Other state laws for signage posting

[Guest GlockenVol]

How does Tennessee's signage law compare to the surrounding states? Do they have fines for posted areas? I assume we are more restrictive than the surrounding states. If so, what about a campaign to put Tennessee on an equal level with it's neighbors - no more, no less? We only want the rights equal to a person in Alabama or Georgia, etc. Could it work?

[Oh Shoot]

Hardly any other states have specific penalty for "carrying past a sign" as does TN.

Most are legally non-binding, but simply come down to "leave if asked or face trespassing" type situation.

I think Texas may have specific penalty for violation of the "51% booze" ban, maybe couple more like that, but TN is almost alone in having this specific penalty -- a penalty that ONLY applies to otherwise legal carrying citizens and not to someone carrying without a permit, I might add.

- OS

[Guest GlockenVol]

How then can we petition the legislatures to grant us the same rights as citizens of the surrounding states? If a person can walk in to Regions in Alabama without having to look fo a sign and fear being arrested, why shouldn't I have those same rights as Tennessee licensed HCP holders?The bottom line is, what will it take to repeal the signage statute which ONLY applies to HCP holders? How can we at Tenn Gun Owners help make that happen?

[Guest Agave]

How then can we petition the legislatures to grant us the same rights as citizens of the surrounding states? If a person can walk in to Regions in Alabama without having to look fo a sign and fear being arrested, why shouldn't I have those same rights as Tennessee licensed HCP holders?The bottom line is, what will it take to repeal the signage statute which ONLY applies to HCP holders? How can we at Tenn Gun Owners help make that happen?

Those signs are not about gun carriers' rights. It is about the protection of property owners' rights.

[Guest GlockenVol]

Are property owners 200 miles north or south of Nashville, less protected? Are their rights being trampled? I don't think so, and I suspect the those property owners don't go into work fretting about how their rights are being violated day in and day out. This law is not about property owners rights. It is about control over those who have carry a fire arm sanctioned by the State of Tennessee. It is a law to control those they fear.

[Guest Agave]

Are property owners 200 miles north or south of Nashville, less protected?

Nashville is that capital of Tennessee. What happens in Nashville is not really relevant to what happens in Kentucky or in Alabama.

[strickj]

Those signs are not about gun carriers' rights. It is about the protection of property owners' rights.

Um, no.

Property owners could still post like every other state. Simply removing the criminal punishment of just walking past the signs does not affect anyone.

[Guest Agave]

Um, no.

Property owners could still post like every other state. Simply removing the criminal punishment of just walking past the signs does not affect anyone.

Not every state allows property owners to have signs that carry the weight of law.

[Oh Shoot]

Not every state allows property owners to have signs that carry the weight of law.

That's the point of the discussion.

TN pretty much stands alone in this.

- OS

[strickj]

Not every state allows property owners to have signs that carry the weight of law.

Yes, As PhShoot said, that's what we're talking about here.

Simply removing the criminal element of walking past the signs is not affecting anyone. At all.

Being arrested for simply walking past these signs would be like getting arrested for walking past a "no shoes, no service" sign.

[DaveTN]

How then can we petition the legislatures to grant us the same rights as citizens of the surrounding states? If a person can walk in to Regions in Alabama without having to look fo a sign and fear being arrested, why shouldn't I have those same rights as Tennessee licensed HCP holders?The bottom line is, what will it take to repeal the signage statute which ONLY applies to HCP holders? How can we at Tenn Gun Owners help make that happen?

I would like to see Tennessee acknowledge that bearing arms is a right. Until that happens they can’t force a private business owner to acknowledge something they don’t acknowledge. It is a crime for a citizen to carry a loaded firearm in the state of Tennessee. Any discussion that doesn’t include all citizens isn’t a right.

[vontar]

I think some other states are starting to give No gun signs force of Law but I do not know what the penalty is. I read on handgunlaws that in OH no gun signs have Force of Law but I did not see the penalty. Maybe it is just they will ask you to leave or you will face trespassing charges I don't know. I just don't like those sign but then again if they don't want me, then I will do my business some place else if at all possible.

I found that in OH checking for a pending trip this summer.

[Guest Ken45]

Ohio has three levels:

1) statutory CPZs (any government building except rest areas, parking lots, etc.). Must be posted and is a felony if you violate the law.

2) private property (stores, etc.) can be posted. Misdemeanor if you knowingly violate. They probably have to prove that you knew it was posted.

3) places that serve liquor: do not have to be posted and violation is a felony. No "knowingly" required. We are currently trying to get "restaurant carry" approved.

[Guest GlockenVol]

How can we get the legislature to acknowledge this basic (& 2A) right? It seems we have many favorable ears in Nashville at this time. Can we not all rally behind a bill to make the right to carry into a state statue or law (???? I am not a lawyer) ? I really want this law that makes me a criminal to go away. If I walk into this building I break the law, but I'm a fine citizen when I walk into another building. If I'm not a threat in Building A, then I'm not a threat in Building B. If I'm not a threat to society, why should I have my 2A right, and basic human right of protection, curtailed by anyone.

[Oh Shoot]

...If I'm not a threat to society, why should I have my 2A right, and basic human right of protection, curtailed by anyone.

Why need a carry permit at all? Why can't have an automatic weapon or a shotgun with 12" barrel? Why can't carry in any federal facility in entire US? Etc.

I think you must be the first person to ever think of these things.

- OS

[Guest GlockenVol]

No. I know I'm not the first to think this way or try to express their frustration. But I hate these signs and I know most of you do too. We've been finger-printed, background checked, paid a nice chunk of change and deemed safe by the state of Tennessee to walk around with a handgun. Good. I'm all for what we've got so far. Yet the anti's got a law in place that makes us a criminal to walk into one shop that's identical to the shop down the street. That's wrong! I'm not pontificating to make you think I'm some wise sage. I'm asking for us to get a plan and fight this law. I'm not sharp enough to know how to do it, but someone here is. Let's get a plan to eliminate the law and together, push it. Surely there is a legal-mind sharp enough to create a bill that all of us throughout the state can petition our legislators to put into law.

[Oh Shoot]

...Surely there is a legal-mind sharp enough to create a bill that all of us throughout the state can petition our legislators to put into law.

Step one is probably to support the TFA.

- OS

[Guest GlockenVol]

I thought this was a good idea; so, I've gone back to the TFA site and forum several times in the past week or so. I know this will make someone mad (not my intent), but it looks like a site which is on the decline. It had lots of activity in 09 & 10; not much going on now. I looked for some sort of effort about eliminating the penalty for signage, but didn't see much concern. In fact there does not seem much interest about anything so far this year. I don't have $35 to throw away. TFA just didn't strike me as worth my while or my money, especially regarding my main issue of concern - the signage law. I'm sure I'll get flamed for this (if anyone is still looking at this thread), but that is how it appeared to me. To be quite frank, I'm disappointed that so little concern shows up both here and there for this very unfair and frustrating problem.

[Oh Shoot]

...To be quite frank, I'm disappointed that so little concern shows up both here and there for this very unfair and frustrating problem.

TFA 'bout as active a gun org. TN has, I'm afraid. A lobby of one guy, basically. The regional meetings are regular, however, so there's some interest and impetus generated there. It's hard to know to just what extent TGO has influenced legislators -- there are beau coup emails and phonecalls from various members herein, though.

But yeah, apathy became a significant part of the American ethos long ago, I agree.

- OS

[Guest 270win]

Most states do not have a specific sign that carries any sort of fine. In most states, all that you risk is trespassing for not leaving when asked by a property owner. That to me is enough law. Too many laws are the problem with this country.

[Guest GlockenVol]

So what can we do? Curse the darkness? Light a bon-fire? I'm no leader; I don't know how to make it happen. I'm just frustated and looking for a plan to get behind (one that we can all get behind and support) and help make the change. Let's get rid of these stupid signs and eliminate the penalty for carrying the handgun Tennesse permited me to carry.

[Guest 270win]

The easiest thing is to eliminate the 500 dollar fine from the sign law. You can probably keep the sign law but cut or drastically reduce the penalty to something like 25 bucks CIVIL penalty for those who don't leave when asked. Change wording slightly so that the bed wetters feel there is still a law but there is a law with no teeth. I doubt you could politically on paper get rid of the law...but you can modify it so it doesn't on paper penalize people.

[DaveTN]

So what can we do? Curse the darkness? Light a bon-fire? I'm no leader; I don't know how to make it happen. I'm just frustated and looking for a plan to get behind (one that we can all get behind and support) and help make the change. Let's get rid of these stupid signs and eliminate the penalty for carrying the handgun Tennesse permited me to carry.

You can work on getting the state of Tennessee to acknowledge a constitutional right to bear arms. You do not have a right; you have a privilege that you bought from the state. It’s a crime in this state for citizens to carry a loaded gun and until that changes the state can’t force business owners to allow you to carry.

[Worriedman]

I thought this was a good idea; so, I've gone back to the TFA site and forum several times in the past week or so. I know this will make someone mad (not my intent), but it looks like a site which is on the decline. It had lots of activity in 09 & 10; not much going on now. I looked for some sort of effort about eliminating the penalty for signage, but didn't see much concern. In fact there does not seem much interest about anything so far this year. I don't have $35 to throw away. TFA just didn't strike me as worth my while or my money, especially regarding my main issue of concern - the signage law. I'm sure I'll get flamed for this (if anyone is still looking at this thread), but that is how it appeared to me. To be quite frank, I'm disappointed that so little concern shows up both here and there for this very unfair and frustrating problem.

The TFA site itself heats up when the Legislature is in session, and is dealing with issues related to firearms legislation. We don't really do news and commentary on other issues. We have found that other venues of approach for social media tend to be better at reaching people other than dyed in the wool gun folks.

OhShoot is right, the area Chapters are active, and we do a lot more local advocating than is evident on the site. We have a PAC that is growing by the year, and that is the ONLY way to effectively advocate for issues in Nashville, money talks, and everything else is simply noise. If you are in the Memphis area there is an active Chapter there. If a person wants to be involved, there is plenty of work to do. I regularly visit the Hill, and my association with the TFA has opened a lot of doors there, it gives me the opportunity to visit with folks there I would never have the chance to speak with otherwise.

You will get out of it what you put into it. It will cost you gas money and time away from family if you are really involved, there is no glamor involved or accolades to be gained from being a member. I agreed when I joined this site to not "mine" members here for that organization, but to simply let my labor speak for itself. TGO David is kind enough to let me post my meeting schedules here, and I am grateful for that and abide by his request.

[Worriedman]

This might me part of the problem, outside of the fact that normally, Tennessee firearms advocates rarely agree on even the most basic of questions, which makes it hard to present a united front on any issue.

CDC Study Ranks Tennessee As Laziest State - NewsChannel5.com | Nashville News, Weather & Sports