Pet Peeve / Soft Spot.... But It Is Warranted....

[Guest razorblade]

Message to Sgt Joe. THANK YOU. Well said and I appreciate your service and the service of all represented on this site. Thanks to you all.

[Guest mosinon]

I find myself uneasy with the notion of having to support the war without supporting the troops.

I support the troops no matter what. Tell the troops to invade Canada and steal the maple syrup and I'll say "Kill every Canuck you can" because I support the troops. Right or wrong, I'm behind the military and them doing their jobs. Those men and women give up a lot to serve our country.

Damned if I am going to extend the same courtesy to the friggin mission. The wars we are in right now are stupid wastes of time and money and we'd be better off if we weren't fighting them. I'm tired of rebuilding someone else's country. I'm not sure what we are really fighting for but I know that the people who do it are bad asses and they do it without question. They are truly fantastic.

[Smith]

What in the world ......???? As to the OP +1 as to the rest of it, are you serious?

[LagerHead]

Sgt Joe nailed it.

As to the OP, I agree with all except this:

[...]however, IMHO, if you don't support the mission, you can't support those on the mission.

Not even close to being true. You can think that the mission itself, which was handed down by the Commander In Chief is jacked up without disrespecting those serving. Hell, many of those serving think the same. But you can support the fact that they are performing that mission admirably and with a sense of purpose and patriotism regardless of how you feel about the mission itself. The mission and the person can be separated just as the Office of the President and the man himself can.

[leroy]

....I am a veteran and proud American (qualifier met). I am confused. Why does this action and others like it bother people more than offensive pictures/ billboards of the leader (current and former) of OUR country? Enlighten me. I am not the sharpest tool in the shed so I am always open to learning something new. Obama has been weak and clueless, but he is our leader. By the way I agree with you, but I would still like to read some responses to my question. ....

I want to say this as kindly as I can. The "leader of your country" is elected. The word "elected' is the key word. That means that he is a representative chosen by the majority of the people as the 'leader of our country" for a time. It is not a new thing that a politician would run on one set of principles (...read that promises...) and govern from another; and then be criticized (…or even ousted…) for doing so. That is exactly what is happening with Nobama.

I have watched and participated in politics ever since 1964. Every president that ran on one set of principles and governed from the other (....except one, Bill Clinton...) was defeated when the American voters that elected him realized what had happened.

Here are some examples:

Jimmy Carter: (one term) Elected by voter indignation for Gerald Ford's pardoning of Richard Nixon. Folks thought that the Republicans were above the law.

Ronald Reagan: Elected because Carter was incompetent in his first term (...we'll see this happen again...). He won by telling the truth. He said “government was too big and too meddlesome in everyone's business…” (...sound familiar...). He won and was elected for a second time because folks believed he was right (...by the way, he was....).

Bush ONE: (one term) He won because he ran on Reagan's coattails which were big. He lost to a fella by the name of Bill Clinton because he didn't do what he said he would do. He said he would continue Reagan's policies. He didn’t. He was killed with the "Read my lips; no new taxes" thing. He then went along with the Demorats and raised taxes. The voters remembered and threw him out. Clinton won because he said "...I aint like them other socialist Demorats; im a new Demorat...!" It turns out he was pretty much like the other demorats anyway; but the economy was good.

Barak Obama: Nobama won because he said: “I’m not like them mean Republicans; I’m here for “Hope and Change”. Folks have found out in short order that “Hope and Change” means socialism and the worst kind of influence peddling we have seen since Reconstruction.

The “disrespect” you sense around Obama is due to the problem of running on one set of principles and governing from another. Do not confuse contempt or opposition to policies by citizens as “disrespect for the country”. It aint the same thing. The people opposing the “leader of your country” are exercising their rights as citizens to oppose or even vote out of office those elected officials (…right up to the president…) who they feel are not doing the job they were elected to do. That’s why America is a representative republic and is the envy of the rest of the world (…for the time being, at least…). It is, in fact, the genius of America. Do not confuse “disrespect” with political opposition; it aint the same thing. The First Amendment guarantees the right to political “free speech”. That means speech, cartooning, ect; no matter how heinous or offensive to some of its citizenry.

The “politically correct” and “Tolerance Police” would have you believe that you are obligated to tolerate everything. Toleration in their view is silence; it effectively repeals the First Amendment -- that's what they want; no vocal opposition to their policies. American politics doesnt work that way. No politician is off limits to criticism; no matter how coarse. Remember, the Demorats said: “Reagan is a clueless actor… (…it turns out he wasn’t…).” “Bush is a dummy …it turns out he may have been…). Lincoln is a gorilla (…he wasn’t…). Criticism and debate (….along with a bit of name calling, caricature, heated discussion, and even a few fist fights…) aint a bad thing in the political arena. That is what has made this country great for the 230 + plus years of its existence. We don’t have any “Dear Leaders” here like the North Koreans do or any Kings like King George was when Britain ruled the world and the Colonials “fired the shot heard round the world….”.

Be thankful you live in a country where (…for the time being, at least…) you are free to criticize and even disrespect your ‘leader”; not to mention throwing him out if he doesn’t suit you. Lots of folks in other parts of the world wish (…mostly in secret…) that they had that freedom. Don’t worry about politicians being offended by what you say; they have thick skins. It’s part of the territory.

Hope this gives you a bit of a new perspective on political respect. Don’t equate disrespect for individuals as disrespect for country and its values. It aint the same thing.

Others have said it far more consisely and elolquently than i have. The fact is that the principles America is founded on are much greater than the men who temporarily swear to uphold them. Dont worry about the men; worry about the principles they vow to uphold. That is the great thing about America.

By the way; a big + 1,000 to Glock23ForMe 's original post.

Food for thought.

Leroy

Edited October 18, 2010 by leroy
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[styx]

"Barak Obama: Nobama won because he said: “I’m not like them mean Republicans; I’m here for “Hope and Changeâ€. Folks have found out in short order that “Hope and Change†means socialism and the worst kind of influence peddling we have seen since Reconstruction."

It is because I respect the office of 'President' that I disrespect Barak Obama.

[Guest clsutton21]

I support the troops and not the mission.

I support Barrack Obama.

I support our country.

Maybe you're hockey singer was a poor singer. I guess you must have to jump to the worst. *Worst hick accent* look at dat, a turrerist *end accent*.

You must not have much experience in logic, but I can't blame you with this state's education system.

[TGO David]

Because Presidents are men. Our flag and our anthem stand for something much more, they stand for an ideal, they are symbols of our country.

This.

[Guest 6.8 AR]

I am a veteran and proud American (qualifier met). I am confused. Why does this action and others like it bother people more than offensive pictures/ billboards of the leader (current and former) of OUR country? Enlighten me. I am not the sharpest tool in the shed so I am always open to learning something new. Obama has been weak and clueless, but he is our leader. By the way I agree with you, but I would still like to read some responses to my question.

Political satire in this country began the day this country began. When you polarizing issues

and different ideologies competing, there is no way someone won't get offended, no matter

how polite the opposing parties could be. That's just the way it is. Some people take things

differently than others. Some people also want to legislate free speech away to keep opposing

views silent.

LINKS2K, it's like you say something I don't like, and instead of discussing it, one of us attempts

to shut the other up. Even if we didn't like anything about each other, it's still better to take the

high road and respect the other's opinion while maybe disagreeing with it.

When someone boo's during 'rockets red glare' they are showing me they don't have a basic

education in American History. That's a bit different than criticizing Obama, Bush, Clinton, etc.

They are merely mortals that temporarily hold a very powerful office. The office is attached to the

constitution, not Obama, Bush, etc, but they swore an oath to uphold and defend the office and

the constitution. The office is not subject to criticism, but they are. The person singing that song

represents and leads us in praise for our country and flag. That should not be disrespected by

boo's. If they don't like the message the song conveys, the scum should get up and leave.

I choose to defend people like Reagan and, yes, even Bush, based on events. Anyone can defend

or belittle any one in office. If it upsets me, I'll probably just offer a defense or keep my mouth

shut, but there is nothing wrong with it, either. A billboard by an individual or group is free speech

and isn't slandering an office, just the person in the billboard. If someone doesn't like it, they can

turn away or whatever the hell they want to, but don't mess with our heritage. That will and should

anger people.

Leroy, as usual, you said it well, and OP, I agree with you, too.

Otherwise, when in Rome...

[Punisher84]

I support the troops and not the mission.

I support Barrack Obama.

I support our country.

Maybe you're hockey singer was a poor singer. I guess you must have to jump to the worst. *Worst hick accent* look at dat, a turrerist *end accent*.

You must not have much experience in logic, but I can't blame you with this state's education system.

So you support Socialism too?

[Chucktshoes]

So you support Socialism too?

Or maybe just Strel with grammar like that.

[Punisher84]

Or maybe just Strel with grammar like that.

Hahahahaha

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Guest clsutton21]

So you support Socialism too?

So you support ignorance?

[Smith]

So you support ignorance?

I think he all ready made it clear he doesn't support socialism/populism.

[McAllyn]

So, if you can support the "Office" but not the "Man," can you support the "Flag" but not the "Song about the Flag"?

Mac

[Guest 6.8 AR]

Apples and oranges. The flag and the song about the flag are both historic, patriotic and

symbolic.

History determines how well or poorly the man executes the office.

The man is only a temporary occupant, while the office endures.

Nothing to compare.

[Rightwinger]

We will never impeach the flag or remove the song from office. If those actions or similar ever occur, it won't matter anymore as America will be dead as a nation.

What the nation needs to recall and be taught is there are lines that should not be crossed in a civil "American" society.

[Punisher84]

So you support ignorance?

No, you cannot get a donation.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Chucktshoes]

No, you cannot get a donation.

Booyakasha!

[Guest TargetShooter84]

Good post, Drew.

Even though you're on vacation.....