Question for veterans

[Guest SUNTZU]

I am watching Top Tens (combat rifles) right now on the Military Channel. One Vietnam vet talking about the M-16 said that it was not unusual for soldiers to carry fifteen hundred rounds a piece on missions. Was that true then and how much does that loadout weigh? How much ammo do soldiers carry now? Last, what is the typical gear a soldier would carry for a three day or longer mission? Just curious.

[Guest Todd@CIS]

When I was in, my typical M-4 load-out was 210 rounds (seven, 30 round mags).

Regarding the TV show, I'm calling Bravo-Sierra on 1500 rounds per man.

Using the Vietnam-era 20 round mags, that would be 75 mags per man...plus gear.

Nope.

Edited February 1, 2008 by Todd@CIS

[DWARREN123]

I would carry as much ammo and grenades as possible for combat missions and tone it down for recons.

[R1100R]

Basic load is 7 mags (30RD) per M16/M4. This is what you must show at MOB/deployment Station.

Reality is what you are doing at the time. M9 is 3 mags. Some carry both.

Then you have to add vest and the rest of the gear. Medics an M5 aid bag and your radio man his gear. In the real old days we each carried a belt for the M60 gunner.

[TNRobocop]

I know we used to carry 7-10 mags at the most.

I have seen pictures and video from Vietnam that showed two ammo pouches with (3) 20's in each, and alot of times two bandoliers, either (4) or (5) loaded 20's in each one.

So on "average" I could see 14 or 16 mags carried of 20-rd ones. No more that that probably with all of the other **** carried also.

320 rounds of 5.56mm at the most + 1 or two mags on the gun. Call it 360 rounds.

Most guys seem to carry a bunch more water than mags IIRC.

[Guest ACMM]

The most I ever had was 6 in my LBV, 6 on my pistol belt in 2 mag pouches and one in the rifle, it freaking sucked but I'm a wimp.

[Marswolf]

With 1500 rounds, you would have needed a forklift to get me into the field.

[Guest jackdog]

Usual mission you humped about 60 to 90 pounds of gear. Ten mags a coupe of laws gernades, maybe and extra bandolier of of ammo claymores trip flares. Basically you were a pack mule. 1500 rounds HMMM I don't think so.

[Guest ACMM]

I work with a bunch of joe's they all called BS too and I didn't flavor the conversation with my opinion up front, they just said it.

[Guest nj.piney]

unless they were armored infantry. i have an 800 round case of 8mm mauser ammo that weighs 68 pounds. so 1600 rounds would weigh 132 pounds.

[towerclimber37]

I carried 6 30 round mags in my LBE, 2 in a fanny pack and 1 in my rifle. aside from that I carried 2 baseball grenades and 1 willy Pete grenade...that was more than enough for me.

1500 rounds? hahahhaahahah yah right.

[Guest 2HOW]

The others pretty much said it ,,6 and 1 in the m-16 a LAW couple of PD grenades. The LERPS I knew carried less. But I was artillary, little different than a grunt. Didnt patrol much.

[davej48]

In my company the standard load was six 20 round mags and one in the rifle.

[Marswolf]

The LERPS I knew carried less.

It depended on the mission. The LRRPs often scrimped on other items to carry extra ammo. It just depended on where you were going.

[Guest canynracer]

here is the video....http://military.discovery.com/video/top10s.html

select rifles on the right, scroll down to m16

at the 2 min mark he says the comment that when he was in "there were kids carrying 1500rds...that was sort of the standard"

[Marswolf]

Oh, that explains it William Atwater, the fat slob in the clip was a Marine. Of course his guys regularly carried 1500 rounds.

Actually, what he said was that in his company he had "kids" carrying 1500 rounds of ammunition, and that was sort-of-standard. Those kids were called ammo carriers (mules). That was their jobs - not killing NVA. And those "kids" were combat veterans who deserved a lot better than to be called "kids" by a fat POS.

In short, Atwater is what I always expected him to be - before research. He's a fat, pompous academian I'd really want to know how he earned his purple heart. Paper cut?

[Guest SUNTZU]

Thanks for all the answers, the link, and the explanation. I didn't realize he was talking about mules. That just sounded like a lot of ammo.

[Guest jackdog]

Probably cut his finger with a P38 or c-ration lid. What an A**.

[Guest Shooting Coach]

I happen to have some old ammo cases from the day, scrounged from an air base.

One 1680 round case of M193 5.56 ball is 14" high, 13" wide, 8" deep and weighs 66 lbs.

This is not suitable to to hump around on a back pack. As was stated, there were generally ammo carriers for a large force. For "special occasions" where a small party was involved, such as a Long Range Patrol, each warrior carried an amount prescribed by the squad leader or CO and was often resupplied in the field. Six 20 round mags and one in the gun was common when resupply was near.

This was a long time ago, and protocols have likely changed. I am not going to call Bravo Sierra on something I did not hear. It has been almost 40 years since I enlisted. I will say that if one carried 1500 rounds and the other obligatory gear of warcraft, they would likely have needed a wheelbarrow.

[jaysouth]

Our 1966 era unit load out SOP was 20 mags of 19 rounds each, four frags, one smoke, a parachute flare or star cluster, one claymore mine, two trip flares, a belt of MG ammo or law. Non ord was either a machete or entrenching tool, poncho, poncho liner, shaving gear, and as many canteens as you could manage, usually three or four. Add two or three days worth of rations.

We were resupplied every other day unless contact was made with the enemy. Our missions morphed from one into another without returning to a fixed base. You got out of the field for seven days of out of country r&r and three days of incountry r&r. The rest of the year, you were in the bush.

[towerclimber37]

Our 1966 era unit load out SOP was 20 mags of 19 rounds each, four frags, one smoke, a parachute flare or star cluster, one claymore mine, two trip flares, a belt of MG ammo or law. Non ord was either a machete or entrenching tool, poncho, poncho liner, shaving gear, and as many canteens as you could manage, usually three or four. Add two or three days worth of rations.

We were resupplied every other day unless contact was made with the enemy. Our missions morphed from one into another without returning to a fixed base. You got out of the field for seven days of out of country r&r and three days of incountry r&r. The rest of the year, you were in the bush.

and I can almost guarantee that if you had contact..the 2nd thing you did was drop your ruck and attempt to gain fire superiority...Humping almost 400 rounds of ammo is a pain...but that's the life of an 11b.

[Guest jackdog]

Tower you would be correct.