Need some thoughts, blew up my 4wd

[Guest coldblackwind]

Ok, so being as we had a ton of snow on the road this morning, I opted out of my 2wd s10, and went with my '93 4wd F150. Worked great, had no problems until almost to town. I started to get a hum out of the front end, sounded like the right side, but I couldn't tell for sure. Kicked it out of 4wd, and still had it (automatic hubs, transfer case kicked out, but I won't swear the hubs did, never had an issue with them before on this truck), so kicked it back in when it got slick again and it didn't really change. Got to work fine, but when I went to lunch, I only made it a little ways from work, and the front tire on the truck literally locked up tight. Won't turn at all. I managed to get into a parking lot, and miraculously it started to work fine! 2wd, 4wd, did just fine, drove around a bit, it did fine, pulled back out on the street, locked right back up (in 4wd again). Pulled into another parking lot, as it unlocked almost immediately, got a little ways in, and the truck STOPPED. I don't mean slowly came to rest, I mean engine nearly stalling, jerked forward (even though I was hardly moving), immediate, no bs stop. Kicked it back out of 4wd, and rear tires would spin fine, ended up hammering it and spinning my way into a parking space. Tried 2wd, 4wd, forward, reverse, doesn't matter. Locked right up solid. Any ideas? My though is that the hub seized somehow, but I have no idea, I can't say as I've seen that happen. In my experience you usually lose 4wd, not lock up the tire. I was not on the brakes any time that this happened, but it was ditch diving, and they were touchy on the way in, so I haven't ruled them out entirely. Anyone run across this may know where to start?

[Guest tnfireman]

I'd start working your way in. check the brakes and then on into the hubs, probably not something you want to try in a parking lot in single digit weather.

[dats82]

Sounds like you might be looking at a differential problem. The autohubs will only work properly if the four wheel drive is working properly as most of them act like a big screw when turn by the axle shaft. If the hub is locked, the wheel will still spin on the spindle, therefore, I think the problem is more central that anything in the hub. Have you checked the fluid in the front diff recently?

[Guest coldblackwind]

I just rebuilt the motor, put a new transmission in it, and the trasfer case that was in it went on the first test drive, so I put one out of my buddies truck in it, that was all about 300 miles ago, and the fluid was checked at the same time. If its the front diff, think I could limp it 25 miles in 2wd if I pulled the front driveshaft, or would it stay locked up I wonder... If I can get it to just limp home it'd make my life easier. I have a car trailer, but the truck has 32 11.50's on it, and it doesn't fit between the wheel wells on the trailer, so I'm not sure how I'm gonna get it home to do anything with it if I can't get it to drive. I haven't ruled the brakes out either, it just doesn't make sense that they would lock up without me hitting the pedal. Now go on, and not come off sure, but go from off to locked on their own? That doesn't make sense, but who knows. Unfortunately, its a mile from work in the snow, and I'm rideless at the moment, so I can't even tinker with it, despite the fact I have nothing to do...

Edited January 10, 2011 by coldblackwind

[Sidinman]

Could be a brake line. I had this happen on my truck a couple years ago. Put a rubber brake line on and that was it. I had never heard of it before but that was the problem. So maybe you will be that lucky.

[Guest coldblackwind]

Could be a brake line. I had this happen on my truck a couple years ago. Put a rubber brake line on and that was it. I had never heard of it before but that was the problem. So maybe you will be that lucky.

That would be awesome, but I'm rarely that lucky. I'll definitely look at that though.

[dats82]

If it is indeed the differential, you would have to either take the hub off, or take the axle shaft out, I think. I am not familar with the exact set-up on that truck, but I think it is the one with the independant straight axle kinda mess in the front of it. If that is the case, my plan of attack would be to try to raise the wheel that is locked up, take all the torque off of it, and remove the hub. Takeing the hub off will be easier than taking an axle shaft out, and this will at least get your two wheel drive back if indeed it is the diff. If the truck it in two wheel drive now, you do not gain anything by taking the drive shaft out.

[Guest coldblackwind]

That's my first goal, get it to where I can drive it home to fix it properly. I'm kind of ticked at it at this point. Anyone wanna buy an F150 with a new 351, new heavy duty transmission, and about 2 grand worth of other new stuff?

[Tncobra]

Sounds like a bad hub lock. The humming in 2wd is the differential ratcheting from one axle turning. Raise the front and spin the wheels to see which is not releasing. The axle should not move, turn the wheel backwards to simulate engaging.

They go bad all the time. Not that hard to fix yourself.

[56FordGuy]

I'd look at the locking hubs or wheel bearings.

Serious about selling? PM me.

[DRM]

Ford's auto locking hubs suck, plain and simple. They suck even worse when you don't use them much (I bet you don't use 4wd much, do you?). You can try pulling the one locking up, cleaning, re-lubing, and reinstalling - assuming it is just froze up, and nothing internally is broken. Or - a pair of Warn (no need for the Premiums - get the standards) should run you about $100, tops -and are pretty easy to install (but you do lose the auto-locking function, meaning you will have to lock them in or out manually every time you want four wheel drive). I think on those you will also need a new set of spindle nuts since the auto locking hubs use a different one - but I haven't replaced any in years so my info may be fuzzy there.

I'd say bearings are a possibility - but the fact that you got it to un-freeze has me leaning against that. If it's still froze up, you can try reverse to get it unfrozen to at least get you somewhere you can pull that hub off to free it up and get you home.

But I say it again - use 4wd more often and it reduces the chances of this happening since you are not giving it time to freeze up like that.

Good luck - replacing them is really not hard at all.

[dats82]

If the hub were locked up, would it not just spin the axle shaft. I have seen hubs go out, but I have never seen one that went out and made the wheel lock up. What about the hub would prevent the wheel from still turning on the spindle?

[Tobashadow]

Bad bearing?

[Guest coldblackwind]

I don't think its a wheel bearing, it didn't sound like one, and I've had a few bad ones. It also never made a noise before, and it started just before getting to work, which is awful fast to seize a wheel bearing. Definitely something to check, but I'm leaning away from that. As for the manual locking hubs, I've considered that, it'd actually be more like $200, the hubs are $100, but you were right, I would need a conversion kit thats another $100. I do use the 4wd on this truck, even if I don't need it I put it in occasionally to keep it free, bear in mind I learned to drive in NY where most people have at least 1 4wd, and rust will seize them in no time flat. However, the truck had the engine rebuilt, then had the tranny go, which had to be replace, then had the transfer case go, all in all it took about a year of sitting to get it where it is now, so darn near anything could be seized. I did try reversing, but the wheel won't move in either direction, its completely locked up, and to unlock an auto locking hub, you have to move at least a little bit. I'm going to try to get down to take a look at it today and see what I can figure out.

Oh, and 56fordguy...Give me a little bit, I might just be serious about selling it, I have nothing with more than 3 seats so I was halfway considering it anyways, I'll let you know if I decide to.

[leroy]

....Sounds like a bad hub lock. The humming in 2wd is the differential ratcheting from one axle turning. Raise the front and spin the wheels to see which is not releasing. The axle should not move, turn the wheel backwards to simulate engaging.

They go bad all the time. Not that hard to fix yourself. ....

I agree. I'd start looking here myself. Had the same problem with an old 86 full size blazer. I dont like thee self locking hubs either. They have a tendency to go bad and lock up at the wrong time.

good luck

leroy

[DRM]

As for the manual locking hubs, I've considered that, it'd actually be more like $200, the hubs are $100, but you were right, I would need a conversion kit thats another $100.

Nah, you can do it cheaper

Hubs - about $77 to your door - MileMarker Supreme; Manual Hub-RH1

Spindle nut kit (2x) plus shipping for about $30 - Poly Performance JEEP/TRUCK & BUGGY :: Steering :: Knuckles & Inner Cs :: Dana 44 Knuckles & Inner Cs :: Parts Mike Dana 44 Spindle Nut Kit - 4X4 Off-Road, JK Synergy Suspension Systems, Fox Racing Shox, Beard, CNC Brakes, Johnny Joints®, Currie Ente

And that was just 30 seconds of searching online - You should be able to do this for under $120 out the door - and that includes some paper towels, bearing grease, and rubber gloves.

Your local auto parts store should let you rent/borrow the torque wrench and hub socket - worst case the hub socket is another $15 online.

Then again - I'd personally disassemble that one OEM hub first, clean, re-lube, and function test it and see if that fixes your problem without spending a dime

[Guest coldblackwind]

Well, figured it out. Best case scenario for getting home, worst case scenario otherwise. Front diff is totally locked up. From the bang I heard, mixed with the fact that it'll turn sometimes, then totally lock up, I'm assuming the gears came apart and they'll turn til a chunk gets wedged. On the up side, we managed to get the hubs unlocked, and drove it home just fine in 2wd. This will make 100% of the drivetrain I will have had to replace in this truck in the last year (minus the rear end, replaced that about 2-3 years ago). I must admit, I have been in a better mood before.

[DRM]

Ouch... diff-splosion crossed my mind, but I was running with the info you gave. A new R&P and setup (hopefully you can save the differential itself) will run you anywhere from $400 to $1000, more if someone thinks you are a sucker.

[Guest coldblackwind]

I've done a small amount of looking, basically just went on 4-wheel parts website, they have rebuild kits from about $100-200 gears and all, depending on the diff (which I haven't checked on yet to find out which it is, there was a few available), or whole new guts for about $200-400...I don't know, I'll have to tear it apart and see how bad the damage is, but it's gotta warm up first. Dont know if either of those include the R&P or not though. I know they have the spider gears, seals, bearings, etc..right now it's a perfectly good 2wd, so it's not like it's a lawn ornament just yet. It's just when you put it into 4wd that things get hairy. It still makes a halfway decent backup vehicle, and will still pull my trailer in the meantime.

[Guest Letereat!]

Id say scrap it. I would put 20-30 Lbs. of Tanerite in it and clear the area, then eviscerate the rebellious machine with one shot.

[Guest coldblackwind]

Id say scrap it. I would put 20-30 Lbs. of Tanerite in it and clear the area, then eviscerate the rebellious machine with one shot.

Ha! Sounds fun, but being as theres about 3-4 grand worth of new engine and transmission, and miscellaneous parts in it, and a TON of work...I probably better not...

[DRM]

I've done a small amount of looking, basically just went on 4-wheel parts website, they have rebuild kits from about $100-200 gears and all, depending on the diff (which I haven't checked on yet to find out which it is, there was a few available), or whole new guts for about $200-400...I don't know, I'll have to tear it apart and see how bad the damage is, but it's gotta warm up first. Dont know if either of those include the R&P or not though. I know they have the spider gears, seals, bearings, etc..right now it's a perfectly good 2wd, so it's not like it's a lawn ornament just yet. It's just when you put it into 4wd that things get hairy. It still makes a halfway decent backup vehicle, and will still pull my trailer in the meantime.

You have a TTB Dana 44 front.

[Guest coldblackwind]

Figured it was a dana 44, but theres a 30 and 60 listed for it too. But like I said, haven't done that much looking, and to this point, I haven't had to replace anything in the front diff, so I never bothered to check.

[Capbyrd]

Sounds like a perfect opportunity to SAS the front end.