Ever wonder what it means.

[Guest jackdog]

Did you ever wonder what the Second Amendment really means. Think this kinda throws water on the living document theory.

http://www.firearmsandliberty.com/unabridged.2nd.html

[Guest Phantom6]

Outstanding article!

[Smith]

The problem is that the people who need to understand this are the very ones who wouldn't read it. For them, it is about "feeling" truth. Not actual truth. This makes it relative to their situation in time and space, not a universal truth existent without them.

[molonlabetn]

This one is a 'must read'.

[Guest CrazyLincoln]

Great article

The reason the ALCU doesn't support 2A is because they don't see individual ownership as a right.

To the anti side, this amendment just doesn't make sense, and so they ignore it.

Funny, I accept all the amendments. I think everyone has the right to vote, even though I wish some people wouldn't, but I would never want that right denied to them.

[analog_kidd]

Great article

The reason the ALCU doesn't support 2A is because they don't see individual ownership as a right.

To the anti side, this amendment just doesn't make sense, and so they ignore it.

Funny, I accept all the amendments. I think everyone has the right to vote, even though I wish some people wouldn't, but I would never want that right denied to them.

Interestingly, citizens do not have the right to vote for President and Vice President. Article 2, Section 1 says that the states will appoint Electors, the same number as the total of the state's Senators and Representatives. Then Ammendment 12 says those Electors choose the President and VP.

It's really left up to each indivual state to decide how they select Electors. It just so happens that all of the states use popular votes of the Citizens. If a state wanted to, it could appoint Electors any way they choose, such as allowing the Governor to appoint them, or holding a vote by people who's first name is Joe, or whatever hair-brained idea they could come up with.

Of course, the Citizens do elect other officials. If a state came up with a crazy method of selecting Electors, whoever came up with and approved the ide would be elected out.

However, the 17th Ammendment specifially says the People will elect Senators.

Now, think about this.. If I'm a lazy bum and would rather sit at home collecting welfare than go to work each day, who am I going to vote for? Obviously the person that will protect my government paycheck. I have not paid any taxes that fund welfare, every other hard working citizen has. Why should I get to have a vote in picking out the person who decides how that money is spent?

[K191145]

Great article.

I've always tried to put myself in the shoes, or the mindset of new Americans back in the days that the Constitution was written and try to imagine how they thought. Their opinions and writings seem to be pretty much straight forward and accepted as the norm among the vast majority of new independent Americans. To me, the 2nd. Amendment was intended to express a right that we already had and that's for a man to own and keep his rifle or pistol to defend himself, his family, and his neighbors from indian attacks, criminal hooligans, an attack from an invading army either from another country or some tyrannical unconstitutional army from his own government. As a capable man it was understood that it was a duty to organize with his neighbors as a militia if needed to protect his city, state, or country from any and all criminal or unconstitutional attacks. The idea of a capable man owning personal firearms was accepted not only as an individual right but a duty to his family and country. I believe they envisioned a possible scenario in the future where some in the government might twist and turn and pervert the meaning of their patriotic intentions and attitudes so they wrote the 2nd Amendment and the Bill Of Rights as clear and simple as they could, meaning that every American citizen has an individual right to keep and bear his own personal arms, and also has a right and duty to organize in a militia if needed to protect his family, neighbors, and country.

And I believe it's as simple as that.

[sigmtnman]

I think the 10th Amendment answers the question:

The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the states, are reserved to the states respectively, or to the people.

Unfortunately, the government has already shown that the Constitution and the Bill of Rights mean nothing.

[LagerHead]

Did you ever wonder what the Second Amendment really means. Think this kinda throws water on the living document theory.

The Unabridged Second Amendment

Thanks for the link Jack. Copperud states much better than most of us can that which we already knew to be true. I will definitely add that page to my favorites and invite the anti-gun crowd to refute his interpretation.

[Guest mbushell]

Actually brought tears to my eyes... We do need to stop begging for our rights, and just keep and defend them with our lives!

[Guest lrodgers]

The problem is that the people who need to understand this are the very ones who wouldn't read it. For them, it is about "feeling" truth. Not actual truth. This makes it relative to their situation in time and space, not a universal truth existent without them.

[Guest lrodgers]

The problem is that the people who need to understand this are the very ones who wouldn't read it. For them, it is about "feeling" truth. Not actual truth. This makes it relative to their situation in time and space, not a universal truth existent without them.

Spot on!

[hkgonra]

The idea is that every citizen be armed as the average soldier, no matter if that means a stone spear or a phaser.

[Guest bkelm18]

Wow this thread just seems to keep gettin dug up.

[diamondback]

Good read

[RED333]

So I went to the section to start a new thread and found this thread, hit on about every year or so(2 years this time). How did I miss this thread, no answer. However it is a great subject, near and dear to all our hearts.

I believe the 2nd was written in such a way as to apply today as it did 230 or so years ago. The Brits came for cannon, powder and shot(lead, stone, and iron cannon ammo) The Brits also came for the ships and their arms, cannon, powder, and shot. As the 2nd applied then it applies now, pistol, rifle, cannon, ship, plane, missile, rocket, bomb, up to and including atomic. No I am not a nut job, I just believe we will need all these to defend our selves one day from evil!!!

All that said, we need to stay in the fight every day to protect our God rights, Vote every chance you get.

[DaveTN]

 The English expert didn’t address the training clause of the 2nd amendment and how that applies today. Surely its okay to tout “Shall not be infringed” but acknowledge a government mandated training requirement can be assumed?

[RED333]

8 minutes ago, DaveTN said:

 The English expert didn’t address the training clause of the 2nd amendment and how that applies today. Surely its okay to tout “Shall not be infringed” but acknowledge a government mandated training requirement can be assumed?

Schulman:] "(5) Which of the following does the phrase 'well-regulated militia' mean: 'well-equipped', 'well-organized,' 'well-drilled,' 'well-educated,' or 'subject to regulations of a superior authority'?"

[Copperud:] "(5) The phrase means 'subject to regulations of a superior authority;' this accords with the desire of the writers for civilian control over the military."