Recruiters told they can accept openly gay applicants.

[Guest Jamie]

However I wouldnt disregard law school as something that any guy/girl off the street could do either.

Then why do I know so damn many lawyers???

Seems like everybody and their cousin around here as a law degree of some kind... Hell, one of my training officers with the S.O. is now an attorney... He got his degree while working as a deputy. ( Not bad for an ignorant flatfoot, huh? )

[Guest 85rx-7gsl-se]

Then why do I know so damn many lawyers???

Seems like everybody and their cousin around here as a law degree of some kind... Hell, one of my training officers with the S.O. is now an attorney... He got his degree while working as a deputy. ( Not bad for an ignorant flatfoot, huh? )

Not all law school are created equally either which could be part of the issue. Again maybe like your thing with the military and my lack of personal experience..In the case of law school at least here at the University of Memphis it takes a decently intelligent person to get in and then the academic requirements are no cake walk. That is based on my real experience and interaction with my classmates. The fact is to be a lawyer you must spend appox. 7 years in school. You generally must have good undergrad grades to get into a good lawschool. Then you have 3 years of study that is pretty challenging. Then you must pass two tests (MPRE and the BAR) and evaluation by the state bar to be admitted to practice.

Edited October 21, 2010 by 85rx-7gsl-se

[Guest HvyMtl]

A little off topic, but, there are not that many lawyers, Jamie. Even though the attendance for most any form of grad school is up right now (it is easier to stay in school when the economy is down) there are fewer and fewer opportunities for those with the JD to be able to make a living as an attorney. Sounds good right? Well, heaven forbid you need one and you cannot find a good one...

I might know about this topic, as I do have a law degree, and do not practice law.

Not all law schools are create equal is beyond understatement.

IF anyone wants to be an attorney, I will be more than happy to advise you on how to become one without severe (think $150k+) debt...

Edited October 21, 2010 by HvyMtl

[Guest Jamie]

Not all law school are created equally either which could be part of the issue. Again maybe like your thing with the military and my lack of personal experience..In the case of law school at least here at the University of Memphis it takes a decently intelligent person to get in and then the academic requirements are no cake walk. That is based on my real experience and interaction with my classmates. The fact is to be a lawyer you must spend appox. 7 years in school. You generally must have good undergrad grades to get into a good lawschool. Then you have 3 years of study that is pretty challenging. Then you must pass two tests (MPRE and the BAR) and evaluation by the state bar to be admitted to practice.

Yeah I know; Like I said, I know a crap-load of attorneys. And about half the people in my wife's office have a law degree as well... and they're all state employees. Go figure.

( The point being it seems to be one of the most common professions/professional degrees around, for some reason or the other. )

Edited October 21, 2010 by Jamie

[Guest Jamie]

A little off topic, but, there are not that many lawyers, Jamie.

Then I am either very lucky, or very unlucky then. ( see prior post )

Also, if you drive into town, and drive around the square, you'll be able to count about a dozen or more law firms, each employing at least 2 or 3 attorneys apiece. And that's not counting the ones who've died or retired.

And yes, the cost is one reason I never really considered the job myself.

Edited October 21, 2010 by Jamie

[mikegideon]

Yeah I know; Like I said, I know a crap-load of attorneys. And about half the people in my wife's office have a law degree as well... and they're all state employees. Go figure.

( The point being it seems to be one of the most common professions/professional degrees around, for some reason or the other. )

It certainly doesn't hurt to have one, especially if you accidentally fart on somebody at the grocery store.

[Guest Jamie]

It certainly doesn't hurt to have one, especially if you accidentally fart on somebody at the grocery store.

Wadda ya mean, "accidentally"? How else are ya supposed to break up those Hen Parties in the middle of the coffee isle?

[Guest 85rx-7gsl-se]

A little off topic, but, there are not that many lawyers, Jamie. Even though the attendance for most any form of grad school is up right now (it is easier to stay in school when the economy is down) there are fewer and fewer opportunities for those with the JD to be able to make a living as an attorney. Sounds good right? Well, heaven forbid you need one and you cannot find a good one...

I might know about this topic, as I do have a law degree, and do not practice law.

Not all law schools are create equal is beyond understatement.

IF anyone wants to be an attorney, I will be more than happy to advise you on how to become one without severe (think $150k+) debt...

I am glad to see someone else who at least understands where I am coming from. A yes just because you have a law degree doesnt ensure you will get a high paying law job but the nice thing is that if you do graduate and gain bar acceptance you have a license that does give you a little edge IMO. I say this because unlike many other careers where a certain degree may be preferred but you will have to compete with applicants with various other degrees here you either have the license to practice or you dont.

Just out of curiosity what line of work are you in? I know that UofM had great placement numbers a few years back but now the economy has taken its toll so I am looking into other non-legal venues where my law degree would still be appreciated. You could PM if you like. Thanks in advance.

[Guest 85rx-7gsl-se]

What other professions are you referring to Jamie? I mean are you saying it is very common compared against all potential career fields or against a limited segment of "professional" careers? Also what would fall in the "professional" career category you referred to?

[Guest Jamie]

What other professions are you referring to Jamie? I mean are you saying it is very common compared against all potential career fields or against a limited segment of "professional" careers? Also what would fall in the "professional" career category you referred to?

A couple are directors or assistant directors of state offices, or some other position with the state. ( Auditors, for instance ) And then there are various county or city employees...

Oh, and one or two others are firearms instructors.

Trying to remember who else I know that has a law degree, but doesn't practice law... I know there are a few more, but can't come up with 'em at the moment.

ETA: Oh, one worked a few jobs at once... she was a high school guidance counselor, worked as a commissioner with the S.O. and P.D., and also did something with DCS... ( Dept. of Children's Services. )

Edited October 21, 2010 by Jamie

[mikegideon]

What other professions are you referring to Jamie? I mean are you saying it is very common compared against all potential career fields or against a limited segment of "professional" careers? Also what would fall in the "professional" career category you referred to?

How about Gun Barrel Illustrator?

[Guest Jamie]

How about Gun Barrel Illustrator?

I'm sure more than one person with a law degree has the job title of "Legal adviser to XXXX manufacturing co."

[Guest 85rx-7gsl-se]

A couple are directors or assistant directors of state offices, or some other position with the state. ( Auditors, for instance ) And then there are various county or city employees...

Oh, and one or two others are firearms instructors.

Trying to remember who else I know that has a law degree, but doesn't practice law... I know there are a few more, but can't come up with 'em at the moment.

ETA: Oh, one worked a few jobs at once... she was a high school guidance counselor, worked as a commissioner with the S.O. and P.D., and also did something with DCS... ( Dept. of Children's Services. )

I am fully aware that not all law school graduates practice as attorneys. Its been that way for years. However I am not sure that in and of itself indicates that law degrees are easy to obtain... Also some people (maybe like the lady in your final example) choose to go to law school and get out and do something they think makes a bigger difference in the world than their service as a practicing attorney.

[mikegideon]

I'm sure more than one person with a law degree has the job title of "Legal adviser to XXXX manufacturing co."

I'm sure you're right. Still, I would like to meet the guy that messed up my rifle stating the obvious.

[R1100R]

I agree. I haven't been there. You have. However I would like to see the results of the surveys the military has apparently been implementing to see what current soldiers think on the issue. That to me would be the best evidence. Whether that will ever occur or not is another matter.

The survey was two part and voluntary. No names listed. just rank and branch.

The question was to keep the policy or do away with it. Then there was a box for comments or your view on the subject.

From discussing it with other service members I noticed that length of service, rank and age had a lot to do with ones opinion.I work at a General Officer level and so all ranks were present.

[Guest Jamie]

I am fully aware that not all law school graduates practice as attorneys. Its been that way for years. However I am not sure that in and of itself indicates that law degrees are easy to obtain... Also some people (maybe like the lady in your final example) choose to go to law school and get out and do something they think makes a bigger difference in the world than their service as a practicing attorney.

Um... the lady I mentioned was my high school guidance councilor... and apparently didn't add that other stuff 'til later on. I was surprised the first time a warrant was needed, and she turned out to be the commissioner on call, some 20 years later. And surprised yet again when I found out her involvement with DCS. She was definitely a busy woman. ( I think she's retired now, but I wouldn't swear to it. )

BTW, I figure if lazy-assed Fred Thompson can get a law degree, anybody can.

Speaking of that, there's always acting and politics, after you get out of law school...

[Guest 85rx-7gsl-se]

Um... the lady I mentioned was my high school guidance councilor... and apparently didn't add that other stuff 'til later on. I was surprised the first time a warrant was needed, and she turned out to be the commissioner on call, some 20 years later. And surprised yet again when I found out her involvement with DCS. She was definitely a busy woman.

BTW, I figure if lazy-assed Fred Thompson can get a law degree, anybody can.

Speaking of that, there's always acting and politics, after you get out of law school...

Haha I think I would pass on the acting and my girl has already begged me to stay out of politics lol

[Guest 85rx-7gsl-se]

The survey was two part and voluntary. No names listed. just rank and branch.

The question was to keep the policy or do away with it. Then there was a box for comments or your view on the subject.

From discussing it with other service members I noticed that length of service, rank and age had a lot to do with ones opinion.I work at a General Officer level and so all ranks were present.

Thanks for the info. And I am assuming from your previous post in this thread that from your observations the majority were against repealing the policy?

[Guest Jamie]

I guess the next question would be what percentage of the troops filled the survey out.

[Guest Jamie]

Haha I think I would pass on the acting and my girl has already begged me to stay out of politics lol

Careful of that one, it closes a lot of doors. ( The Comptroller of Tennessee is an attorney, and that's a political/appointed position. I believe the former Comptroller also had a law degree as well. )

[R1100R]

Thanks for the info. And I am assuming from your previous post in this thread that from your observations the majority were against repealing the policy?

No, not really. I think it was the aftermath of what might happen. The Gay Pride movement is a very vocal/public group. Most gay SM that I have met in the service don't want to live in fear. They also don't want a lot of hoopla over the subject and just go on business as normal if and when it is repealed.

[Guest 85rx-7gsl-se]

Careful of that one, it closes a lot of doors. ( The Comptroller of Tennessee is an attorney, and that's a political/appointed position. I believe the former Comptroller also had a law degree as well. )

Oh I know politics open many doors. I think she doesnt want me running for office here in Shelby County lol

[mikegideon]

Careful of that one, it closes a lot of doors. ( The Comptroller of Tennessee is an attorney, and that's a political/appointed position. I believe the former Comptroller also had a law degree as well. )

Did they have an accounting degree as well, or was that optional?

[Guest Jamie]

Did they have an accounting degree as well, or was that optional?

No accounting degree that I'm aware of, but there is a bunch of training that they have to attend every year... sort of like a LEO's in-service. They have a certain number of hours that the law requires them to take to hold that office.

[mikegideon]

No accounting degree that I'm aware of, but there is a bunch of training that they have to attend every year... sort of like a LEO's in-service. They have a certain number of hours that the law requires them to take to hold that office.

Oh, accounting seminars for lawyers . Perfect!