my saturday hunt....

[my82cam]

well, guys, i decided to hunt in the woods first thing saturday morning, i didn't see a darn thing, so, i went into the big field around 10. at 12 oclock i scanned the wood line and saw a big buck about 5 or so yards in the woods. i raise my encore and look through the scope, i can't tell how many points as all but some were blocked by a tree but his body was very large. at this point i start shaking, i think my heart rate went from 75 bpm to 390 pbm. lol after the 3rd time of trying to calm myself down by taking deep breaths, i was able to hold the scope very steady on a forward lung shot just behind the shoulder. i squeezed the trigger. bang! the deer starts to run towards me and turns into the wood line giving me a clear line of sight on the exiting side of the bullet. there wasn't a bullet hole? no blood, no nothing. the deer ran off into the woods, never to be seen again. after 45 minutes i went to look for a blood trail, i couldn't find any blood anywhere, not even kicked up dirt from a missed shot. i sat and rattled and waited to see if he would come back, he never did. went back to the stand and 3 hours later i saw a deer in the same spot where i shot at the buck, my heart stopped until i saw it was just a large doe. i held my rifle steady for the 100 yard shot, DRT all for legs up in the air, didn't move at all. i went and found a small entry wound and no exit wound on the deer, the deer rattled like a kids rattle toy. the 245gr powerbelt came apart and tore up the heart and lungs! as i was driving home it hit me like a load of bricks, i dont think i missed the buck, i think the bullet just came apart and didn't leave a large exit wound. has anyone else had trouble with the powerblets like this? if it doesn't stay in tact, i think i am going to try other bullets they stay together. sorry this was so long, but i have had a lot of time to think about this! lol i will be back in 2 weeks with a friend and we are going to look and see if we can at least find the antlers or some of the body.

[Howler]

Most of the time a long shot with a ML will not have a exit wound and thus will not have a blood trail. I shot one at 30 yards that didn't leave a trail. I found it 100 yards away with the wound side up and the bullet just under the hide on the off side. After finding the deer and backtracking the trail it only bled the last 20 yards. I almost gave up on finding it, but I got lucky and it ended up in the freezer. As far as the heart rate thing, it happens, that's what keeps you going back. A little trick you might use is...before you shoot... tense up your entire body. Try to use up some of the adrenaline your body has buit up. Then take a deep breath, relax, and squeeze. It works for some, but not everybody. Good job on the doe.

[my82cam]

the last deer i shot with a muzzle loader was at 35-40 yards and that was with a hornady sst. it left an exit that you could stick your hand into. i guess i could see that at 200 yards, but i think at 100 yards and 150gr of 777 that the bullet should go straight through them. or am a just wrong? lol i was thinking about calling powerbelt and asking them if they should grenade or stay together. i will try to tense my body, i did the breathing, but never tried that, thanks

[Handsome Rob]

Go find your buck dude. Did you even bother to look for the deer or did you give up after you found no blood? It's quite probably laid there dead somewhere or worst case, it's badly wounded & the least you could do is spend a little more time searching through the woods to find it. You owe it to the deer. It's probably well within 100yds of where it was stood when you shot it.

Drop 50gn off your load too. 150gn is waaay more than you need to take a deer at 100yds & the extra powerd is probably what caused your powerbelt to come apart.

I shoot a roundball .54 with 90gn of powder & a .50 roundball with 75 & I'd be more than happy to shoot at a 100 yard deer with those loads. 150 is twice as much as you need & with the laws of diminishing returns, twice the powder doesn't mean twice the power. I've also heard a lot of pretty bad things about Powerbelts on game. Good for accuracy, easy to load, but often fragment on impact. The Hornady SST, on the other hand, returns nothing but praise. I really don't think the 'magnum' load will have helped either.

Edited November 7, 2010 by robtattoo

[gregintenn]

I've noticed the same thing with two different muzzloaders and several very different loads. You shoot the deer, and he acts like he hasn't been hit at all. No blood. You walk a little ways, and there lays your deer. I can't explain it, but I've seen it with round balls, lead Buffalo Bullets, as well as PowerBelt bullets.

[whiskey]

The buck I shot Saturday was 40 yards out and I am shooting 100gr or 777 and a 250gr T/C Shockwave Sabot. I did not get an exit wound either. I did get an entry hole about an inch in diameter and a good blood trail to the deer, less than 100 yards down the hill. My shot was a quartering away shot, so I suspect the bullet lodged in the far side shoulder. I was a bit hurried Saturday so I dropped the deer off at the processor and didn't get to investigate myself.

I have been using the Hornady SST loads in shotgun slugs for several years with good results. However, three years ago I shot a 1.5 year old doe at AEDC with the SST slugs on a quartering away shot and did not get an exit. The bullet dropped the doe in her tracks from a good heart hit, but the bullet lodged in the hide of the off side shoulder.

I have had a couple buddies that switched away from the powerbelts due to displeasure. Not sure if they had deer killing problems or accuracy problems.

I got my muzzleloader late in the game this year and decided to go with the T/C Shockwaves from the accuracy reports and availability. Next year I will be using the Hornady XTP sabots in either 240 or 300 grain. I have been very happy with the XTPs in various loads over the years.

[gregintenn]

I shoot 295 grain Powerbelts. They seem to work as good as anything in my rifle.

[Howler]

I can remember at least three I took that didn't have exit wounds. Two taken with a Knight ML with 100gr charge and one with an Encore and 150gr charge. I don't know if it hit a rib just right or what, all I know is it can happen. I've had others that just fell straight down and never moved at all. One of the three deer taken ran less than 50 yards and ended up in some real thick stuff. I never heared the crash because of the noise the other deer made running off. The only way I knew I hit her was a small bit of hair I found. She was shot with the Encore, 150gr of powder and shockwave sabot. When I got down I just knew there would be blood everywhere, but there was none. My hunting partner made the statement "that extra powder didn't help much". End result was all the deer were recovered, it just took longer than I wanted.

[my82cam]

i switched from the hornady sst because my encore wouldn't shoot them unless i cleaned the barrel between each shot. with the powerbelts i can shoot 6 or 7 times without cleaning and they are very accurate. i may try the tc shockwaves for next year. yes, i did look for the deer. answer me this, if i have the rifle loaded with 100 gr for shooting at 100 yards, how am i supposed to reload the rifle for the 200-300 yard shot that i may have the opportunity to take?(no, i haven't shot at 300 yards yet, but, so far, up to 200 yards, the leupold ultimate slam scope is right on and no, i wouldn't practice on a deer if that is what you are thinking) i always prepare for the long range shots in case they come up, that's why i use 150 gr of 777.

[my82cam]

howler, sounds like you had the same result with 100 gr as you did w 150 gr of powder. whiskey shot his deer at 40 yards with 100 gr 777 and it didn't leave an exit wound, i would hardly blame it on me having it loaded with 150gr of 777

[Handsome Rob]

i switched from the hornady sst because my encore wouldn't shoot them unless i cleaned the barrel between each shot. with the powerbelts i can shoot 6 or 7 times without cleaning and they are very accurate. i may try the tc shockwaves for next year. yes, i did look for the deer. answer me this, if i have the rifle loaded with 100 gr for shooting at 100 yards, how am i supposed to reload the rifle for the 200-300 yard shot that i may have the opportunity to take?(no, i haven't shot at 300 yards yet, but, so far, up to 200 yards, the leupold ultimate slam scope is right on and no, i wouldn't practice on a deer if that is what you are thinking) i always prepare for the long range shots in case they come up, that's why i use 150 gr of 777.

You want to shoot a deer at 300 yds? Wait until rifle season. A Muzzleloader is not a long range firearm, you need to learn to limit your shots mate.

[my82cam]

if i have a muzzle loader that is capable of shooting 300 yards accurately, what is wrong with taking the shot if you have practiced and know your limits.

[Handsome Rob]

Nothing, to be honest, I just think that 300 yds is really pushing the limit of a 180+gn, 1900FPS projectile. If you're struggling to get an exit wound & blood at 100yds, what do you think the chances are of getting a clean kill at 3 times that range?

Working on a 180gn bullet weight at that velocity, you'll have a bullet drop of nearly 45" at 300yds with a 10mph crosswind, you'd get about 20" of drift. To me that's just not precise enough for shooting at game.

Just my opinion is all. I don't know you or how good a marksman you are, 300yds may be well within your capabilities, I just don't think it's within the rifle's is all.

[my82cam]

i'm not saying i am going to shoot a deer at 300 yards, i haven't even shot it that far yet, but i have at 200 and it was right on.

[DaveS]

I use 80 gr of 3f black powder in all my .50 cals. The same "80 gr that kills them at 20 yards also kills them at 200. No need to increase your powder load. There comes a point on powder loads where you are just burning excess powder and making noise, and accuracy does decrease. Maybe 150 grain of powder makes you feel macho, but your bullits aren't manly enough to take the excess pressure. Just because your gun can shoot 150 grain, doesn't mean you have to. Alot of times you can get better velocities and acuracy with less powder.

[my82cam]

i don't shoot 150gr because it makes me feel macho, if 100 gr will do the job and help my bullets perfom better, i will try it. i sighted it in with 150 gr because thompson center told me 100gr was only good to 100 yards and if i was going to shoot past that, i would have to use 150gr. it is not a macho thing and the gun shoots very very well with 150 gr. i will sight it in with 100 gr and see what my bullets perfrom like.

[Chris]

I popped a large buck this weekend with a 295 gr powerbelt... 100gr of powder... 60 yards. It did quite the number on him... no exit wound, but plenty of blood. He made it 50 yards before he dropped. I didn't recover the bullet, but it did the job just fine.

[my82cam]

sounds like it doesn't matter what powder charge you are using, you aren't going to get an exit wound very often

[iyaoyas98]

150 grs under a powerbelt hollowpoint for me. Small buck at 30 yards, no exit. The hollow point came apart and got lungs, heart, and a small piece of shrapnel in his spine. He dropped right there, and was dead before the smoke cleared.

[KahrMan]

sounds like it doesn't matter what powder charge you are using, you aren't going to get an exit wound very often

I have had the exact opposite problem. The last three deer I shot with the polymer tipped powerbelts were complete pass thrus. Only one of the three had any expansion. I was using 100gr of 777 with a 195gr powerbelt. All three shots were 40-50 yards. The first two punched right thru without any expansion. Both of these deer ran a good bit and did not bleed much. The third expanded like it was supposed to and left a golf ball size hole coming out. He didn't run very far.

It seems to me that muzzle loading bullets are not as consistent at expanding as modern centerfire ammo.

[Howler]

sounds like it doesn't matter what powder charge you are using, you aren't going to get an exit wound very often

That's all I was trying to say. Not knocking ya. I hope that's not the way you took it.

[my82cam]

i just called powerbelt and spoke with them, they said that using 3 pellets shouldn't effect the bullet. said they find several cases where the bullets don't penetrate all the the way through and grenade, with both 2 and 3 pellets. i think kahrman said it best "It seems to me that muzzle loading bullets are not as consistent at expanding as modern centerfire ammo."

[my82cam]

i didn't take it that way howler

[whiskey]

Might want to try these too.

Expander MZ | Barnes Bullets

[roverboy]

I use 90 gr. Triple 7 and a 350 gr. Maxi-Hunter. I killed a 3 yr. old 140 lb. dressed buck Saturday morning at 40 yds. I hit him in the shoulder and it lodged under the skin on the opposite side. It expanded to about .80 cal. It had some gashes in it, like it hit some bone.