Illegal Dumping on My Property

[behindenemylines]

My 60 acre timber lot in middle south TN (Giles County) borders a 2 lane gravel road, with a steep drop-off to a seasonal creek bed on my and my neighbor's land. This ravine is being used as an illegal dump, with tires, furniture, appliances, including TVs and all types of garbage on the slope and creek bed.

County Executive/Highway Department/Sheriff's Department all pay lip service to my complaints, saying the garbage is beyond the right-of-way! Well no ****! Stuff dumped from the road shoulder rolls downhill and ends up on or near the creek bed. When heavy rains occur the **** is washed even further onto my land. The Highway Dept. put up to small black and white "no dumping" signs that are not visible amongst the trees. Sheriff's Dept. has sent county jail inmates to pick up loose litter on the immediate road shoulder, ignoring the rubbish on the steep slope and creek bed. Properly clearing the area would require a concerted effort employing ropes/rappelling gear and winches.

Before you ask, yes, a friend who takes care of the property for me (spends maybe 2 days a week on-site) and myself when I am home on vacation, have searched for leads in the garbage, so far without luck. I have also, at my own expense, purchased and posted large yellow high-visibility "NO DUMPING - THIS AREA IS UNDER VIDEO SURVEILLANCE" signs listing the local reporting telephone number. I have not yet installed video equipment for 2 reasons: cost and the fact that the cameras would trip whenever any vehicle passes by (perhaps 10 to 15 vehicles per hour during daylight hours). Also, the length of road section with the steep drop-off is approximately 700 feet and features somewhat extreme curves.

My neighbor is of course unhappy with the situation but is afraid that the scum responsible for dumping would burn him out if he managed to identify said individuals.

I should also point out that the county only has one legal dump, unlike other TN counties that have established satellite "Convenience Centers" that discourage illegal dumping.

What are my options? Would the TN Department of Environment & Conservation force the county to cleanup the area if I filed a complaint?

[enfield]

Fence it.

[TSprint1]

"Fence it."

Ultimately, that is exactly what we had to do. We were planning on fencing all of our property.....just had

to do it a little quicker than planned. It did work.

[Guest m&pc9]

What are my options? Would the TN Department of Environment & Conservation force the county to cleanup the area if I filed a complaint?

If the trash is on your property. I would be afraid they would force a clean up at your cost. I dont know for sure but I have had dealing with TDEC in the past , and they scare me.

[gregintenn]

Would the TN Department of Environment & Conservation force the county to cleanup the area if I filed a complaint?

No. They'd likely take you to court and sue you for contaminating state waters, forcing you to hire a professional company to clean it up. You do NOT want to deal with these nuts.

[Motasyco]

This reminds me of an Arlo Guthrie story that took place in Stockbridge Massachusetts. You need to look for an envelope at the bottom of that pile of trash.

[brooksjr]

Have someone camp out and catch them in the act and then scare the living out em. That won't help with clean up but should put a stop to future dumping.

[1gewehr]

Here you go:

Moultrie Game Spy D50 Digital Trail Game Camera Combo

A couple of those will soon identify your dumpers. And if they destroy your cameras, you will have criminal charges to file as well.

[vontar]

Shoot color videos by day, still photos with flash at night

Need one with out flash. The flash will only give away the camera and they will just steal it. I think they have some with infra Red or something. I know someone will correct me as I have never used one.

If I lived closer I would probably offer to help watch it just to be allowed to hunt on it

[Guest db99wj]

This reminds me of an Arlo Guthrie story that took place in Stockbridge Massachusetts. You need to look for an envelope at the bottom of that pile of trash.

Ahhhhhh Alice's restaurant!

[Guest tnxdshooter]

My 60 acre timber lot in middle south TN (Giles County) borders a 2 lane gravel road, with a steep drop-off to a seasonal creek bed on my and my neighbor's land. This ravine is being used as an illegal dump, with tires, furniture, appliances, including TVs and all types of garbage on the slope and creek bed.

County Executive/Highway Department/Sheriff's Department all pay lip service to my complaints, saying the garbage is beyond the right-of-way! Well no ****! Stuff dumped from the road shoulder rolls downhill and ends up on or near the creek bed. When heavy rains occur the **** is washed even further onto my land. The Highway Dept. put up to small black and white "no dumping" signs that are not visible amongst the trees. Sheriff's Dept. has sent county jail inmates to pick up loose litter on the immediate road shoulder, ignoring the rubbish on the steep slope and creek bed. Properly clearing the area would require a concerted effort employing ropes/rappelling gear and winches.

Before you ask, yes, a friend who takes care of the property for me (spends maybe 2 days a week on-site) and myself when I am home on vacation, have searched for leads in the garbage, so far without luck. I have also, at my own expense, purchased and posted large yellow high-visibility "NO DUMPING - THIS AREA IS UNDER VIDEO SURVEILLANCE" signs listing the local reporting telephone number. I have not yet installed video equipment for 2 reasons: cost and the fact that the cameras would trip whenever any vehicle passes by (perhaps 10 to 15 vehicles per hour during daylight hours). Also, the length of road section with the steep drop-off is approximately 700 feet and features somewhat extreme curves.

My neighbor is of course unhappy with the situation but is afraid that the scum responsible for dumping would burn him out if he managed to identify said individuals.

I should also point out that the county only has one legal dump, unlike other TN counties that have established satellite "Convenience Centers" that discourage illegal dumping.

What are my options? Would the TN Department of Environment & Conservation force the county to cleanup the area if I filed a complaint?

Fence it with electric and barbed wire. Problem solved. Also, get some game cameras and put them up. It can take still photos and you can check your email periodically and see if you have any leads.

[Lumber_Jack]

My company manages 150,000 acres on the Cumberland Plataue and Sequatchie valley. We have dealt with this very problem extensively. Just so you know we have put up between 30-50 cuddyback game cameras, per our clients directive, and have had all but 5 destroyed or stolen. Even with the infared camera the light still blinks to provide the night vision and only gives the location away. License plates are reflective so the only thing you get on infared picture is a glowing rectangle. If you truly want surelience I can get you in touch with some guys that will get you a system that works, but it will cost you between $2000-$4000.

On a separate note, digital photos are not quality evidence in court due to the ease of editing such photos. We have gotten serval pictures of vehicles dumping and only one time have we got the local authorities to push the issue. And in that case the were made to come pick up only the trash they dumped.

I know your neighbor is scared of being "burned out". I cannot count how many times I have heard that exact statement. I think most of the time it is just idle bullying that goes on all the time in these rural counties. If it were me I would not hesitate for a second to prosecute anyone I caught dumping. We (me and my coworkers) have been threatened numerous times, but when you actually geqt them in front of a judge the story changes quickly. The trouble is getting the evidence, and cooperation to prosecute.

What has worked best for us is placing large boulders along road right-of-ways to prevent them from backing the pickup trucks up to the edge. Depending on the length it can take more than one dump truck load, and a track hoe to unload them, so easily running in the $1000 range for rock and labor.

Local presence and vigilance is really the best option for catchin, prosecuting, and ultimately stoping this. Its a very tough task especially for landowners who live off site.

As for clean-up ,after multiple years of trying to get counties to help, we have resorted to doing it ourselves. I agree with others though I would not alert TDEC to anything as you can be held responsible. Best of luck

[Motasyco]

Ahhhhhh Alice's restaurant!

I wondered if anyone would get that. And that was from before your time.

[Guest tnxdshooter]

Call the epa maybe?

[Will Carry]

Get one of them game cameras set up and take a picture of the perp. Give the picture to the local DA and have him arrested. I had a similar problem and hid a game camera. Some of the local kids were cutting my fence. It worked like a charm. I showed the film to the boys parents. It worked out well.

Primos Truth Cam 46 Infrared Digital Game Camera 5.0 Megapixel Matrix Camo - MidwayUSA

[Lumber_Jack]

Get one of them game cameras set up and take a picture of the perp. Give the picture to the local DA and have him arrested. I had a similar problem and hid a game camera. Some of the local kids were cutting my fence. It worked like a charm. I showed the film to the boys parents. It worked out well.

Primos Truth Cam 46 Infrared Digital Game Camera 5.0 Megapixel Matrix Camo - MidwayUSA

Chances are it's multiple people, if you do chose to try a game camera, make sure it's positioned to get the license plate, sometimes faces are real unidentifiable. And don't spend too much, because eventually it will be gone!

[VERO1]

Spend a weeks vacation in a deer blind and shoot at every SOB that stops to dump! Yeah, I know, it's illeagle, but damn it would make you feel good!

[behindenemylines]

Spend a weeks vacation in a deer blind and shoot at every SOB that stops to dump! Yeah, I know, it's illeagle, but damn it would make you feel good!

I am considering this, although I would shoot first with the camera, and if I am shot at respond in kind with an AR.

[behindenemylines]

My company manages 150,000 acres on the Cumberland Plataue and Sequatchie valley. We have dealt with this very problem extensively. Just so you know we have put up between 30-50 cuddyback game cameras, per our clients directive, and have had all but 5 destroyed or stolen. Even with the infared camera the light still blinks to provide the night vision and only gives the location away. License plates are reflective so the only thing you get on infared picture is a glowing rectangle. If you truly want surelience I can get you in touch with some guys that will get you a system that works, but it will cost you between $2000-$4000.

On a separate note, digital photos are not quality evidence in court due to the ease of editing such photos. We have gotten serval pictures of vehicles dumping and only one time have we got the local authorities to push the issue. And in that case the were made to come pick up only the trash they dumped.

I know your neighbor is scared of being "burned out". I cannot count how many times I have heard that exact statement. I think most of the time it is just idle bullying that goes on all the time in these rural counties. If it were me I would not hesitate for a second to prosecute anyone I caught dumping. We (me and my coworkers) have been threatened numerous times, but when you actually geqt them in front of a judge the story changes quickly. The trouble is getting the evidence, and cooperation to prosecute.

What has worked best for us is placing large boulders along road right-of-ways to prevent them from backing the pickup trucks up to the edge. Depending on the length it can take more than one dump truck load, and a track hoe to unload them, so easily running in the $1000 range for rock and labor.

Local presence and vigilance is really the best option for catchin, prosecuting, and ultimately stoping this. Its a very tough task especially for landowners who live off site.

As for clean-up ,after multiple years of trying to get counties to help, we have resorted to doing it ourselves. I agree with others though I would not alert TDEC to anything as you can be held responsible. Best of luck

Thanks for the insight and advice Lumber Jack.

What do you think of this time-lapse video setup? Day 6 Outdoors PlotWatcher Camera - The Plot Watcher

Can only be used during daylight hours.

[gregintenn]

Call the epa maybe?

[Guest WyattEarp]

My company manages 150,000 acres on the Cumberland Plataue and Sequatchie valley. We have dealt with this very problem extensively. Just so you know we have put up between 30-50 cuddyback game cameras, per our clients directive, and have had all but 5 destroyed or stolen. Even with the infared camera the light still blinks to provide the night vision and only gives the location away.

ummmmm put black electrical tape over the blinking lights??? then they won't blink and give away the camera's position.

[Lumber_Jack]

Thanks for the insight and advice Lumber Jack.

What do you think of this time-lapse video setup? Day 6 Outdoors PlotWatcher Camera - The Plot Watcher

Can only be used during daylight hours.

I like this option much better than traditional game camera. First off it's small and easy to hide, secondly it has no flash or in fared glow to give away it's location. Chances are the dumping is going on durning daylight hours anyway. Most rural dumpers don't feel like they are doing anything wrong. We have used these smaller cameras to some success, but we have also lot several to theft. Its just a game of chance, whether or not they see it.

Some tips for mounting the camera.

Mount it up high, out of natural line of sight. This can be a challenge to mount and still have a good angle to capture a license plate. You may have to engineer a way to insert a wedge behind the camera to help it point somewhat downward. plus if it is spotted it takes much more effort to steal or shoot. I would go mid morning to mount, depending on traffic patterns of the road, ie people going to work, seems 9-10am seems to be good times. A lot of the people who are dumping most likely are on government checks of some sort and will probably be roaming around if the weather isn't bad.

[Jonnin]

I like the idea of camping out; that is your best bet, with a long range camera/zoom so you can get the faces, liscense plates, etc and take it to the cops. The sign said its under video, so, that makes your film usable as evidence I think (but am not a lawyer). The rule is usually that if the person did not know they were being recorded, it becomes an issue, but the sign covers that hopefully. Better: you are an eyewittness, which even if the footage is blocked, you cannot be kept from testifying.

You can also set up remote video, where the camera transmit the images immediately to a nearby computer. Flash, no flash, doenst matter, you have the footage. If you put a fish eye lens on, you can see nearly 180 degree arc and on a decent resolution camera, that will get you nearly everything if you put up 2 or 3. You may WANT them to take the cameras or destroy them, thats another thing to arrest them for (theft or destruction of property). If the camera is pricy, you can move the charges up from petty theft, at some point, I forget the exact dollar amounts. Its totally a setup to burn the guys doing it, but spending more could make the charges stick, and get you better data, etc.

Just random thoughts, not advice, but you might look into this sort of approach.

[Lumber_Jack]

ummmmm put black electrical tape over the blinking lights??? then they won't blink and give away the camera's position.

I know it seems so simple and straight forward when thinking and talking about catching people, reality is a whole different story. Yea you can tape over the light, but you Have to be careful, some cameras have an exposure lens in the light area, which causes the daylight pictures to be overexposed. Plus black tape just makes it stand out, if anything use camo tape. I prefer cameras without the light at all.

[Lumber_Jack]

I like the idea of camping out; that is your best bet, with a long range camera/zoom so you can get the faces, liscense plates, etc and take it to the cops. The sign said its under video, so, that makes your film usable as evidence I think (but am not a lawyer). The rule is usually that if the person did not know they were being recorded, it becomes an issue, but the sign covers that hopefully. Better: you are an eyewittness, which even if the footage is blocked, you cannot be kept from testifying.

You can also set up remote video, where the camera transmit the images immediately to a nearby computer. Flash, no flash, doenst matter, you have the footage. If you put a fish eye lens on, you can see nearly 180 degree arc and on a decent resolution camera, that will get you nearly everything if you put up 2 or 3. You may WANT them to take the cameras or destroy them, thats another thing to arrest them for (theft or destruction of property). If the camera is pricy, you can move the charges up from petty theft, at some point, I forget the exact dollar amounts. Its totally a setup to burn the guys doing it, but spending more could make the charges stick, and get you better data, etc.

Just random thoughts, not advice, but you might look into this sort of approach.

Your only problem with video is power supply. Most home security cameras are built for outdoor use but are designed to be direct wired. Plus you have to have a very large hard drive to store continuous recorded video. With video your best option is time lapse, but again you have to store the hard drive, DVR, or VCR in a water tight box. Power with this option is best with a deep cycle marine battery. It works great, but is expensive to setup properly and is a pain to hide the recorder and battery. Plus recovering and reviewing data is time costuming.

I personally would start with the small time lapse game camera posted above, give it a try and go from there.

You also have to remember its not one single offender, it's many. Prosecuting one is not going to solve the problem, this is going to be an uphill battle for a while. There is a mindset and culture of dumping here that has to be changed before you can see real results