I'm going to by an Eotech 512. Somebody stop me.

[Guest Jack Brickhouse]

I'm partial to HWS. I currently have an NC Star and I don't like it. I have researched my choices until my fingers have bleed. I see a lot of cheaper HWS but I'm afraid to go down that road again. Before I spend $415.00. Can someone advise me to better/cheaper option based on personal experience. Thanks

Edited February 26, 2011 by Jack Brickhouse

[sigrug17]

I have a 512...reliable, reliable, reliable ... runs on AA, great sight picture, and both eyes open to shoot. Their going for great prices these days... make sure you do your best research on the web and you won't regret it.

things to note: the Eotech 512 does carry some weight to it. So, if you looking for something lighter... Go Aimpoint. (T1, H1, etc.) OR... Eotech EXPS?

Edited February 26, 2011 by sigrug17

[Dolomite_supafly]

Eotech makes a decent sight sinking as the thing will zero, then after that hold the zero, then after that if the thing doesn't die for no reason, then about time you get all that sorted out the batteries are going to die.

Seriously I have seem more Eotech's die or have issues than any other higher end optic. Their batteries last 3 months if you never turn them on and a lot less if you actually use it. I used one 8 hours a day in NV mode only and the batteries lasted 3 weeks. There is an issue with some have "J" shaped dots in NV mode. Not an issue for most but it does say something about quality control especially when Eotech refuses to acknowledge it.

It is a nice concept that does work well for engaging targets when they work. And in NV mode they are better than anything I have used. But in the end I don't care how well I works if there is a chance it may not, especially when you need it the most.

Bring it on Eotech fanboys!

Dolomite

[mikegideon]

Put extra batteries in your grip. I love my 512 so far.

[Guest Lester Weevils]

tic. Their batteries last 3 months if you never turn them on and a lot less if you actually use it. I used one 8 hours a day in NV mode only and the batteries lasted 3 weeks.

Dolomite

Thanks Dolomite, had been wondering about that but hadn't got around to calling EOTech and asking about it.

I have two of the compact 511.N65 which use two N batteries. I like everything about them except they do seem to drain batteries in the off condition. I was guessing maybe it uses a slight battery drain to remember the last brightness setting when turned off, and maybe the drain is more than merely "slight" but maybe it is something else. Didn't know if mine were defectively draining the batteries and needed warranty work.

Mine seem to take six months to a year to drain the N cells, so just got in the habit of removing the batteries when the rifles take long naps in the safe. If the drain is expected with that model, then its no huge problem for a recreational sight.

Was also wondering if recoil can mess up some brands of N cells, but that doesn't seem real likely. Dunno.

[Dolomite_supafly]

Another problem we had is when the batteries are oriented north/south in relation to the firearm recoil can cause the batteris to loose contact. Doesn't happen on every gun but it happened enough to be bothersome. Aimpoints would sometimes do this also but not as much as Eotech's.

Don't get me wrong, I like the reticle but with all the other stuff I have personally witnessed I don't think I could trust one on anything other than a range gun. In their defense we were pretty hard on them but no more than most three gun matches.

Dolomite

[mikegideon]

If it drains the batteries when it's off, then it's a design flaw that can (and should) be fixed. No reason to use battery power for memory these days. Like I said, I store fresh batteries in my grip. I don't think they will ever get close to the life of an Aimpoint with their standard circle dot reticle, but they probably do need to work on their life. It's just too easy to do.

[mikegideon]

Another problem we had is when the batteries are oriented north/south in relation to the firearm recoil can cause the batteris to loose contact. Doesn't happen on every gun but it happened enough to be bothersome. Aimpoints would sometimes do this also but not as much as Eotech's.

Don't get me wrong, I like the reticle but with all the other stuff I have personally witnessed I don't think I could trust one on anything other than a range gun. In their defense we were pretty hard on them but no more than most three gun matches.

Dolomite

Seems like the military would be raising nine kinds of hell about it. I was involved in fixing an issue for the SOCOM guys. It was a product that worked for several of the other combat groups, but had to be cleaned up for them. It wasn't a reliabilty thing. Their field testing kicked it back, we fixed it, and then life was good. Point is, they weren't in the mood to just live with the problem.

[Caster]

IT's the way to go!!! Mine takes AA's, I love it. If you're going to spend that kind of dough, go ahead and buy two or three sets of HIGH quality rechargeables.

[mikegideon]

IT's the way to go!!! Mine takes AA's, I love it. If you're going to spend that kind of dough, go ahead and buy two or three sets of HIGH quality rechargeables.

...or one of those 24 packs at Walmart. I like AA's because you can get them anywhere.

[Caster]

I like my rechargeables because I use them for man other things as well, but yes the 24 pack will go a long way so long as you don't forget to turn it off. Done that a few times!

One thing I do like to do is buy a pack of Energizer lithium ion AA's to store in the battery compartment of my magpul stock. I rotate those every year. Should a crisis of some sort arise I like knowing those are in there.

[Dolomite_supafly]

All optics have their drawbacks or flaws. It is just a matter of selecting one that has least amount for the job you have planned for it. Aimpoints have an issue with moisture as well as the wiring working loose over time.

For me my biggest pet peeve is having an optic you have to change he brightness on anytime you are changing environments like building clearing. I won't be clearing any buldings anymore thanks to a helicopter accident I was in but it still is a concern of mine. I use only red dot that auto adjust to ambient light. The Burris Fastfire is good. The other, which has travelled overseas with me, is the Millett Zoom Dot. It too has drawbacks. It doesn't work with NV but with a colored flashlight filter it is manageable. But other than that it has been 100% reliable for thousands of rounds.

Dolomite

[mikegideon]

I like my rechargeables because I use them for man other things as well, but yes the 24 pack will go a long way so long as you don't forget to turn it off. Done that a few times!

One thing I do like to do is buy a pack of Energizer lithium ion AA's to store in the battery compartment of my magpul stock. I rotate those every year. Should a crisis of some sort arise I like knowing those are in there.

You can't forget to turn the Eotech off. It has 4 and 8 hour modes before it turns itself off.

[R1100R]

I have a 516 that uses 123's. I have yet to replace them over 2-3 years. I like it because it uses the batteries my flash lights use,

Plus the buttons are on the side for when I use a magnifier.

[Guest Lester Weevils]

When I got the 511.A65 sights I was interested in the small size and relatively low price (as EOTECH goes). Walmart sells N cells pretty cheap though some folks find N batts rare and expensive.

When I bought the 511's I had a bad attitude about CR123 batts but since then have taken a liking to CR123 and would probably buy any future new EOTECH sight that uses CR123 batts. Assuming I could afford it. Some of the models cost more than the gun you want to put it on.

Did some web-searching on the battery issues today. I'm reporting hearsay, but the web talk seems to be that the AA models which had trouble were primarily because of battery holders with too-loose springs, which would let the batteries rattle around too much under recoil. Supposedly there were upgrade fixes and field-installable upgrades.

Most AA EOTECHS civilian owners seem to report outstanding battery life.

The 511 revision F (which my sights are) have a near-universal reputation for bad battery life and draining batteries when the sight is turned off. It is funny because one of the marketing bullets about the rev F was better battery life. Perhaps they improved the "on-time" battery life while also introduced a bug which excessively drains the batts when the unit is off. Fix one bug and add another. Its easy to do.

Will try to call EOTECH and see if they have a hardware fix.

Here is a quote from one fellow who claimed to have called EOTECH about his 511. This sounds authoritative and reasonable, but can't vouch for its veracity--

"There is a flaw in the revision F "N" version battery sights in which there is a capacitor that slowly discharges the battery even withe the unit off. I have 2 "N" battery eotech's and both will kill the battery in under a week in the off position. I tried all makes of batteries and all the same. I called Eotech and they said after I shut if off, remove the batteries for about 5 mins then replace without turning on the sight for storage. [snip] Last I talked to Eotech, about a year ago, they were working on a fix for it."

Anyway, it looks like maybe I just got unlucky and bought the wrong model.

[mikegideon]

I did some reading too. They all drain some battery power when they're turned off. I wasn't aware of that. In one thread, a guy metioned that the eotech guy called it sleep mode, not off mode. good thing i have onboard storage.

[Guest nosnos]

Onboard battery storage is good, I agree.

I have an XPS, which takes one 123 battery, and it's oriented perpendicular to the recoil, so no problems with intermittent contact. Almost a year, and haven't replaced the battery. An aimpoint would be nice, though. Just knowing the battery lasts almost forever....

--------

[Guest Lester Weevils]

I did some reading too. They all drain some battery power when they're turned off. I wasn't aware of that. In one thread, a guy metioned that the eotech guy called it sleep mode, not off mode. good thing i have onboard storage.

Thanks Mike. Googling "eotech sleep mode" returned several threads I didn't earlier find.

There are such wildly different reports of "turned-off battery lifetime" that the reports would be consistent with large unit-to-unit variation in quiescent current draw?

There are so many ways the circuit could be designed that it is frivolous to speculate about the innards. Anything from a 555 timer up to a PIC chip and anything in-between.

Given that it has auto-power-off, some kind of FET switch might make sense? FET switches typically have low leakage. Something inside has to stay "awake" to electronically toggle the main power when a momentary button is pressed.

A CMOS switch de-bouncer could run on incredibly tiny current, but such high-impedance circuits can be difficult to shield from electromagnetic interference. Maybe you would want a lower impedance switch de-bouncer to make it less sensitive to interference?

The one web comment about leaky capacitor-- Wonder if there is a tantalum cap in there to save space? Some tantalums leak like a sieve.

Heck, I've seen circuits that leaked like a sieve across bare PC board, because water-soluble flux had not been thoroughly cleaned after fabrication.

Ain't curious enough to open the gadget up to find out. If you happen to find a schematic, I'd be curious to see it.

List of battery sizes - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

This link shows the relative capacity of a pair of N's compared to a 123 not drastically different. RCR123A (protected) 750 mAh, CR123 Lithium 1500 mAh, N alkaline in the middle around 800-1000 mAh. Though the N would likely suffer in cold weather.

The battery cap could theoretically be hacked on the back-end to add a toggle kill switch. My 511 battery caps are cramped enough that it would not be a pleasant or easy task.

Somebody with a lot of time on their hands could just design a new battery cap that would fit an Eotech. If one made a replacement battery cap for the AA or N models that instead holds one RCR123A, then there would be lots of space freed up for a kill switch.

[mikegideon]

There's no reason for the circuitry to draw any current when it's off if it's designed properly, unless they have to keep a little juice flowing to make it come on at low temps. it would be interesting to see the circuits. If they're calling it a sleep mode, there's not a leaky cap problem. Tantalums are pretty good if they're not reverse biased.

Anyway, I like the sight picture and reticle, so I'm stuck with the Eotech and my trusty MOE grip. I don't care that the Aimpont has great battery life, because I woudn't be happy with the sight.

[Guest Lester Weevils]

Yep, I like the EOTECH better than any sight picture I've tried.

An auto-off feature seems a bad trade-off for running down the batteries when turned off.

I've had red dots run occasional use for many years on a button battery. You just have to remember to turn off the primitive mechanical switch after use or it goes dead.

But EOTECH's implementation of auto-off seems slim advantage, if you have to remember to remove the batteries after every use. It is more trouble to routinely remove the batteries than it is to routinely turn off a mechanical switch.

Edited February 27, 2011 by Lester Weevils

[mikegideon]

I have a few other things that drain batteries ove time. No big deal. My AR gets pretty regular attention from me. The eotech will at least let you know when the batteries are low.

[Guest Lester Weevils]

Yes the 511's seem on the extreme end of the distribution. If batteries would store for up to a year in mine without going dead (which seems typical for many of the other models), I wouldn't bother to remove them after every use.

I have little grundig portable shortwave radios that stay on idle to run the clock and they have soft-on and auto-off and alarm-turn-on, and those suckers take a long time to kill a set of batteries, even routinely listening to the radio.

Edited February 27, 2011 by Lester Weevils

[mikegideon]

I'm a real stickler for buying stuff that runs on AA and AAA batteries. Doesn't bother me so much when they run down, because you can buy them everywhere.

[sigrug17]

Never had any problems with battery drain on the 512 when not in use. (6+ months) still going strong... I try to get out to use it about 3-4 times a month.