AR 15 Pistol

[Guest ThePunisher]

Anyone have any experiences with AR 15 pistol. Give info on what it's like shooting, is it CCW.

[DaveTN]

I have a Kel-Tec PLR-16 which is a .223 pistol. They are a blast to shoot.

We don’t have CCW in this state, we have HCP. If it’s classified by the ATF as a handgun, and has a barrel less than 12†(The PLR-16 does); it would meet the requirements for a carry weapon. However, a guy that open carried an AK pistol lost his carry permit over it.

Some people want attention, and then cry about it when they do something stupid and get it. Carrying a gun requires common sense. If you open carry an AR pistol you will get attention.

[Steelharp]

They are great fun to shoot. Ballistically, the round loses all it's good points in a barrel that short. Great range toy, not the best defense option.

[bigwakes]

The round slows out of a barrel that short, but wouldn't that create the unstable on impact effect that everyone wants? I am considering a 10.5" pistol for the build after a lightweight 14.5" build. Muzzle Energy Computer looks like a .223 has nearly 3 times the energy of a .40 in a standard barrel. Am I missing something or would that drop to under 400 foot lbs of energy.

[Steelharp]

It needs the speed to tumble on impact. You don't want instability in flight. I believe Hornady TAP ammo might work well. There was a discussion about this a while back, with all sorts of valuable info... think it might have been Dom that provided all the excellent info.

[Guest 73challenger]

I think a heavy hollowpoint would still work well. The military uses a 10in barrel. Check out the MK18. Remember in Tennessee you can have a loaded rifle in your vehicle if you have HCP. The rifle can not have a round in the chamber. However, if you have a AR pistol it can have a round in the chamber.

[bigwakes]

I don't think I would carry it anyway. You might need to reload with a faster burning powder to get the round up to speed in a short barrel.

[Guest ThePunisher]

Checked out the AR pistols at Robinson armament and the they have the .6.8 caliber AR pistol. Would this be a better option than the .223 AR pistol?

[Guest bkelm18]

Checked out the AR pistols at Robinson armament and the they have the .6.8 caliber AR pistol. Would this be a better option than the .223 AR pistol?

A better option for what?

[Guest ThePunisher]

A better option for what?

Speed and stability in flight of the bullet.

[Jonnin]

I also have the plr, its good to about 200 yards and has the velocity to tumble according to the ballistics I have found, barely, its borderline, though it may do better with actual 556 instead of 223s. Not sure.

Its fun to shoot, gentle, but heavy and difficult to control as a conventional 2h pistol grip. I grab the mag as a forend grip and that does ok, or shoot it rested like a rifle, which is sorta pointless but the gun can do it.

Its exceptionally loud for those to the side of you, and spits too much fire to shoot at night without a good flash hider.

Ive carried it in my car but thats as far as I have taken carrying it.

All in all a fun gun, probably ok for small game and target shooting, probably not the best self defense gun ever made, it would be great in some odd situations but not typical ones, IMO.

[Guest Lester Weevils]

I have tried aimed fire holding the PLR-16 in front of the magwell with the weak hand. Using the front of the magwell as a fake vertical foregrip. It would need some stance adjustment to get a good thang going.

If standing in the triangle pistol stance, facing the target with the weak-hand on the magwell--With the weak arm extended straight, the trigger arm can't be locked straight, because the right trigger hand holds the pistol grip several inches behind where the left hand is holding. You just can't make an equilateral triangle that way. Since the weak arm can't get any longer, the trigger arm must be bent, which for me doesn't support the pistol good enough for accurate aiming.

In order to get both elbows locked, with the weak hand holding the gun several inches in front of the strong hand- Perhaps the trick would be to adopt a "fake rifle stance"? For instance with a right-handed shooter, one could swing the left hand (and the pistol aim-point) to the left until the left arm and the PLR-16 are pointing left far enough for the right arm to fully extend? For me that ends up pointing the gun about 45 degrees to the left of where the body is facing. Of course the head would be looking to the left where the gun is pointing, in order to aim.

That is "kinda like" facing the body to the right of the aim-point when shooting a rifle. If I've explained the idea well enough to be understandable. Have tried that stance a little bit, but not enough to know if it offers any advantage. I shoot pistol right handed but have to aim with left eye. Aiming the gun 45 degrees to the left of where the body is facing, puts the neck and head at an odd angle if you try to aim with left eye.

That "rifle-like" PLR-16 stance ought to be easier if a person could shoot right-handed and aim with right eye, or vice-versa. It is similarly difficult to shoot a rifle right-handed and aim with left eye.

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A triangle stance using the strap for support is my best accuracy so far shooting the PLR-16.

When the PLR-16 strap is adjusted "the perfect length", I can hold the pistol with a conventional two-handed triangle stance. Both hands on the grip like any other pistol. If the strap is adjusted so it goes taught when the arms are fully-extended, then the strap helps support the PLR-16 real steady. With the strap pulling back on its attachment point at the top-rear of the pistol, the strap supports the barrel and it doesn't feel front-heavy at all. With the strap helping out, it doesn't feel near as front-heavy as something like a long-barrel 44 Mag.

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For anti-zombie use, I agree with Jonin that hip-firing might be best, weak hand grasping the horizontal foregrip. To recover as much accuracy as possible, mount the ruggedest brightest green laser one could afford.

Not a laser which refuses to laze in cold temps (as many green lasers refuse to do). Not one that dies the first time it gets a bump. Not one with el-cheapo wiring and switch. Not one that sticks out from the gun with sharp angles just begging to get hung up on a fence or branch and get snatched off the gun. In other words, the laser might well cost more than the PLR-16.

[JoeBobOutfitters]

I like my PLR-16, but it's awful loud without the supressor! I use a Griffin M4SD Comp on mine. It keeps muzzle rise to nill. It increases the concussion a bit, but not nearly as much as the Keltec muzzle brake did.

Supressed (Griffin Armament M4SD supressor) it is awesome. Works well with the Magpul AFG2 and sling combo and the supressor. It takes it down to a hearing protection safe level and is more fun to shoot. I really like the piston driven aspect on pistols as it makes the OAL of the firearm MUCH shorter. My 7.5" barreled 300 Whisper upper I just built is the same OAL with buffer tube as my PLR 16 with a LONGER barrel.

[Steelharp]

I also have the plr, its good to about 200 yards and has the velocity to tumble according to the ballistics I have found, barely, its borderline, though it may do better with actual 556 instead of 223s. Not sure.

Not a 5.56. Don't try those in it. 5.56's will shoot .223's, but the reverse is NOT doable.

[Jonnin]

Not a 5.56. Don't try those in it. 5.56's will shoot .223's, but the reverse is NOT doable.

The gun is rated for it. Its not a 223 only gun. The only thing they say not to do is shoot steel ammo in it.

From the kel-tec site: The PLR-16 is a gas operated, semi-automatic pistol chambered in 5.56 mm NATO caliber.

Edited June 26, 2011 by Jonnin

[Steelharp]

The gun is rated for it. Its not a 223 only gun. The only thing they say not to do is shoot steel ammo in it.

From the kel-tec site: The PLR-16 is a gas operated, semi-automatic pistol chambered in 5.56 mm NATO caliber.

My bad. Thanks for the info!

[Guest ThePunisher]

The AR pistol in what ever caliber you choose just seems like a good truck or car backup gun in extreme situations, due to high capacity mags and light weight in rifle caliber gun. Would easily fit in backpack, tennis rack cover, or just about any bag for concealment. I think I have narrowed choice down to either XCR-L Micro pistol or the LWRC pistol in 6.8 caliber.

Edited June 27, 2011 by ThePunisher

[Jon_L]

People really dislike the XCR due to it's unreliable customer service and spotty machining (you may get a good one, you may not). My father in law has one that he really enjoys, but it wouldn't be much more to get a LWRC, would it?

[tnhawk]

Checked out the AR pistols at Robinson armament and the they have the .6.8 caliber AR pistol. Would this be a better option than the .223 AR pistol?

The cost of feeding the 6.8 would make the .223 a better choice.