Using your gun to prevent an assault?

[JReedEsq]

If he comes at you, kick his ass. If he comes at you with a knife, shoot him. Might wanna avoid mentioning guns.

Self defense in a nutshell!

[Oh Shoot]

Brandishing a gun is never a "simple" assault because, by definition, you're using a deadly weapon. Using a deadly weapon is an aggravating factor.

Ah, of course that makes sense.

Then I take it as I had thought, that there's nothing regarding firearm "brandishing" in TN?

And that a charge would be aggravated assault, wherein "Uses or displays a deadly weapon" is one of the criteria?

Additionally, to split hairs, would simply showing the firearm, like moving shirt to show it in IWB holster, be grounds for that?

Meaning, that it's not unlawful to carry your firearm in plain sight from the get go.

Guess hinges on "displayed" wording intent, or what the definition of "is" is.

- OS

Edited July 28, 2010 by OhShoot

[Fallguy]

I've seen this now in a couple post. There is NO duty to retreat in TN.

That is what the post above yours said......

[Mechanic_X]

We talked about (in carry class) participating in an argument that escalates into "fear for life" is not grounds to pull your piece. Although you do what you have to do. I took with Jim Carter. He said a good way to show is the bottom of your holster buy moving your shirt. That way the other guy can not identify your gun. Or even know if you have one in it.

[mikegideon]

Jim Carter is a good guy.

[Guest Jamie]

I'd just like to say that running off at the mouth about something you don't have on you at the time is pretty much an invitation to your own funeral.

'Cause I guarantee you that anybody with half a working brain cell, that intends, or is even thinking about doing you serious harm, is never going to give you the chance to go fetch that weapon you're going on about.

And as for telling the boss to let you handle it yourself... not wise, and not wise of him if he lets you, because then the company may end up being liable or at least sued if the situation escalates and somebody gets hurt.

In the end, I'd have to say that no, you did not handle the situation very well at all, Drew, and really need to think on things before you actually do start carrying.

Oh, and if you're wondering what my response would have been to your co-worker, if it'd been me? I'd probably either have ignored him altogether, laughed at him, or said "That's nice" and just walked off. If he'd pursued the issue beyond that, I'd probably break something heavy over his head, then explain to the police that he threatened to cut me, then came after me when I tried to walk off.

J.

[Mike.357]

you should have never said gun. When you mentioned gun I would take that as a threat to use the gun.

I would have called him out again. Pointed out that he was not doing his job, knows he was not doing it and is now pissed because you recognized him for not doing his job. At that point I would have shook my head and walked away.

When and if the day comes that you have a carry permit it is your duty to avoid conflict. Walk away.

[Mike.357]

I've seen this now in a couple post. There is NO duty to retreat in TN.

no duty, but retreat is the best option in this instance.

[Guest peacexxl]

Slight hijacking here but on the subject of being a big guy ... I figure anyone who chooses to come at me, I am 6'3" 270lbs, is either armed, skilled, or crazy. Whatever the case, my justification, in my head, is that while I try to walk away, if I ever have to draw, it's because this guy saw me and wasn't worried so I needed to be.

[Guest Jamie]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VUslGSoEH8I

That should pretty much cover it.







J.

[Guest grays]

At 6'2 250 you are going to have a hard time proving you were in fear of your life in a fist fight with anyone of a comparable size. You can't just draw and shoot because you don't want to get punched. You have to be in fear of SERIOUS BODILY INJURY or DEATH. So if he did actually pull a knife or weapon, you'd be ok. If he punches you in the face, either punch him back or walk away. Don't shoot him lol

lol this was what I was thinking... also I have learnt to hold my tongue more than ever when packing nothing good can come of two grown men fighting. You see all the time someone gets hit and the other guy falls the wrong way and dies or goes into a coma.

[Guest Oaklands]

We discussed this in my class when studying for the HCP.

If someone punches you in the face, no you cannot shoot them in retaliation. I asked the question this way. I don't want to get in a fight at my age. I gave that up a few years back and I don't want a bloody nose, so if he comes at me with the intention of doing bodily harm, am I justified then. The answer was a careful "Yes."

Most people don't tell you they are going to do something to you. Usually they are trying to act much tougher than they are. I only worry about the ones who don't give me a warning.

Another scenario we discussed. A guy is threatening you with a baseball bat. There is a car separating you. You cannot shoot him. Let him come around the car to your side with the bat and his A** is yours.

Just my 2¢ worth.

[Guest 270win]

Put as much distance between you and this guy. Don't be around him alone....don't talk to him...avoid him...stay away from him....if possible, run from him if he comes after you....if he doesn't have a weapon, and you can't run away and are cornered, give him a good butt kicking...you are pretty good sized....then call the cops and have him charged with assault....the guy is probably a lot of mouth....don't tell anyone where you work that you carry a gun for self defense or show them your gun for any reason....BAD idea...the only reason work should find out you have a gun is when you have to use it for a deep crap situation...by then it really won't matter...keep your handgun hidden well when at work...don't discuss guns at work..don't ask don't tell....you don't want some mouthy piece of crap to change the story and get you in trouble with your job or the cops...lay low.

[Guest Lester Weevils]

It seems relatively easy to avoid fights, or I've been crazy lucky having avoided any fights for over 40 years. It helps to keep one's eyes open, be amiable, and don't go anywhere real obviously dumb to go.

If you do have a lapse of judgement and go to a cutting and shooting nightclub, at least stay away from the pool table and poker table, sit with back against the wall near an exit, and don't dance with women you don't know, to avoid those "gimme three steps" scenes. It ain't shameful to run if it is practical. Take a look outside before you go for the car.

Along the same lines, before you go home with that old gal, it is a good idea to ask if she has any biker boyfriends who might get out of jail tonite, but I digress...

When young did OK on football lineman or wrastlin, but never got the good end of a fist-fight unless I could get ahold of the opponent. In old age, this probably hasn't improved any.

Ain't yet got one foot in the grave and another on a banana peel, but a fight with a young man COULD bring on a heart attack.

Blind in one eye and the other one ain't great. One lucky shot could bring on permanent blindness.

Suffered two years pain from a herniated disk, and a fight could bring on more years of such suffering.

So if a young man shows serious intention of whupping my butt, and pepper spray doesn't look like a reasonable option, gonna just have to shoot the boy and take my chances.

[Smith]

That is what the post above yours said......

True, I was quick-reading that post and mixed it with another one that said otherwise.

no duty, but retreat is the best option in this instance.

Very true.

[Fallguy]

True, I was quick-reading that post and mixed it with another one that said otherwise.

Have done it myself

[Guest Drewsett]

Well, I guess I should have anticipated the collective butt-chewing I just got. LMAO

I knew it was stupid to mention being a gun owner pretty much the second I did it. The pepper-spray is a good idea and would pretty much end the confrontation right there if he decided to come after me.

Do you really feel it's necessary to not talk about guns at work period? We live in freaking TN, not NY. I don't really advertise or just volunteer information to anyone (this one event being a glaring exception), but one of my bosses is an ex-Seal and he and I discuss new guns coming out on the market and occasionally go to the range together. Another co-worker is a good friend (maybe even my best friend) and we occasionally discuss 2A issues when we talk politics at work.

At the end of the night he came up to me again running his mouth and I told him why I called him out. I said "you're a great worker when you want to be, you just don't want to be often enough". He seemed to calm a little after that, even going so far as to admit it might possibly be true.

About the worst case scenario will be that I will just have to be perfect at my job for the foreseeable future (he has several friends in supervisory roles) and will no longer be able to go and have a beer at the after work hangout anymore (because the d-bag is a raging alcoholic). I have no fear that he will do anything while at work, while he may be a d-bag, he is relatively smart. But out at a bar...after he's had ten or fifteen drinks (I've had to give his drunk butt a ride home and just about carry him into his house on more than one occasion so that number is accurate) there's no telling what he might do.

Heck, not going out will save me like 20 bucks a week so that might not be a bad thing.

[Guest Jamie]

If you make a hobby of dealing with drunks, you're eventually going to have to whip one's ass, or shoot one... ( Or get whipped or shot by one ) so yes, you're better off skipping that routine altogether too.

Also, talking about guns at work is fine. I've done it myself for years.

However, there's a big difference in talking about 'em in general, and trying to use the fact that you own 'em to bluff someone into leaving you alone. Especially when you don't have one on you at the time.

A lot of folks know I own guns. Not many ever have any idea of whether or not I happen to be carrying one when they see me.

J.

Edited July 29, 2010 by Jamie

[mikegideon]

At the end of the night he came up to me again running his mouth and I told him why I called him out. I said "you're a great worker when you want to be, you just don't want to be often enough". He seemed to calm a little after that, even going so far as to admit it might possibly be true.

.

Manager hat on: This is what you should have done in the beginning. If you have a problem with somebody not pulling their weight, you will get much better results if you just confront them with it. No need to be a dick about it either. I had the same basic thing between two of my guys this week. I let them hammer it out. One of them didn't even know I was in the loop. They wound up hating each other for a few hours, and then it was over. Guns and ass whippin's ain't an option in my world. That will get you fired.