Teacher carry of a handgun in a car parked on school property?

[Timber Ghost]

For what it's worth, I personally saw this happen. I kept my handgun in my car for yrs at the school where I worked. A teacher that I knew at the school did also( along with many others) , all had CP's. One day a student happened to move his car a few feet for him, and as students will do, looked in the console and saw his pistol. It was reported and the local officers really did not know what to do. After taking the gun and trying to figure out what to charge him with, the DA returned the gun and basically said that no law was broken. Commen sense prevailed. P.S. He continued to work there until he retired.

Edited December 9, 2011 by Timber Ghost

[Fallguy]

For what it's worth, I personally saw this happen. I kept my handgun in my car for yrs at the school where I worked. A teacher that I knew at the school did also( along with many others) , all had CP's. One day a student happened to move his car a few feet for him, and as students will do, looked in the console and saw his pistol. It was reported and the local officers really did not know what to do. After taking the gun and trying to figure out what to charge him with, the DA returned the gun and basically said that no law was broken. Commen sense prevailed. P.S. He continued to work there until he retired.

...and I think that is as it should be. (Other than letting the student drive a car with a loaded pistol in it...but I digress)

Unfortunately not sure it would go down like that in every district in the state.

[Guest Thebs]

Q-tip that sounds like a GREAT idea.

[JWKilgore]

Alright... asking for a summary here. I just got my HCP. I don't see the need to carry on my person during normal day-to-day activities. I got the permit so I can carry while traveling; I occasionally go to some unsavory locations, and I've REALLY wanted a loaded weapon a few times in the past.

Back to the current topic, with a twist... I occasionally drop off or pick up my son at school. I understand the law clearly states I'm allowed to "possess" a loaded gun in the vehicle when I'm in the car line as long as I don't mess with it. But what if I need to park and walk inside? Say to help my son carry a large project to his class, or meet with a teacher, or drop off some paperwork. Someone posted back in #14 that the only way to legally do this is to stop somewhere off school property and stash the gun (maybe in a bush???).

Any other discussion on this? Can I legally keep an untouched-but-loaded gun in a locked console while my vehicle is temporarily parked on school property? What if the gun is unloaded and stored separate from ammo such that my HCP does not apply? I realize that the chances of being discovered are small, but the possibility exists. I don't want to lose my HCP because of an arrest (highly unlikely), and I worked hard to get my son into a Magnet school and don't want him to get kicked back to his zoned school because I screwed up (more likely).

[Guest pfries]

I do go pick my kids up from and drop them off to school for appointments and I am required to go inside to sign them out and in. I realize this is a GREY area and I am willing to be a test case here. I do not feel as if it will be much of an issue if it goes to court as “A person entering the property for the sole purpose of delivering or picking up passengers” and in those instances, it is a requirement of the schools to go in and sign them out/in to accomplish this. I have also stretched the bounds to take them to school and drop off a science project as the school does not allow the students to go to the classroom before class.

Bracing for the subjective views here.

39-17-1310. Affirmative defense to carrying weapons on school property.

It is an affirmative defense to prosecution under § 39-17-1309(a)-(d) that the person's behavior was in strict compliance with the requirements of one (1) of the following classifications:

(1) A person hunting during the lawful hunting season on lands owned by any public or private educational institution and designated as open to hunting by the administrator of the educational institution;

(2) A person possessing unloaded hunting weapons while transversing the grounds of any public or private educational institution for the purpose of gaining access to public or private lands open to hunting with the intent to hunt on the public or private lands unless the lands of the educational institution are posted prohibiting entry;

(3) A person possessing guns or knives when conducting or attending "gun and knife shows" and the program has been approved by the administrator of the educational institution; or

(4) A person entering the property for the sole purpose of delivering or picking up passengers and who does not remove, utilize or allow to be removed or utilized any weapon from the vehicle.

[Oh Shoot]

... But what if I need to park and walk inside? Say to help my son carry a large project to his class, or meet with a teacher, or drop off some paperwork. Someone posted back in #14 that the only way to legally do this is to stop somewhere off school property and stash the gun (maybe in a bush???).

Any other discussion on this? Can I legally keep an untouched-but-loaded gun in a locked console while my vehicle is temporarily parked on school property? What if the gun is unloaded and stored separate from ammo such that my HCP does not apply? I realize that the chances of being discovered are small, but the possibility exists. I don't want to lose my HCP because of an arrest (highly unlikely), and I worked hard to get my son into a Magnet school and don't want him to get kicked back to his zoned school because I screwed up (more likely).

From main statute: 39-17-1309

"© (1) It is an offense for any person to possess or carry, whether openly or concealed, any firearm, not used solely for instructional or school-sanctioned ceremonial purposes, in any public or private school building or bus, on any public or private school campus, grounds, recreation area, athletic field or any other property owned, used or operated by any board of education, school, college or university board of trustees, regents or directors for the administration of any public or private educational institution. It is not an offense under this subsection © for a nonstudent adult to possess a firearm, if the firearm is contained within a private vehicle operated by the adult and is not handled by the adult, or by any other person acting with the expressed or implied consent of the adult, while the vehicle is on school property."

Whether that means loaded or unloaded is a constant source of debate, but read the whole statute, and this paragraph only differs from the previous one, with respect to "going armed" NOT being mentioned, and also note that this permission does NOT depend on having an HCP -- so I think most of us agree that the intent is for the gun to be in unloaded condition, since that is the only way one without an HCP can legally have one in vehicle.

Since "unloaded" means also no ammo in proximity, though, this makes it pretty inconvenient to arrive with a loaded gun, then unload it and separate ammo before leaving vehicle. And of course you must "handle" it to do that. You'll find that many of the TN weapons statues have a large gray WTF built in.

- OS

Edited December 14, 2011 by OhShoot

[Fallguy]

OS sums it up pretty well....

[JWKilgore]

Thanks for the answer. I'm not worried about a random search, or even bomb-sniffing dogs. The more likely scenario is that my ex-wife gets pissed at me for some reason and reports me, or my son tells a friend or teacher.

But because of the gray area, I think I'll just ask. I'm friends with our schools parent-teacher coordinator, so the next time I see her I'll try to get an official position.

[Fallguy]

Thanks for the answer. I'm not worried about a random search, or even bomb-sniffing dogs. The more likely scenario is that my ex-wife gets pissed at me for some reason and reports me, or my son tells a friend or teacher.

But because of the gray area, I think I'll just ask. I'm friends with our schools parent-teacher coordinator, so the next time I see her I'll try to get an official position.

She may tell you her opinion, but I wouldn't take it as a legal answer any more than any of them on here.

I would wager if you asked more than one school offical or even more than one law enforcement offical would would get the range of various answers/opinions as on here.