HCP and Alcohol

[mikegideon]

That's cool. I like to fraternize with people who have common sense anyway. Not sure what you do for a living, but I see on a daily basis what stupidity and alcohol mixed together alone accomplish. Add a gun or a vehicle and I don't want to be anyway near unless it's to prevent it.

That's the thing though, the stupid is usually the biggest part of the problem.

[Guest waldo]

Wow! I had a feeling that there would be a lot of holy than thou on this. Just looking for an answer to the question. Could a moderator please delete this entire thread. Thanks

[Guest 270win]

You can't be 'under the influence' while in the possession of a handgun, whether or not you have a handgun carry permit. It doesn't matter if the handgun is loaded or not.

Under the influence of alcohol or drugs is not defined in the weapons laws.

From my understanding, police can arrest people for DWI, even if they are not .08/.10 if the person appears to be intoxicated. I would assume this would be the same case for the person possessing a handgun.

If you appear to be 'under the influence' or say intoxicated, and possessing a handgun, then you are subject to this Class A Misdemeanor. If you are consuming alcohol at a place open to the PUBLIC that SERVES (licensed liquor establishment like a restaurant) then just having a drink can get you charged while possessing at the same time. A PRIVATE establishment does not seem to fall under that.

The point of the law is don't be under the influence of alcohol or drugs while carrying, and don't drink alcohol while carrying at places open to the public that serve liquor. Either can get you misdemeanor charges. Under influence/intoxication is gray. Some folks can hold their liquor and some can't and that's what gives the law discretion with public intox and DWI. You got some that are ok with having a drink with a meal and then going to a ball game an hour later and a minority who would an hour later be publicly intoxicated or DWI. Be careful and stay safe.

I'm from a state where there is no law on the books for folks licensed or police off duty to have a drink and meal in a restaurant. I have no problem with it but TN does. I guess about the only way you can do that is in private at a friend's house.

Edited November 20, 2010 by 270win

[Punisher84]

That's the thing though, the stupid is usually the biggest part of the problem.

If you're drinking and handling a gun it's stupid. I don't care if 2 or 3 people think that's holier than thou. I love a good drink, hell look at my avatar, but there is a time and place to separate certain activities.

I'll even add that I think this type of thread gives a black eye to TGO and gun owners. We spent a year preaching about not drinking and carrying, etc and now someone starts a thread basically asking what he can get away with.

[Oh Shoot]

Wow! I had a feeling that there would be a lot of holy than thou on this. Just looking for an answer to the question. Could a moderator please delete this entire thread. Thanks

The answer to your question is that it is totally up to the LEO whether you get charged for carrying while intoxicated.

There is no test required for arrest, or conviction. You might get field sobriety test, you might not. If you ask, you might get a BAC test, but according to LEOs here, probably not.

The obvious advice is of course to not have your heater on you driving with alcohol in your system/on your breath (unload it, separate ammo same way non permitted person must). Then you're only risking DUI, which is generally a little more straightforward, proof-wise.

- OS

Edited November 20, 2010 by OhShoot

[Oh Shoot]

I've worked on those kinds of dosages. They don't really mess me up. Nothing like alcohol.

Well, I have too, come to think of it.

Maybe I was remembering the times I added alcohol and cannabis to the mixture.

My point really was, though, that there's no real established level for most other drugs as to when you are "high". So barring a prescription, you could be charged with intoxication if they did a blood test and found about any level of opiate, xanax, cannabis, other stuff.

- OS

Edited November 20, 2010 by OhShoot

[Guest CJK]

IA *definitely* NAL, but I doubt that having a prescription for a medication which can produce impairment (e.g., benzodiazepines such as Xanax, narcotics such as Percocet, etc.) is going to get you off the hook. When I was a flight surgeon, being on any of those got you grounded automatically due to their proven effects on reaction time, alertness, and judgment. All of those medications carry warnings not to operate dangerous machinery while under their influence for good reason, and it's also been very well established that you are unable to judge for yourself when you have become impaired.

Sorry to veer off a bit from the OP's question, but I thought this was an important side-topic, if you will.

[DaveTN]

AND, it's not even illegal, per se.

Yes it is.

Second, isn't having a prescription for even one that is listed there at least an arguable exception to "intoxication"?

No it’s a confession.

It isn’t for DUI why would you think it is for carrying a gun?

[deerslayer]

I'll even add that I think this type of thread gives a black eye to TGO and gun owners.

+1

[Mike.357]

these threads crack me up.

[Guest spoolie]

We are all grown ass men here, if you want to risk everything, then drink a few and drive home with a weapon....it's your decision. I have very bad luck and get caught doing anything wrong so I just do right....I recently (3 weeks ago) quit everything and have "dried" up and choose to stay that way, but I don't preach like most in this thread, the OP is a grown man, let him do what he wants....if he f ucks up and goes to jail or kills someone it's on him...doesn't effect us.

Close thread please.

[mikegideon]

Wow! I had a feeling that there would be a lot of holy than thou on this. Just looking for an answer to the question. Could a moderator please delete this entire thread. Thanks

WTF?

[Guest Guy N. Cognito]

+1000

It always cracks me up when this kind of question comes up...most don't answer the question....they just put on their "holier than thou" hats and act like they've never done it.

I've never done it. I'm not that stupid.

[mikegideon]

I don't think we got to the answer yet. Some good speeches though.

Are some of you saying that you can't stop and have a beer when you're transporting a gun at all? I'm not talking about getting drunk. I'm talking about disarming... empty gun in the glove box, ammo in the trunk.

[Guest Guy N. Cognito]

I don't think we got to the answer yet. Some good speeches though.

Are some of you saying that you can't stop and have a beer when you're transporting a gun at all? I'm not talking about getting drunk. I'm talking about disarming... empty gun in the glove box, ammo in the trunk.

Is it legal? Don't know. Too much cop/judge discretion in this one.

Find the wrong cop on the wrong night..........beer+car+guns= a night in jail and an extensive legal bill.

[mikegideon]

Is it legal? Don't know. Too much cop/judge discretion in this one.

Find the wrong cop on the wrong night..........beer+car+guns= a night in jail and an extensive legal bill.

Geez... for acting responsibly. That's why I never get stopped. Too much trouble.

[Guest Guy N. Cognito]

I went duck hunting once with a friend and his regular hunting buddies. As soon as we got in the blind, the flasks came out. I got out of the blind and went back to camp. As you can imagine, I got a few comments from the rednecks as I left. They showed up back at camp a few hours later. Two of the bubbas were deaf in their left ears from one of their buddies who "forgot" where they were, rotated too far, and touched off a 12ga round right next to their heads. None were "drunk", and the errant shooter claimed to be "sober." He was walking and talking fine......but his flask was empty. He didn't seem drunk, but two of his friend had permanent hearing loss due to his negligence.

[Guest Guy N. Cognito]

Geez... for acting responsibly. That's why I never get stopped. Too much trouble.

Responsibly? Maybe.

There have been plenty of times I have gone shooting with some friends, then decided to go out and have some dinner and drinks. We always go home first and get rid of all the guns. Just seems like tempting fate.

[Guest m&pc9]

Some times I drink a beer and mow my grass.

And I still have all my toes.

[mikegideon]

Responsibly? Maybe.

There have been plenty of times I have gone shooting with some friends, then decided to go out and have some dinner and drinks. We always go home first and get rid of all the guns. Just seems like tempting fate.

So, you're worried about losing all your adult judgement when you have a couple of beers? I'll agree that drinking and shooting is a bad idea, especially in a hunting situation. But, I can drink a case of beer without having the urge to shoot my guns.

[mikegideon]

Some times I drink a beer and mow my grass.

And I still have all my toes.

I used to. Lost my senses and shot up my lawn mower. Now I pay somebody. I hope I don't shoot their mower too

[Fallguy]

Here is the text of the law...

39-17-1321(a)

Notwithstanding whether a person has a permit issued pursuant to § 39-17-1315 or § 39-17-1351, it is an offense for a person to possess a handgun while under the influence of alcohol or any controlled substance.

http://www.michie.com/tennessee/

So, what is under the influence? It is as other's have said, pretty much up to the LEOs discretion. There is no BAC level.

[DaveTN]

I don't think we got to the answer yet.

Sure we do.

It’s illegal. There is no BAC requirement. It goes in the natural order of progression… Cop, DA, Judge or Jury.

Are some of you saying that you can't stop and have a beer when you're transporting a gun at all? I'm not talking about getting drunk. I'm talking about disarming... empty gun in the glove box, ammo in the trunk.

I haven’t seen anyone say that, but it is possible. If the gun and the ammo are separated chances are the cops wouldn’t mess with you. But there is no requirement that the gun be loaded. It’s the risk you take if you want to drink, drive, and have guns in the vehicle.

[Guest Guy N. Cognito]

So, you're worried about losing all your adult judgement when you have a couple of beers? I'll agree that drinking and shooting is a bad idea, especially in a hunting situation. But, I can drink a case of beer without having the urge to shoot my guns.

Gee did I say that......hold on, I'm checking......nope, sure didn't. I'm more worried about some cop losing all of his adult judgment and taking me to jail on a bunch of trumped up firearms charges, simply because I had a little alcohol in my system.

[DaveTN]

So, what is under the influence?

Whatever is presented to the court. Officers observations, Video, any BAC or drug tests the suspect submitted to.