the high end defensive ammo has "low flash" powder for night shooting. I do not know how effective this is in practice though. I have shot a little bit of it during daytime range conditions but not in any caliber that had enough daytime flash to really say anything about it.

[Will Carry]

I shot a friends Pocket Glock in .357 Sig. The recoil wasn't that bad as I recall. I thought about getting one but decided against it.

One less caliber of ammo to keep up with. The local LEOs carry .357 Sig.

[Fallguy]

I shot a friends Pocket Glock in .357 Sig. The recoil wasn't that bad as I recall. I thought about getting one but decided against it.

One less caliber of ammo to keep up with. The local LEOs carry .357 Sig.

AFAIK that is what all TN State Troopers and TBI agents carry as well.

[RobertNashville]

AFAIK that is what all TN State Troopers and TBI agents carry as well.

THP was my introduction to the round...I was fortunate to buy a Glock 31 issued to commemorate the 75th anniversary of the THP which, except for the test firing, has never been fired...since I didn't want to fire it either, I bought a standard G31 and after taking it to the range a couple of times I decided that it needed to be my primary carry weapon.

[Guest TNScrambler]

Thanks for the personal experience guys, I think I will start carrying it for a while, until I can get my PF9 reliable enough for trusted carry.

Justin

[Patton]

Ive read over this post and want to start out by saying that I have had at one time a Glock 32, Glock 23, and a Glock 19. I can tell little recoil difference in the three and the backyard penetration test I have done doesn't make me think 357sig is any different than a 9/40/45 If I was in your boat I would have no problem carrying a Glock 32 over the PF-9 when possible. I wouldn't even mess with the 40 barrel because you will have to shoot over a thousand rounds to make the cost offset. A 9mm barrel would pay for itself faster. I have had some specialized training on the 357sig round and I like it for reasons other than its a "fast" or "hot" round. It's a extremely flat shooting, reliable feeding round that is built on a casing that can allow for a projectille that can penetrate light armor or one that can strike with a lot of inertia. I have seen shelves at stores be completely empty of all pistol ammunition except 357sig.

[Patton]

I always thought it was strange that the Air Marshall's carry the .357 SIG but apparently they are not concerned with over penetration, even on an airplane.

.

I have a lot of friends that went to the FAM program, and though none of them were there in the introduction of the 357sig round, it is said that the idea was it was a round that meet multiple needs and when put in the hands of a skilled marksman matched there precision skills. Pre 2001 the few Air Marshals mostly had S&W 9mm and even some various revolvers. Mosltly 38spl but a few 357 or 44spl were at one time issued. In 2006/2007 it was requested that a lighter handgun than a 229 be issued and the old saying "Its not the Devil that you know but the Devil you don't know" came about. There request for a small Glock or Sig 239 got them the Sig 250. If you ask a FAM what they think about there 250's they will say the issued firearm is the least of there worrys. If you have ever been a part of a organizition that is ran by a bunch of idiots that have never done the job that there governing you know what I mean.

[Guest Larry]

I have been carrying a G32 for yrs, I really like the 357 sig round, it is my #1 carry pistol