Training Stance????

[alamogunr]

I don't post here often because my main interests are not concealed carry even though I have a permit. I have been shooting handguns for many years and own too many to become more than proficient with any one of them("Beware the man with one gun. Or something like that.). I'm leading up to a question about something I saw on Nashville TV news in the last few days. The clips showed what looked like training classes on the firing range. Each of the participants was holding his weapon almost in line with his chin. It was a two handed grip but still very close to the head. Is this something new? Have Nashville training classes come up with a new stance to replace the Weaver or Isosceles? The only thing I can think of is they are trying to teach weapon retention. I guess this would work.

There are several handguns that I don't want that close to my ears even with protection. Any comments or info to enlighten me?

[BigPoppa]

There is one particular instructor in the Nashville area who teaches that stance/method. He is the only one that I am aware of, and yes, his reasoning is that it offers better gun retention capabilities.

[DBTN]

Not sure what department it was but unless it was some type of retention drill it was not Metro PD. They teach the isosceles. What you described sounds like the Center Axis Re-lock that is taught by Paul Castle. I thing Hendersonville PD prescribes to that method.

[Guest canynracer]

Like This???

http://www.sabretactical.com/CAR/car.html

[Guest ETS_Inc]

Yeah, you're definitely thinking of the Center-Axle Relock stance. It's taught by one instructor in Nashville, and only that one. In my opinion, it's not really a beginner's stance, and shouldn't be taught to novices as the only stance they learn.

[Guest Shooting Coach]

Although Buford Tune claims credit (sic) for this mostly useless stance, it was developed by Paul Castle. Why, I do not know. I guess some folks want to invent a solution in search of a problem.

This stance exposes a vest wearing LEO to mortal danger, and restricts anyone's ability to retreat or advance quickly.

I have taken many classes from high speed trainers, and have never seen this stance taught.

If a poor soul ever shoots his firearm in that stance without hearing protection, he will pay for it the rest of his life. One would think a competent trainer would take this into consideration. A ported, or magnum handgun would almost guarantee immediate, permanent hearing loss.

[Guest ETS_Inc]

Hearing damage isn't the only reason I'm not a fan of this stance.

This stance requires the shooter's body to be turned 90 degrees away from the threat. That's great if you're trying to make your body a smaller target. But, if you train with only this stance, you'll be at a severe disadvantage when you're attacked from the front. Are you seriously going to spin 90 degrees, so that you fall into the only stance with which you've trained?

Personally, I mostly shoot Improved Weaver, as it's what I've always used, and I don't wear body armor on a daily basis. The thing I like most about Improved Weaver is that it is very much a basic martial arts / athletic stance. Anyone who's played any major sport, run track, or been in a fist fight, should be comfortable with Improved Weaver. It gives great balance for handling the weapon, it allows quick transition from gunplay to fisticuffs (or vice versa), and it allows easier movement laterally, forward, and backward, as well as more comfortable kneeling than Isoceles. (At least, I find it easier and more comfortable.)

Of course, like I tell my students, the best technique to use in any lethal force encounter is the one that brings you through to the other end. If you fight hopping on one leg, with your non-dominant hand stuck in your ear, and you win, guess what? That technique worked. It might not have worked as well as some others would have, but it worked for that fight.

There is, in my opinion, no set-in-stone, absolute rule that says you have to fight a certain way. You can't guarantee that you'll get into a lethal force encounter with your enemy set up in the way you always train. That's why you don't allow yourself to get into a training rut. Don't get stuck inside the box. Think outside of the box, and train for as many situations as you can imagine, knowing that you must be prepared to fight in whatever manner it takes to survive.

[Marswolf]

Here's a good page on stances:

http://www.corneredcat.com/Basics/stance.aspx

I prefer the Modified or Modern Isosceles stance, probably because of martial arts training early in life.

[Guest Shooting Coach]

Frank makes a LOT of sense.

[Guest ETS_Inc]

Frank makes a LOT of sense.

Dude, you're going to ruin my reputation. (Seriously, thank you for the compliment.)