Re:- Women learning safe gun handling and shooting... Guns and Leather ... Ben

[perstare]

You've probably already heard a lot comments of praise for Guns and Leather (in Greenbrier). So what the heck, one more won't hurt, right?

Eight days ago, my wife and I took a trip to Guns and Leather with the goal of finding a gun for her.... a gun which she would like. (And most of all, a gun which SHE could pick out and which SHE could test fire on the spot.)

The trip was a complete success for two reasons:

Reason #1 -- BEN

Reason #2 -- I stayed out of it

What is a "BEN," you ask... A "Ben" is the name of a salesman in Guns and Leather who has a great talent for teaching ability. He certainly succeeded with us.

My wife (strong of spirit, strong of character, weak of wrist) cannot operate the slide on my two .40 cal Glocks. Furthermore, the recoil of the Glocks is far more than she could control.

So we chose a Walthers P22 (22LR) as a possible gun for my wife. Good choice. It was perfect for her. We walked out the door with a new Walthers.

OK -- I chose the "Women and Firearms" forum to post this, because I hope that **women** might profit. More relevant, though, is the importance to the men in their lives who want to do the "right thing" regarding gun choices. Guys, listen up: If you choose a gun for your woman, no matter how correct your choice might be, it might be useless. The key to that problem is that the woman must be the **dominant, controlling** factor when the time comes to make the final decision. Clearly, my wife who loves her Walthers, will not hesitate to use it for self-defense. ...because it's her baby, her choice, her decision.

Clearly, 22LR doesn't have the punch of a .40 cal S&W. But a 22LR is better than nothing. Later, when my wife's "learning curve" leads her to upgrade her firepower, maybe a 9mm in a heavy handgun will be in her future. It's up to her.

Mike B

PS I'd like to ask the women out there if they have suggestions regarding gun choices, heavier than 22LR.

Edited September 29, 2010 by perstare

[PackinMama]

Always happy to hear that another woman has decided to take the initiative to "not be a victim!" Nothing wrong with a .22 to start out with if that's what she is most comfortable with. Trust me, none of the people on this forum that say that you need a minimum of 9mm for self defense would want to be shot with a 22. It's a thousand times better than no gun at all.

If and when she thinks that she might want to "upgrade" to a larger caliber, there are a couple guns that I'd recommend. First, she could always go to a .22 magnum. Packs a little more punch than a .22lr with just a tiny bit more recoil. Or she might want to step up a tad more and get a .380 like the Ruger LCP, or even the Walther in .380. If she feels that she's ready for something a bit more formidable than the .22 or .380, I'd definitely go with either a 9mm in a semi-auto or a .38 in a lightweight revolver (loaded with low recoil rounds). In a 9mm, since she likes the Walther, maybe that would be the one to stay with in 9mm as well. Other 9mm's I'd have her try out would be the KelTec P11 and PF9, Kahr PM9, and Glock 26. Those are all small enough to carry concealed fairly well on a woman, and all good guns that I'd trust my life to. In a .38 wheelgun, I personally like the lightweight snubbies made by Taurus and S&W, as well as the Ruger LCR. If you load them with the low recoil rounds, they're a breeze to shoot. Even loaded with regular .38 loads, I have no problem with them. Many women like the ones with the laser grips so that's something that you might want to let her check out sometime.

Tell her I said Congrats on choosing her first gun!! That's a big first step....the rest is easy!

[A.J. Holst]

My wife just shot her P22 Sunday and I'm already thinking of an upgrade, though if she becomes deadly with the .22, why would she need anything bigger?

I personally like the PK380 over the LCP. The PK is so similar to the P22, it seems to be a natural progression if she moves up in caliber. I have shot the LCP and don't like it. I know it's a pocket gun, but the small grip and light weight, it can be a handful for, as you describe, the "weak of wrist"

+1 on the LCR! I'm a Ruger wheelgun guy, carry an SP101 and have carried the LCR. The LCR has a great trigger right out of the box and carries very well in a pocket, IWB or OWB; even in a "notebook/dayrunner" holster I had. With the new .357 LCR you can pick up some weight and with a low recoil .38 round, really offset perceived recoil.

After our first shooting session, my wife's mindset got "right"

"I have no problem emptying a magazine into a bad guy trying to hurt me."

[Guest SCarman]

Again, I'm contributing very late to the thread. Gotthegoods, has your wife experimented with any other pistols of higher caliber? Getting over my fear was half the battle, now I love higher cal guns. I shoot a Walther PPS 40 cal. It's my personal favorite. Don't have any problem working the slide, breaking it down to clean it, or loading it. Ultimately, it's gotta feel right to her, but I've heard the Walther PK380 is similar to the P22. I'm sure there is a right fit out there for her.

[Guest friesepferd]

First- a 22LR is better than nothing. I'm glad she now has something to defend herself with.

2nd- she needs something bigger as soon as possible.

I understand that having weak wrists does indeed make shooting larger caliers more difficult, and makes racking a slide more difficult.

Having said that, I have taught the most weak and scrawny 10 year old girls to shoot centerfire pistols with no problem. They can also rack the slide just fine. It takes training and technique though. You would be surprised how little effort it takes to rack any slide when done correctly. I highly suggest you find some beginners shooting classes for your wife to take, where someone used to these issues can help your wife out.

Have you looked at a 38 revolver? No slide racking there anyways.

Feel free to PM me if you want, I can provide a detailed explination of how to most easily rack a slide with weak arms.

[Jonnin]

My wife is also a bit weak in the hands. We tried a lot of different things to find her the right gun, and we have a winner now. She absolutely loves her sig p238. Its tiny, easy to conceal carry, and the slide is easy to rack. It has a 1911 design and seems to have far less recoil than most of the tiny 380s (some of them are rather stout). Its very accurate for a tiny pistol. The biggest downside to the thing is the price, at over $500 its a bit steep for a 380. ALso, since its 1911 style, cocked & locked means no tough DAO trigger pull or fumble with the hammer during an attack: you just pull it, thumb the safety and shoot, and the light SAO trigger is managable by those with weak hands. I highly recommend trying this gun out for a test drive.

If the sig is too small, you might consider a makarov or larger, heavier 380 in that same general platform (surplus maks, bersa, walther, for example make larger 380s ). These will have a heavier slide, but the larger grip is better for 2h style (the sig is really a 1h gun, its so small) and the heavy frames reduce the recoil a bit. They have decent triggers though the first shot in DA mode can be rough on some models. The benefit here is that mak ammo is far cheaper than 380, and the guns are also quite cheap. The downside is, lot of places won't have mak ammo, online is your friend.

Yet another option is a beretta .32 tip up barrel, which avoids racking the slide entirely: you never have to muscle these guns. They are small and have a bit of recoil, though. Remember, self defense and range shooting are different: all that matters is if she can handle a few shots of recoil heavy defense, not if she can shoot out 2 boxes with it on the range without any hand fatigue...

From there, you start to move up into the 9mm platform, which has billions of styles and shapes and sizes to try. These vary from stout recoil to gentle giants, but all of the slides will be much more difficult than the above smaller calibers. Or, if a slide is a problem nut a bit of recoil is not, a revolver gets rid of the slide problem.

Those are my starter suggestions. But a 40 is a LONG WAY from a .22. There are a world of guns in between these calibers, and she may find something she can enjoy in one of them.

[Grunt67]

My wife started off with a 40 S&W Taurus 24/7. Worked good for a while until she

developed a wrist problem ( not gun related ) & couldn't handle the weight of the gun

or the recoil. Good idea to start small & work up.

[Guest ab28]

Hopefully you got a good P22. The one I had was an inaccurate piece of garbage. I mean, it couldn't even hit a paper plate at 15 yards. I had 4 other friends shoot it with the same results. It was unfortunate, as it was really reliable and fun to shoot.