COLT: Law Enforcement Carbine ?

[ProjectDexter]

AR Newb <-----

My idea on purchasing my first AR is to get the best base model, most reliable, most "mil-spec" parts etc. for under $1500. In other words, I'm not interested in a build for my first AR.

Other than some research I've started on AR15.com I know pretty much nothing. My first notion was to start with Colt, and go from there.

Can someone help me out with some knowledge on this rifle or have some Pro's/Con's about it?

Colt Law Enforcement

[DaveTN]

I owned a Colt in the 80's. I wouldn't say they are the best quality, they are simply the name associated with the government M16.

For $1500 you can do a heck of a lot better than a plain Jane Colt. You are paying for a name. If you are going to do that pay for the name Smith & Wesson and spend less money, but get more.

Don't fall into the "Law Enforcement" marketing trap; it means nothing in guns or ammunition.

[TNRobocop]

I hate to admit this, but Colt is one of the best you can buy and will retain it's value. They currently are the manufacturer of the military issue M4 and their quality is second to none. There are plenty of dancing pony fanboys out there, but they do make a good point.

There are others out there, some more and some less expensive. I have had Colt, LMT, Ruger, Sabre, home built, etc. The nicest finished ones I have ever had is a Colt.

So no you won't go wrong with a Colt.

[ProjectDexter]

I owned a Colt in the 80's. I wouldn't say they are the best quality, they are simply the name associated with the government M16.

For $1500 you can do a heck of a lot better than a plain Jane Colt. You are paying for a name. If you are going to do that pay for the name Smith & Wesson and spend less money, but get more.

Don't fall into the "Law Enforcement" marketing trap; it means nothing in guns or ammunition.

Thanks for you comment, let me show my lack of knowledge, which model of "plane jane Colt" are you referring to? Did you mean the Law enforcement is the plane jane Colt? Sorry misunderstood at first.

I'm open for any and all suggestions as I have just started my research.

Edited June 18, 2011 by ProjectDexter

[Karnage]

For $1500 you can do a heck of a lot better than a plain Jane Colt. You are paying for a name. If you are going to do that pay for the name Smith & Wesson and spend less money, but get more.

Don't fall into the "Law Enforcement" marketing trap; it means nothing in guns or ammunition.

I am issued a Colt LE/Govt 6520 (the A2 version). It does not shoot any better or worse than my Smith & Wesson, Del-ton or my Frankenstein AR. On top of paying for the Colt brand anything marked Law Enforcement is always more expensive.

Check out BravoCompanyUSA.com I have been really impressed with their rifles.

[Guest kickstand]

I've used a few Colts with work, but have not owned one personally. The factory LMT I owned had smoother controls, and I preferred shooting it because it came with a nicer grip and stock. All of the big name AR's are reliable if you take care of them properly, and my home builds shoot just as well as my issued Colt. I would suggest going to a shop and playing with different ones and picking out one that's set up the way you like it. You can spend $1500 on a nice rifle if you want, but you do not have to drop that kind of coin to get one that will never let you down. You might be better off spending the extra $500 on optics, or better yet, ammo.

[DaveTN]

Thanks for you comment, let me show my lack of knowledge, which model of "plane jane Colt" are you referring to? Did you mean the Law enforcement is the plane jane Colt? Sorry misunderstood at first.

I'm open for any and all suggestions as I have just started my research.

The one you linked. The LE6920 is pretty plain by todays standards.

Its $1200 at Buds or $1100 at CDNN with a free Quad rail.

I decided to go this route (the 811001)....

because I use optics, so an A2 was out of the question and I really didn't want the stanadrd A2 front sight; its just in the way. I don't need/want a carry handle either. (Although I got one free with it)

Edited June 18, 2011 by DaveTN

[ProjectDexter]

I've used a few Colts with work, but have not owned one personally. The factory LMT I owned had smoother controls, and I preferred shooting it because it came with a nicer grip and stock. All of the big name AR's are reliable if you take care of them properly, and my home builds shoot just as well as my issued Colt. I would suggest going to a shop and playing with different ones and picking out one that's set up the way you like it. You can spend $1500 on a nice rifle if you want, but you do not have to drop that kind of coin to get one that will never let you down. You might be better off spending the extra $500 on optics, or better yet, ammo.

That is indeed my plan. Even the colt link I posted can be had for under $1200. If I could find a decent rifle in the $1000 range with chrome lined bore and perhaps some other mil spec parts I would be very pleased.

[Seaslug]

You can get various BCM upper groups (minus handguards) on their site for as little as $399. You can get a complete BCM lower (minus stock) at gandrtactical.com for $340. Add a mil-spec BCG (Daniel Defense, LMT, maybe even Spike's) for $140 or less. Add a mil-spec charging handle (I actually prefer the VLTOR/BCM Gunfighter Mod 4), a stock of some sort, a rear BUIS, and a Magpul MOE handguard, and you've got just a hair over $1k in a rifle that'll be at least as good as anything with a pony stamped on the side. Just my $0.02...

[ProjectDexter]

You can get various BCM upper groups (minus handguards) on their site for as little as $399. You can get a complete BCM lower (minus stock) at gandrtactical.com for $340. Add a mil-spec BCG (Daniel Defense, LMT, maybe even Spike's) for $140 or less. Add a mil-spec charging handle (I actually prefer the VLTOR/BCM Gunfighter Mod 4), a stock of some sort, a rear BUIS, and a Magpul MOE handguard, and you've got just a hair over $1k in a rifle that'll be at least as good as anything with a pony stamped on the side. Just my $0.02...

I am not interested in a build currently, too many other things happening, however I do plan on doing a build down the road. What is all the Hoopla over the Piston ARs over the standard Gas system. Is something like this a key player in deciding on a "reliable AR system"?

[DaveTN]

Is something like this a key player in deciding on a "reliable AR system"?

Nope. Always do your research and determine if the “optionâ€(Whatever it is) applies to your application. I clean my guns after every range session. The only thing I would get out of paying extra for a piston gun is being able to say I have a piston gun. And I may do that in the future. Bragging rights is a valid application for some.

[Seaslug]

I am not interested in a build currently, too many other things happening, however I do plan on doing a build down the road. What is all the Hoopla over the Piston ARs over the standard Gas system. Is something like this a key player in deciding on a "reliable AR system"?

Methinks you're overthinking what exactly constitutes a "build". If you buy a complete upper and a complete lower--from the same manufacturer, no less--you're not doing any more "building" than you would be the first time you clean that Colt you're considering (which should be as soon as you take it home). When us AR folks talk about "builds", it usually includes installing the lower parts kit, grip, and receiver extension in the lower, and possibly even the barrel and the gas tube in the upper. With my suggestion, all the actual work has already been done for you. Hope that clears things up.

[ProjectDexter]

Methinks you're overthinking what exactly constitutes a "build". If you buy a complete upper and a complete lower--from the same manufacturer, no less--you're not doing any more "building" than you would be the first time you clean that Colt you're considering (which should be as soon as you take it home). When us AR folks talk about "builds", it usually includes installing the lower parts kit, grip, and receiver extension in the lower, and possibly even the barrel and the gas tube in the upper. With my suggestion, all the actual work has already been done for you. Hope that clears things up.

Yes I understand. By build I was more thinking, I don't want to purchase 4-5 different pieces of a weapon from different places just to save a few bucks, and then worry if I made the right purchases, when I could just buy an already put together system that I don't have to worry about it working well "together" or not. For a first time buyer of course.

[Dolomite_supafly]

Colt is milspec throughout. Milspec is not a guarantee to be the best, it is a the minimum standard accepted by the government and in no way shape or form makes it the best. There are several other manufacturers that are better than Colt and run in the same price range. Bravo Company has more standard quality components in their rifles than Colt. Their warranty work, if you ever need it, is among the best in the industry.

Colt has had problems with the QC as well. How do you think the large pin receivers came about? It is when they screwed up the small holes and redrilled them larger to fix the problem. I know that was in the past but if they have a barrel that isn't true they still bend it into spec which is probably fine until you heat the barrel up again from firing.

I have owned Colts in the past and in my opinion you are paying for the name more so than the quality of the firearm. They do hold their value better but other than that they are far from the best.

Dolomite

[ProjectDexter]

The more i've been researching today the more good things I have read about Bravo Company, as a result I'm sure, they are not even accepting orders until mid-summer because they are so far back ordered. I have also been researching Daniel Defense DDM4, LMT's, Sig 516, S&W's and Bushmaster. It's pretty difficult cutting through all the AR verbage, and Bullcrap

[Dolomite_supafly]

The more i've been researching today the more good things I have read about Bravo Company, as a result I'm sure, they are not even accepting orders until mid-summer because they are so far back ordered. I have also been researching Daniel Defense DDM4, LMT's, Sig 516, S&W's and Bushmaster. It's pretty difficult cutting through all the AR verbage, and Bullcrap

ARFCOM isn't the best place to try to cut throguh the bull crap. A lot of high end fan boys over there that believe the only good AR is the one that cost $3,000.

Dolomite

[Jasongar8]

ARFCOM isn't the best place to try to cut throguh the bull crap.

+1 Most guys on AFRCOM can't tell their ass from a hole in the ground.

[ProjectDexter]

ARFCOM isn't the best place to try to cut throguh the bull crap. A lot of high end fan boys over there that believe the only good AR is the one that cost $3,000.

Dolomite

Agreed, ran into the same thing when I went on a 1911 spree. The FAQ section is pretty in depth though, besides that google is my friend, helps to hear from exp. guys on here too.

[Seaslug]

The more i've been researching today the more good things I have read about Bravo Company, as a result I'm sure, they are not even accepting orders until mid-summer because they are so far back ordered. I have also been researching Daniel Defense DDM4, LMT's, Sig 516, S&W's and Bushmaster. It's pretty difficult cutting through all the AR verbage, and Bullcrap

I just told you how you could put together a complete Bravo Company (BCM) rifle yourself for around $1k by using just 2 vendors (BCM and G&R Tactical), you big goober. If you can push in 2 receiver pins, you're good to go...

[Guest kickstand]

Another note on Colt's QC, the finish on my brand new M4's bolt was pretty muffed up and uneven, as were some others that I have seen in our batch. They run fine, but it's just some half-assed craftsmanship that you might not expect from Colt.

[ProjectDexter]

I just told you how you could put together a complete Bravo Company (BCM) rifle yourself for around $1k by using just 2 vendors (BCM and G&R Tactical), you big goober. If you can push in 2 receiver pins, you're good to go...

lol, its at the top of the list!!! Just trying to sponge up the mass amounts of info!

[Links2k]

I am biased, but take a good look at the Smith & Wesson M&P line. They are very solid.

[ProjectDexter]

I am biased, but take a good look at the Smith & Wesson M&P line. They are very solid.

THanks, I was looking at the 15X and the 15T models, what are some of the "better" models?

[Links2k]

THanks, I was looking at the 15X and the 15T models, what are some of the "better" models?

I have the 15T. It's the best for my needs.

[bajabuc]

Maybe I read the announcement wrong...but..."Direct gas system." Isn't that just asking for trouble?