Karl Rove vs Saarah Palin, battle lines will be drawn along these two.

[Guest 6.8 AR]

American Thinker: Palin v. Rove and the Battle for the GOP's Future

Karl Rove did help get Republicans elected, but what about his candor

concerning the Tea Party movement? I'll take Sarah's side.

[leroy]

All:_______________

Right here is the core of Rove's problem:

...but the Rove magic has faded some. He appears to be suffering from a severe case of Beltway Insideritis. It strikes when those who've been comfortable with their status as powerful political influencers lose some of their...gravitas...and become mere observers of the events they wish they could influence, but can't. ....

Rove is the ultimate "political hack" (...which is ok with me, i tend to be one too ---unlike me, he actually gets paid for his opinions, mine, sadly (...for me at least...) are free...); and he covets the influence of the job of giving advice and council to the most powerful office in the world and the great personal satisfaction that job must bring on a personal basis (...and i fully understand that, it's got to be great...). Rove served a president (...Bush 43...) who had a historic chance to be the most beloved and revered president ever. But, for reasons completely mysterious and reasoning fully uncompreshensible to me, at least...). Bush decided to commit political suicide and murder the Republican Party in the meantime by doing several miserably stupid things. Here they are:

• He allowed political operatives (...both demorat and republican...) to turn Iraq and afganisgtan into vietnam after he said he wouldnt. That, alone sealed his fate.
  
• He (....again for reasons totaly uncomprehensible to me...) he simply would not answer his critics. He chose to ignore them, and that added nails to his coffin. Remember, Reagan politely made fun of his critics and made them look like the bufoons they were.
  
• Bush allowed government to grow. Growing government, no matter how noble the cause, is simply not a conservative Republican virtue. He was far closer to a kennedy era Demorat than he is a conservative Republican.
  

Rove had to be a part of all the idiotic decisions outlined above. That (...to me, at least...) says "Bush's Brain" participated in some massive miscalculations.

I also think it's important to remember that the Republican Party has factions too. There are conservative Republicans (...like most of us here on this board...) who are not millionaires and have to work for a living. Who believe that the Constitution and the Bill of Rights means exactly what it says, and who believe that government in general is a necessary evil, and that government continually spends too much money on too many stupid things. That stands in stark contrast to the "Blueblood" Republican fatcats (...to borrow the demorat phrase for 'em; a case of the "pot calling the kettle black' in my view...) who do not necessarily share the libertarian values of small government and fiscal responsiblility as the conservatives do. Their view is one of "how can i jerrymander government to help me out on an individual basis?" How can i leverage my influence to help my bottom line? Many times, this "Blueblood" view of the world is in direct cross purpose to the conservative ideals of limited government and fiscal responsibility.

The Republicans are in a titanic internal struggle between the "conservatives" and the "bluebloods". If the "bluebloods" win; they will finish what Rove and the Bushes started (...with the help of McCain and others...); --- the "Final Solution" to the Republican party --- it's complete destruction. The Republicans would do well to quit listening to folks like Rove and putting up "open minded" reasonable candidates. They need exactly what the Tea Party has brought to American Politics. A real, genuine conservative world view, complete with regular folks like Palin who aren't ivy league know-it-alls; but real people.

If the Republicans dont completely embrace a conservative agenda. They will be the next bunch to go; and Rove and company will really know what it means to be unemployed political pundits. Rove needs to make up with Palin and the real republicans and shut up. That may save his job.

That's how i see things this morning.

Radical Libertarian Leroy

PS--- THANKS FOR POSTING THIS NEAT ARTICLE AR!!

KEEP UP THER GOOD WORK!

Edited November 3, 2010 by leroy
formatting and grammar!!!

[Armed Aviator]

LeRoy, Well Done... Well Done!!!

[Bigiron]

A very astute observation, Leroy. And right on the money. Far too many politicians assume the "you're a peon and I'm God" shortly after taking office.

[mikegideon]

Rove IS an insider. Insiders aren't going away. In fact, most of the new, Tea Party folks will be insiders in two years if they want to make any marks. All the noise around this election was certainly inspiring and entertaining, but... we don't need to lose sight of who REALLY runs this country. It ain't Congress.

[Guest 6.8 AR]

Rove IS an insider. Insiders aren't going away. In fact, most of the new, Tea Party folks will be insiders in two years if they want to make any marks. All the noise around this election was certainly inspiring and entertaining, but... we don't need to lose sight of who REALLY runs this country. It ain't Congress.

That is something I dearly hope you are wrong about, because it always is a possibility. But congress can make

the messiah/ruler expose himself, and there are enough Democrats scared about their futures, by the Tea Party,

that they may play in a different sandbox because of the public's rejection of this leader's policies.

Rove is an insider, alright, but he does see the political winds shift. He got a lot of folks mad, this time, and his

elitism will have to change, or he won't make the bucks. I think he already knows that.

[mikegideon]

That is something I dearly hope you are wrong about, because it always is a possibility. But congress can make

the messiah/ruler expose himself, and there are enough Democrats scared about their futures, by the Tea Party,

that they may play in a different sandbox because of the public's rejection of this leader's policies.

Rove is an insider, alright, but he does see the political winds shift. He got a lot of folks mad, this time, and his

elitism will have to change, or he won't make the bucks. I think he already knows that.

A lot of folks ain't buyng into the PILF (Palin). She has a lot of followers, but she has more that aren't. Worse for her is the fact that she won't follow a strategist's direction. She's a compelling girl, but she can't win.

DC will continue to be what it has aways been... a corrupt mess with very good PR schemes.

[Oh Shoot]

...

DC will continue to be what it has aways been... a corrupt mess with very good PR schemes.

Yep, as long as money determines policy ("legal" lobbying alone is plenty, not to mention under the table) and there are career politicians, nothing will significantly change.

Let me know as soon as Congress denies lobbying and sets term limits, and I might feel a glimmer of hope about the future of the Republic. Though I think it's already too late, period.

- OS

[mikegideon]

Even term limits won't fix all of it. It just doesn't take that long to become part of the "system".

[East_TN_Patriot]

Even term limits won't fix all of it. It just doesn't take that long to become part of the "system".

This is true, but not just because of the people becoming "part of the system." The issue is that they have no choice but to become part of the system because that is how the system has been set up. To hijack Obummer's car analogy a bit, the system is set up in such a way that it doesn't matter who is driving the car. The issue is that the car is running. The bureaucratic system we have is specifically intended to preserve the functioning of our government regardless of what happens. As soon as a politician enters office, they are instantaneously part of that very bureaucratic system that dictates their powers, function, and how they carry out those powers and functions. They are subjected to so many regulations, laws, and safeguards that they have no choice but to act as part of the system. By radically acting outside of the rules, which would be required to implement radical change, they are not able to actually do anything because the bureaucratic model prevents that sort of action from being allowed or successful. When Jefferson said "The natural progress of things is for liberty to yield and government to gain ground.", this is essentially what he was referring to. It's not just arbitrary power or any particular political ideology, but it is the essence of the bureaucratic form of government to continuously legislate and regulate to such a minute degree that it can exist and function with virtually no oversight or input from political leaders. As long as the car is moving, the bureaucratic form is working as intended, even if it is running off the road and running over pedestrians in the process. What I am getting at is that we should not expect to see significant change in the next 2 years because the politicians who have been elected were elected under that specific bureaucratic model of government, they serve under it, and exist as a part of it, thus inherently making them part of the very problem they are trying to overcome. It's a very slow and difficult process to make the big changes, which is exactly what the system is intended to do. It took us decades to get where we are and it will take decades to change it.

On a different note, I agree with the OP's article, however. Palin and Rove represent two different branches of the political right. Palin is the more libertarian, grassroots, and classical liberal conservatives while Rove represents the more elitist, big business, neo-conservatives that came onto the political scene after the Reagan era. I think that Rove is a DC "insider" who has become so influenced by the forces of Washington that he no longer sees the world as someone who is not part of that political atmosphere. After spending so many years running with the big dogs, he's skewed his own perspectives. Palin is the opposite at this point, but I suspect had she actually been elected VP, she would come out of Washington very different than when she went in. I think this is where the term limits help out. It forces the politicians to leave and take their insider views with them and they are replaced by fresh perspectives.