Obama

[mikegideon]

Whew. I am relieved. I thought that you were going to say Kenyan.

Half Kenyan

[Oh Shoot]

Photoshop doesn't show it. Here is a screenshot from Illustrator. Note the layers and the links, which are files created in another program and added to Illustrator.

Glenn

Where did you get file, Glenn?

Mine is from:

http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/rss_viewer/birth-certificate-long-form.pdf

And shows no such layers or links in my version of Illustrator CS. While it's pretty fishy, I'm beginning to think there are even further versions with added stuff being thrown out there by folks to further tin foil everything up?

Of course, sure, the WH could have substituted new file by now, too, I know.

- OS

Edited May 9, 2011 by OhShoot

[Glenn]

This file was downloaded from the White House website the first or second day it was available.

Glenn

[Guest Lester Weevils]

Hi OS

Different versions/builds of illustrator? Mac version versus PC version?

Does your version let you click on an object and then un-group the object?

[Glenn]

Where did you get file, Glenn?

Mine is from:

http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/rss_viewer/birth-certificate-long-form.pdf

And shows no such layers or links in my version of Illustrator CS. While it's pretty fishy, I'm beginning to think there are even further versions with added stuff being thrown out there by folks to further tin foil everything up?

Of course, sure, the WH could have substituted new file by now, too, I know.

- OS

The link you posted is the same file. I am using CS 4 at home and CS 5 at work. Both show the same thing. I really think this is all a diversion by the WH to run through something else

Glenn

[Oh Shoot]

Hi OS

Different versions/builds of illustrator? Mac version versus PC version?

Does your version let you click on an object and then un-group the object?

No, it's all bitmap. The group/ungroup only becomes viable where there are two discrete or more forms within the doc. I can add something to it, and group/ungroup, but the PDF itself is all one whole bitmap, no vector info at ll. I'm not really Illustrator literate though, just have it as part of an Adobe bundle, so I could be missing something I suppose.

I suspect that draw program you downloaded is merely grouping sections by interpreting its own vector overlay on similar abutting sections of the overall bitmap though. I had a draw program from MS, forget its name, that would sort of do that. But I can't say that for sure either, since I don't know that proggie you're using.

- OS

[Glenn]

OS. Do a select all then go to the object menu and do clipping mask-release. This allows you to see the frame edges and reveals where some of the edits were made. The edits don't prove this is not Obama's BC or that he was not born in Hawaii. It's just strange.

One other thing, it is not from the Hospital that he said erlier that he was born in.

I am going to bed. This tinfoil hat makes me sleepy.

Glenn

[Oh Shoot]

OS. Do a select all then go to the object menu and do clipping mask-release. This allows you to see the frame edges and reveals where some of the edits were made. The edits don't prove this is not Obama's BC or that he was not born in Hawaii. It's just strange.

One other thing, it is not from the Hospital that he said erlier that he was born in.

I am going to bed. This tinfoil hat makes me sleepy.

Glenn

Sent you PM to send me your file to compare, just for the helluva it.

- OS

[Glenn]

By the way, there is no vector information in the file. All the links are raster images. When a image is compressed with jpeg compression, it leaves visible artifacts. The more compression the more artifacts. Some parts of the document show heavy compression and some don't

Glenn

[Oh Shoot]

By the way, there is no vector information in the file. All the links are raster images. When a image is compressed with jpeg compression, it leaves visible artifacts. The more compression the more artifacts. Some parts of the document show heavy compression and some don't

Glenn

Yes, I agree that among other oddities, I can see different levels of artifacts.

There's no doubt the thing has been futzed quite a bit.

I don't get the overwhelmingly obvious mystery of the green "security" background being interposed around what was obviously the original scan (if indeed there actually ever WAS one), with the registrar's info being on that.

I mainly just want to "confirm" that the file you got from WH site is different from the file I got from WH site.

- OS

[Guest Lester Weevils]

Hi OS

I'm not so certain that it isn't just some combination of scanning hardware + software doing data reduction and ocr. Am not making any claims one way or t'other. It is just interesting for a nerd.

That Mac X11 inkscape open source program pulls out eight sub-objects. All of the objects are bitmaps. No Vectors. Here is a reduced screen-grab showing them pulled apart. Apologies it is a little big even when reduced. Just showing what I see.

The color bitmap to the left is identical to what the PC version of Elements 8 extracted from the doc. The other 1-bit bitmaps are identical to some shown in some of the videos, except the videos show more objects than just these. My copy of the pdf was downloaded from whitehouse.gov 11:13 am today Sunday.

[Oh Shoot]

Hi OS

I'm not so certain that it isn't just some combination of scanning hardware + software doing data reduction and ocr.

Well, if there were OCR involved, there would be vector text, eh? That's the only reason TO use OCR.

That Mac X11 inkscape open source program pulls out eight sub-objects. All of the objects are bitmaps.

Well, Illustrator shows 9 "links" if you do the select all/clipping mask release thing that Glenn mentioned. Two are blank but 7 sort of correspond to what your program shows. Which evidentally indicates that these areas were independently created, moved, whatever, if I understand Glenn's explanation.

However, my Illustrator keeps only showing one layer, and now that I look at his screen shot a little more, I see that his does too, it's just expanded to show the different stuff in that layer, which I admit I don't really understand the program enough to grok exactly what that means, etc..

At any rate, we all three do seem to be working on the same file (I downloaded mine today also), PDF shows creation date of 4/27/11 at 12:09:24.

But he hasn't sent me his file, so I'm beginning to think he's in on it.

All in all, I can see the differences in pixel compression in just PDF viewer, so that fact alone is enough to create plenty of doubt.

- OS

[Guest Lester Weevils]

Hi OS.

Actually I had nine sub-objects too, but didn't notice one until had already posted the image and message. Look at the small "blank" selection rectangle at the top-center of the color bitmap. That is the ninth one I didn't notice earlier.

[Oh Shoot]

Got the file from Glenn, just to confirm: yeah, we are all three using same PDF file, and I can see exactly same thing that he does, just not as hip to the program to fully understand the results.

- OS

[Guest Lester Weevils]

Some CAD type programs mix vectors and bitmaps. Each primitive object can be grouped and handled as an object. Groups of grouped objects can be grouped. Many of these grouped objects can exist in a layer, and a doc can contain multiple layers.

It is very convenient for instance if you need a symbol for an opamp you can create a triangle, '+' and '-' text string objects, and a few tiny circles. Then arrange the objects to look like an opamp then group them and clone as many of the groups as you like in a layer to make a schematic. Then draw lines to connect them up.

Scanning software conceivably could exploit the same file structure for data reduction. Which may be the most likely explanation.

I just wonder if software can be that smart, then why the heck is it so difficult to for instance brighten up a black dog in a picture so he is easier to see, without screwing up the contrast of the rest of the picture? I'm kinda joking, but for me the software smarts to isolate image elements would be more useful getting a good picture of the dawg rather than optimizing a scan of a paper form. Photoshop for me hardly ever finds useful auto-paths in a photo.

[mcurrier]

Obama birth certificate linked to previous ‘forgery’? | Conservative Byte

[Guest mosinon]

What? No one bothers to the obvious and experiment? Scan some stuff in, stuff you know to be legit and run it through crappy OCR or something and see what you get. I don't know what you'll end up with but it will beat speculation. Yeah, you know some fakes cause you've seen the pixels and all but what would be more telling is if you can recreate this as an official document or as a fake.

But it doesn't really matter. That guy won by 10 million votes. People get what they want no matter how hard the rest of the people don't want it.

[Guest Lester Weevils]

The whole idea of a yankee becoming a southerner somehow, further shows how yankee someone is.

Standing in the garage, no matter how long, does not make you a car.

Now I don't recollect reading the above remark at the time. Never heard that turn of phrase but that there is funny no matter who you are. Did you think that up sigmtnman?

So anyway the reason for update-- This news conference was a big splash with multiple red headlines on drudge for about 12 hours a couple of days ago, and then got demoted to one headline. Dunno if it is gone entirely today.

I neither believe nor disbelieve the birther mess but here is a video link to the entire hour and twenty-four minute news conference. In my opinion it is real interesting. Infinitely more interesting than Dancing With The Stars, The O'Reilly Show, or The Blair Witch Project anyhoo.

There were many videos and news articles showing part of the conference but it took a few minutes work to locate a video of the whole shebang. Figgered it is remotely possible that I'm not the only fool in the world depraved enough to enjoy it. As said, I'm not even convinced that the sun will rise tomorrow, but some of the alleged evidence might indicate (pick yer poison)--

1. Extremely low-probability coincidence.

2. Something or t'other is intentionally fishy with the birth certificate

3. Arpaio and crew are not only completely delusional but also lying their asses off.

[media=]

[/media]

[sigmtnman]

Now I don't recollect reading the above remark at the time. Never heard that turn of phrase but that there is funny no matter who you are. Did you think that up sigmtnman?

...

Dang, I had forgotten I even posted in this thread and had to go hunting for the context. No, I can't take credit for it. Just a modification of "Going to church doesn't make you a Christian, any more than standing in a garage makes you a car.".

Now, IMO to be a southerner you must have kin that fought for the south or been sympathizers if there were no men of age. I'd also argue you can't have adopted the yankee ways.

---

He's dug in like a tick on a hound dog. I gotta wonder if it's not a dog and pony show to distract everyone from something bigger. Who knows, but it is entertaining.

Edited July 20, 2012 by sigmtnman

[Guest ThePunisher]

Like I said...I voted for him..I'll do it again. I will never vote for an oilman. Haslem included. ( Ol' 5buck a gallon)

Oh, so you're of the old democrat mindset that what was good for your great, great, grand pappy because he voted Democrat no matter if that Democrat is even a communist, then you are gonna vote for a communist Democrat. Well, I'm here to inform you that you truly voted for America's first communist Democrat in the WH.

Geeze. Sheeple would follow a wolf in sheepskin clothing over a cliff.

[Guest ThePunisher]

All Presidents since Jefferson Davis have sucked.

Except Ronald Reagan.

[Oh Shoot]

Except Ronald Reagan.

Who, before becoming a Conservative God, was an uber Hollywood liberal union president.

Which shows that a feller like Mitt really doesn't have to maintain the same viewpoints his entire political life to be an effective head of state.

- OS