Sticky Chamber

[Caster]

Bought a neck sizing die for 308 yesterday. For my Savage 10PC, I'm using virgin Hornady Match brass. Now that I have fired one lot through the rifle, I want to neck size only for accuracy and longer brass life. Here's the rub: I neck sized some this morning and brought a few in the house to check in the rifle and see how they chamber. They go in smooth and easy, bolt closes like butter. Lift the handle and re row! It won't come out. Now it came out, I tried several and they all came out but more than normal amount of force was required to tug the bolt open.

Is this a normal occurrence? New to neck sizing only, I wouldn't know. I wonder if they will come out easier after they have been polished in the tumbler [haven't done that yet] and after they have been fired again. I had ZERO issues extracting them at the range for the first firing, and yes the rifle chamber is spotless. You could eat off the thing.

Thanks

†††Caster†††

[Jonnin]

does your size die bell the mouth a bit for seating, meaning you need to seat & crimp before trying in the gun?

[leroy]

Caster:____________________

Take some denatured alcohol (...may be called "methanol" --- the kind you buy in the lowes paint department....) and carefully clean the brass all over, concentrating on the body of the brass. Take a big bore mop or patch and thoroughly clean the chamber. This will remove any oil or powder residue from both the brass and the rifle chamber. My guess is that the rifle's chamber is a bit dirty or has a little bit of oil in it. Capillarity (...think of it as suction...) or dirt may be holding the brass in the chamber.

When you neck size the brass, the fired brass body of the cartridge expands and fits the chamber almost exactly; and the neck only is "resized" back down to hold the bullet in. The idea of "neck sizing" is to work the brass as little as possible and get the best possible fit for that particular brass and rifle by leaving the "body" of the brass unsized so that the fired cartridge exactly fits that particular rifle's chamber. We used to do it all the time with the 222a, 308s and 300 win mags.

By the way, ya cant swap neck sized brass between two different rifles of the same caliber. The minute chamber differences will most likely be enough that the neck sized brass will not fit the other gun.

Hope this helps.

leroy

Edited April 17, 2011 by leroy
spellin!!!!

[Westwindmike]

Caster,

Use one of your neck sized cases and make a dummy round. Seat the bullet(or boolit), crimp and then try loading and extracting. I bet it works better then.

[Caster]

does your size die bell the mouth a bit for seating, meaning you need to seat & crimp before trying in the gun?

No it doesn't.

Caster:____________________

Take some denatured alcohol (...may be called "methanol" --- the kind you buy in the lowes paint department....) and carefully clean the brass all over, concentrating on the body of the brass. Take a big bore mop or patch and thoroughly clean the chamber. This will remove any oil or powder residue from both the brass and the rifle chamber. My guess is that the rifle's chamber is a bit dirty or has a little bit of oil in it. Capillarity (...think of it as suction...) or dirt may be holding the brass in the chamber.

When you neck size the brass, the fired brass body of the cartridge expands and fits the chamber almost exactly; and the neck only is "resized" back down to hold the bullet in. The idea of "neck sizing" is to work the brass as little as possible and get the best possible fit for that particular brass and rifle by leaving the "body" of the brass unsized so that the fired cartridge exactly fits that particular rifle's chamber. We used to do it all the time with the 222a, 308s and 300 win mags.

By the way, ya cant swap neck sized brass between two different rifles of the same caliber. The minute chamber differences will most likely be enough that the neck sized brass will not fit the other gun.

Hope this helps.

leroy

Like I said, my chamber is spotless. I did clean one case with acetone and it still stuck....I shouldn't say stuck, it was just a touch tight on the extract. I'm guessing it's the same principle as the morse taper. The morse tape if made accurately will lock together with no mechanical fasteners and I challenge any man to pull them a part!!! They have to be drifted apart either from the opposite end or a milled slot and a punch.

Caster,

Use one of your neck sized cases and make a dummy round. Seat the bullet(or boolit), crimp and then try loading and extracting. I bet it works better then.

Going to try that next. Thanks bud.

[Alleycat72]

Load a round in the normal fashion and fire it. The brass will extract like it’s been greased.

[glockster157]

How far down are you neck sizing? You should only size about 2/3rds of the neck. If you go all the way to the bottom of the neck and bump the shoulder you could be changing the case shape slightly.

[Caster]

Well, with a Lee Collet neck sizer, you don't get much play as far as how deep you go. Not as far as I can see anywho. I know I really snuck up on it when I adjusted it so as not to buckle a case or disturb the shoulder.

[glockster157]

Oh, I didn't know it was a a Lee....I have both Lee and RCBS. The Lee usually works well. If you are sizing to the shell holder you could try backing off a bit. One other thing, check case length. It is highly unlikely that it would cause the problem you describe but it is one of the only other factors I can think of right now.

[Dolomite_supafly]

Something else you could do to help is use a Redding body die as well. It adds a step but it makes factory sized brass without wearing out your brass. The dies that do both in the same step work harden the brass because is squeezes the neck down then mandrels it back out. All this extra work kills the neck and leads to cracks in under 5 loadings unless you anneal.

I use the Lee collet die and a Redding body die and I have a lot more than 5 loadings without annealing or anything. Another advantage by seperating the body and neck sizing steps is the brass doesn't seem to grow.

I neck sized for a while but in the end I added the Redding body die. The reason is I had a bunch of neck sized brass for a particular firearm then I changed my firearm and had to go through and body size them. After doing that once I decided to neck and body size all of my brass that way they are universal. All my brass is sized the same regardless of the weapon it is to be fired in.

When using the collet die set your press to bottom out at the time is sizes the neck. Some people just apply a bunch of force but that isn't a very consistent way of doing it. After all if you are doing 200 pieces of brass you are probably going to be less tired at the beginning. If you set it up to stop at a certain point it will be more consistent which leads to accuracy. If you decide you want more neck tension take the mandrel out, chuck it into a drill and use sandpaper to take a few thousands off the diameter. You may or may not have to reset the die, the last time I sanded mine I ddn't and it works great.

If you are wanting to truly minimize the working of your brass, as well as increase consistency and accuracy, do what I did to my Savage. I took a fired case, neck sized then body sized it. After that I loosened the barrel then snugged the barrel down onto the piece of brass I sized. Then I tightened the nut down to lock everything down. This sets the headspace to YOUR sized brass and your fired brass will be worked very little. Another advantage is because it grows very little it will be super easy to size. It grows such a small amount that the brass will chamber in any SAAMI spec chamber even after being fired. The down side is that in most cases factory ammo you buy will not fit in the chamber. The problems that arise from headspace issues is when the headspace is too much, not too little. You can never have too little headspace so long as the round will chamber.

I am a huge fan and builder of Savages. There is no other rifle that you can swap a barrel out in 10 minutes and do so without any type of machining. Most smiths charge $300+ to do a barrel install on a Remington while on a Savage it generally is less than $50. I do all my own swaps now and have never had a problem even when using a piece of brass like above.

Dolomite