Purifying water?

[Will Carry]

I have heard that you can use Clorox bleach to purify water. The guy was a retired Marine full bird. Do any of you guys know what the ratio of bleach to water is that will purify water and not be toxic?

He also said you could mix sea water with fresh water to stretch your supply but I have forgotten what the ratio is too. It's something like 1 part sea water to 6 parts fresh water.

[MacGyver]

Three drops of clorox to one quart of water. Best to run it through a cloth first if you've got heavy particulate matter.

Wait an hour to drink... Up to 4 hours if it's really cold.

[MacGyver]

Mixing fresh and seawater is almost always going to get you in trouble sooner or later. I'd much rather set up a solar still or the like using some trash bags or 2 liter bottles to convert that seawater to fresh. I always carry some heavy duty black trash bags when I'm at sea on a smaller vessel. In a pinch, you put seawater in a container, partially inflate and seal the bag around the container, then collect your water as it evaporates and cools out of the bottom of the bag.

There are a lot of variants of this that can be pretty easily improvised.

Have you got a particular environment in mind?

[enfield]

16 drops to a gallon per the ready.gov website.

[MacGyver]

It should also be noted with Clorox or other bleach products that after the treatment time, you can leave the container open to let the residual chlorine and the associated taste dissipate.

[bigwakes]

Be sure it's straight bleach. No color enhancer or any other chemicals. You can also use pool shock for swimming pools.

[Jonnin]

yea evaporate it, condense it, and then add the bleach is what I would do if I could. If not, bleach will kill most anything. Boiling it, if nothing else, will kill almost all the baddies, if you have no bleach either.

[MacGyver]

So long as your system is clean, evaporation followed by condensation is appropriate.

Likewise, if you have the means to boil it, a 10 minute rolling boil will take care of all viruses, bacteria and other Protozoa. It won't take care of chemical contamination.

Chlorine based treatments are another effective measure.

An important comment should be made concerning untreated freshwater in survival situations. That is, the average time to rescue, whether self-rescue or from a SAR team is much shorter than the incubation time of any of the baddies we have in our waters in North America. And, they're all treatable at this point. If your life depends on it and you reasonably believe that you'll be found, drink the water. You'll die a lot faster from dehydration than you will from anything in the water.

[Guest SUNTZU]

I recommend a couple bottles of this laying around. It is NOT the same as the Aqua Pure tablets in Walmart and camping stores.

Polar Pure Water Disinfectant

[Oh Shoot]

...Likewise, if you have the means to boil it, a 10 minute rolling boil will take care of all viruses, bacteria and other Protozoa.

Why do you adhere to 10 mi Everything I read says 1 min is plenty, if not more than needed. Indeed, 160 degrees kills everything within half an hour and 185 degrees kills everything within minutes even if boil isn't reached. It would seem that surely if boiling point is reached at all, should suffice fine?

- OS

[DavidD]

You can also use pool shock for swimming pools.

Only if you don't have bleach. Powdered pool shock (generally Dichloroisocyanuric acid) has cyanuric acid, aka stabilizer, and some have copper, be sure to read the label. Others are based off of calcium or lithium. If I had a choice of the 3, I'd use cal-hypo first.

Bleach is a much better option, although not as stable (If left in sunlight, it will will degrade rapidly) It's only real by-product is salt.

[MacGyver]

Why do you adhere to 10 mi Everything I read says 1 min is plenty, if not more than needed. Indeed, 160 degrees kills everything within half an hour and 185 degrees kills everything within minutes even if boil isn't reached. It would seem that surely if boiling point is reached at all, should suffice fine?

- OS

I agree with you on this, OhShoot. I've always been of the perception that if 160F is good enough for our whole food industry, it's good enough for me (even though I would likely reach a boil to avoid underestimating 160F).

I actually got this info as a part of a survival class where there were concerns with certain viruses not being killed shy of a prolonged full boil. I checked it when I got back with a colleague who is a municipal water manager and she confirmed it. I'll try and dig up the specifics.

I'll reiterate what I said before, though. While I carry more than one purification method while I'm in the field, and can improvise many more, if your life depends on it, don't avoid drinking because you aren't certain of the cleanliness. If you don't smell chemicals or sewage, it's not likely to kill you before you get rescued.

[bigwakes]

Only if you don't have bleach. Powdered pool shock (generally Dichloroisocyanuric acid) has cyanuric acid, aka stabilizer, and some have copper, be sure to read the label. Others are based off of calcium or lithium. If I had a choice of the 3, I'd use cal-hypo first.

Bleach is a much better option, although not as stable (If left in sunlight, it will will degrade rapidly) It's only real by-product is salt.

I'm no expert, but there are some dissenting opinions on the topic.

Better than Bleach: Use Calcium Hypochlorite to Disinfect Water

[Will Carry]

Thanks for the feedback guys. We were talking about survival food on North Carolina Gun Owners forum and someone mentioned that food is secondary to water in a survival scenario. I figured the TGO boys would know something about it.

Edited June 16, 2011 by Will Carry

[peejman]

The big two things that may be found in typical backcountry streams are Cryptoproiduim and Giardia.

Cryptosporidiosis - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Giardia - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The main reason why it's stated to boil water is simply because it's visually obvious and ensures you got the water hot enough. I doubt most folks will have a 250 deg thermometer handy to know when they've reached 160 deg. But also as stated... dehydration will kill you much faster than any of these bugs.

Portable water purification - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Backpacker Magazine - Water Purification Techniques

[bajabuc]

They make a reverse osmosis Hand Pump. it's not very big but you could pee in it and pump it and drink the water. so they say. They're not cheap but if you don't buy one more AR you could get one. The junk in our water is man's fault...too many people doing their business too close to beavers. Wyoming Game and Fish say there's no water in North America that's free of Giardia. BTW...giardia is no fun and it can and has killed.

[Will Carry]

I had two friends get Giardia after paddling a canoe and swimming down Crooked Fork Creek near Wartburg. One was sick for months. Neither well ever paddle Crooked Fork Creek again. I paddle it all the time and have had no problems.

[buck1032]

They make a reverse osmosis Hand Pump. it's not very big but you could pee in it and pump it and drink the water. so they say. They're not cheap but if you don't buy one more AR you could get one. The junk in our water is man's fault...too many people doing their business too close to beavers. Wyoming Game and Fish say there's no water in North America that's free of Giardia. BTW...giardia is no fun and it can and has killed.

The hand pump reverse osmosis pumps are awesome, IF you have lots and lots of water. It has been years since I played with one and if I remember right you will need several(5 or more) gallons of water to produce 1 gallon of pure water and yes you can get pure water from sewage with one. The more contaminated the more water needed to make one gallon.

When I was at the Naval SERE school in the late 90's I heard a Dr. from UCSD give a lecture on water. He stated that approx 98% of the worlds water sources are contaminated at their source.

[DavidD]

I'm no expert, but there are some dissenting opinions on the topic.

Better than Bleach: Use Calcium Hypochlorite to Disinfect Water

For long term storage and weight consideration, I must agree. But again, be sure to use Cal-Hypo (Calcium Hypochlorite) as MOST pool shock you see in bags are Dichlor. Cal-Hypo's by product is calcium. Also be sure it doesn't say "Dual Action" or contain copper.

[luvmyberetta]

You can use iodine for water purification too. In Boy Scouts, years ago, we have used both methods during survival training for drinking and dish washing.

[bajabuc]

They make a reverse osmosis Hand Pump. it's not very big but you could pee in it and pump it and drink the water. so they say. They're not cheap but if you don't buy one more AR you could get one. The junk in our water is man's fault...too many people doing their business too close to beavers. Wyoming Game and Fish say there's no water in North America that's free of Giardia. BTW...giardia is no fun and it can and has killed.

I found 2 one is milsurp

Katadyn Survivor 35 Manual Reverse Osmosis Desalinator | eBay

[buck1032]

I have heard that you can use Clorox bleach to purify water. The guy was a retired Marine full bird. Do any of you guys know what the ratio of bleach to water is that will purify water and not be toxic?

He also said you could mix sea water with fresh water to stretch your supply but I have forgotten what the ratio is too. It's something like 1 part sea water to 6 parts fresh water.

The rule of thumb with bleach (sodium hypochlorite) is 10 for 2 and 2 for 10. Meaning if your bleach is 2% then use 10 drops per quart and if your bleach is 10% use 2 drops per quart.

As far as mixing sea water with potable water, that is a very bad call. Yes you can decrease the amount of salt in your water in the short term but you will still be speading up dehydration.

Edited June 19, 2011 by buck1032
spellin'

[analog_kidd]

I had two friends get Giardia after paddling a canoe and swimming down Crooked Fork Creek near Wartburg. One was sick for months. Neither well ever paddle Crooked Fork Creek again. I paddle it all the time and have had no problems.

The Wartburg municipal sewage treatment plant dumps their treated sewage directly into Crooked Fork. I have kayaked that creek several times and always make sure to keep my mouth closed tight while on the creek, and use alchohol drops in the ears afterward. Great creek though. Do you still paddle?

[R1100R]

An oldie but a goodie. Army manual FM 21-10

Still in use. Look in the annex for water purification tables.

http://ec.europa.eu/echo/files/policies/evaluation/watsan2005/annex_files/USACE/USACE2%20-%20Field%20Sanitation.pdf

Edited June 20, 2011 by R1100R