Chicago's tough new gun ordinance goes into effect

[Guest friesepferd]

can anyone link me to the actual ordinance?

[eapking]

Having just returned from a fun-filled trip to Chicago (which we loved), I can safely say the main thing wrong with Chicago is their near-Socialist, draconian gun law loving Mayor.

and they keep voting him back in...idiots.

[Guest jth_3s]

there is a big damn difference. In TN you can buy a handgun face to face and keep it loaded in your home without reporting it to the police or paying fees for that right. The 10 dollar fee is a background check when you buy from a FFL, but the gun even in this instance is not registered. And again you can keep it loaded in your home or carry it on your person while in the confines of your property.

If I want to have a carry permit I must pay, but there is little argument here that we have a right to carry a firearm off of your own property.

Tennesseans dont have a right to carry off their own property they have a privilege granted by the state. Privileges are granted by the state and can be taken away by the state. Handgun Permits are violations of the 2A. Forcing someone to register their person with the state or pay $115 in order to have the privilege of carrying a gun is no more constitutional than forcing someone to register their guns.

Edited July 15, 2010 by jth_3s

[Mike.357]

Tennesseans dont have a right to carry off their own property they have a privilege granted by the state. Privileges are granted by the state and can be taken away by the state. Handgun Permits are violations of the 2A. Forcing someone to register their person with the state or pay $115 in order to have the privilege of carrying a gun is no more constitutional than forcing someone to register their guns.

agreed there is no right to carry in TN.

I think you need to back up your stance that HCP's are a violation of 2A though. Show me a court decision that meaningfully backs that up. Without that court's decision there is no right. Go and carry without a permit, get caught and use 2A as your defense. Let me know how that works for you.

There is a big difference between gun registration and carry permits.

[Guest 6.8 AR]

agreed there is no right to carry in TN.

I think you need to back up your stance that HCP's are a violation of 2A though. Show me a court decision that meaningfully backs that up. Without that court's decision there is no right. Go and carry without a permit, get caught and use 2A as your defense. Let me know how that works for you.

There is a big difference between gun registration and carry permits.

There may have never been a court case that addresses the issue, Mike, but

the 2nd amendment doesn't address the issue of what the states think are

their rights on the subject. "Keep and bear arms" is very cut and dry, but our

politicians have addressed the issue of gun control very sloppily during the last

100 or so years, and this is what we are stuck with. It may or may not end up

that we will see the permit process abolished. I think that the original

intent of the 2nd amendment and permitting or NFA registration is an

infringement. What will happen is another matter, altogether.

If all laws were consistent we wouldn't have the problem of carry permits or

gun registration.

[Mike.357]

It may or may not end up

that we will see the permit process abolished. I think that the original

intent of the 2nd amendment and permitting or NFA registration is an

infringement. What will happen is another matter, altogether.

I agree, but until there is a law saying so the right is non existent as far as what will get you cuffed and stuffed.

I would like to see " reasonable restrictions " better defined,

[Guest 6.8 AR]

I would rather see the laws made more consistent

concerning criminals and the makings of 2nd amendment

issues go away, but with our feel gooders on both sides,

I don't expect much.

However, Macdonald open up the door for the challenge to a lot of laws by incorporation.

You just never know.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Guest jth_3s]

agreed there is no right to carry in TN.

I think you need to back up your stance that HCP's are a violation of 2A though. Show me a court decision that meaningfully backs that up. Without that court's decision there is no right. Go and carry without a permit, get caught and use 2A as your defense. Let me know how that works for you.

There is a big difference between gun registration and carry permits.

The 2A protects the Right to Keep and Bear Arms not just own them. I dont need a court decision because Judges dont create rights, they are supposed to protect them. The Constitution put a Limit on the government that was designed to restrict them from infringing my right to keep and bear arms. That piece of paper alone will not protect our rights and it is the duty of the people to hold the politicians accountable when they violate any of our God given rights. HCPs are not even a Federal Issue, the Feds would allow TN to be more gun friendly but our state politicians have restricted our rights just as much as the Feds. Im not the type to go around carrying without a permit because using the 2A or Constitution as a defense with Law Enforcement or a Judge will get you nowhere and I cant afford the trouble. As for the difference between gun registration and a Permit, The only difference I see is that in Gun registration you register property and with a permit you register your Person. Im not sure which is worse.

Edited July 15, 2010 by jth_3s

[Tempest455]

So how does this effect a TN resident wanting to "transport" a gun through Chicago?

[Guest jth_3s]

I have no idea but I wouldn't want to get caught with one up there. You'd most likely be detained for a while at the least

[Guest 6.8 AR]

So how does this effect a TN resident wanting to "transport" a gun through Chicago?

Battle lines will be drawn again and again because of

incorporation in the MacDonald ruling. There will be more

challenges until one side goes away.

If you are transporting a legal firearm through Chicago to

somewhere else, maybe you are in violation of their law.

I don't know, but I wouldn't volunteer any information to

Chicago while passing through, anyway. It's none of

their business.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[DaveTN]

So how does this effect a TN resident wanting to "transport" a gun through Chicago?

You would be subject to Illinois law, which would be pretty much the same as Tennessee law… Unloaded, inaccessible, and in a case.

Illinois FOID laws only apply to those who maintain a residence in Illinois. I would think the Chicago handgun ban would be the same; but I do not know that for sure. They have to allow you to pass through; but I don’t know the specifics of what is allowed as far as stops.

If you, a Chicago cop and your firearm all came to meet; it would depend on the circumstances as to what happens.

[Oh Shoot]

So how does this effect a TN resident wanting to "transport" a gun through Chicago?

Federal law is quite clear on that matter:

"Gun Control Act of 1968, Sec. 926A, Interstate transportation of firearms:

Notwithstanding any other provision of any law or any rule or regulation of a State or any political subdivision thereof, any person who is not otherwise prohibited by this chapter from transporting, shipping, or receiving a firearm shall be entitled to transport a firearm for any lawful purpose from any place where he may lawfully possess and carry such firearm to any other place where he may lawfully possess and carry such firearm if, during such transportation the firearm is unloaded, and neither the firearm nor any ammunition being transported is readily accessible or is directly accessible from the passenger compartment of such transporting vehicle:Provided, That in the case of a vehicle without a compartment separate from the driver's compartment the firearm or ammunition shall be contained in a locked container other than the glove compartment or console."

- OS

[Guest jackdm3]

My buddy goes to and fro, while waiting for HCP, by separating ammo, frame and slide. He was instructed in his class that it must take more than 2 steps to assemble and shoot while he "journeys." But this is a bit hindered because he has a 4-door Cherokee with absolutely nothing behind the front seats. Not even carpet. What do you guys recommend? Bolt on a lock box right behind a seat? Is putting it near the rear hatch necessary?

[BigPoppa]

Federal law is quite clear on that matter:

"Gun Control Act of 1968, Sec. 926A, Interstate transportation of firearms:

Notwithstanding any other provision of any law or any rule or regulation of a State or any political subdivision thereof, any person who is not otherwise prohibited by this chapter from transporting, shipping, or receiving a firearm shall be entitled to transport a firearm for any lawful purpose from any place where he may lawfully possess and carry such firearm to any other place where he may lawfully possess and carry such firearm if, during such transportation the firearm is unloaded, and neither the firearm nor any ammunition being transported is readily accessible or is directly accessible from the passenger compartment of such transporting vehicle:Provided, That in the case of a vehicle without a compartment separate from the driver's compartment the firearm or ammunition shall be contained in a locked container other than the glove compartment or console."

- OS

This.

Also referred to as "peaceable journey" laws

[Mike.357]

He was instructed in his class that it must take more than 2 steps to assemble and shoot while he "journeys."

who made this fairy tale up?

I do not believe there is any truth in that at all.

As for you buddy he should probably carry a tool box and a lock, put the pistol in that and ammo in the glove box or perhaps in another locked box.

[Guest jackdm3]

He was instructed in his class that it must take more than 2 steps to assemble and shoot while he "journeys."

who made this fairy tale up?

I do not believe there is any truth in that at all.

As for you buddy he should probably carry a tool box and a lock, put the pistol in that and ammo in the glove box or perhaps in another locked box.

That statement was from an instructor at a big local training range. I don't remember hearing that in my training.

He just left my house to go way outside the city limits for the night and left his Taurus PT845 at my place because he lives in an apartment in Midtown where he feels it could easily be stolen and he doesn't want to cross too many small towns with potential speed traps.

I'll tell him about the toolbox idea. A cheap solution. He keeps those boxes in the back frequently.

[Mike.357]

I don't remember hearing that in my training.

i know I did not hear that at my class. Of course this is not the first tidbit of false info we have heard of coming from a HCP class.

IIRC this was discussed here once before. And there is no law about steps to firing the gun in TN. It is either seperate from ammo or not.

[Guest jackdm3]

To the LEO's watching this thread, "What's a decent level/distance of separation?"

[Oh Shoot]

Didn't they just do away with the "separated" thing this session?

Now, it's just unloaded for non HCP holders, yes?

- OS

[Oh Shoot]

Didn't they just do away with the "separated" thing this session?

Now, it's just unloaded for non HCP holders, yes?

- OS

Looked it up, it's for long guns only.

"....allows person without handgun carry permit to transport rifle or shotgun in privately-owned motor vehicle provided there is no ammunition in the chamber or cylinder and no loaded clip or magazine in the weapon or in close proximity to the weapon. - Amends TCA Title 39, Chapter 17, Part 13."

So no real difference except that it "allows" it for long guns rather than making it an "exception" for prosecution. And it allows ammo to be in proximity to long gun, just that ammo can't be in clip/mag.

Never mind regarding handguns.

- OS

[DaveTN]

To the LEO's watching this thread, "What's a decent level/distance of separation?"

It’s the cop’s discretion. The whole idea is that you can’t quickly use the weapon.

Again… in real life this will depend on how and why this came to be an issue.

[Guest jackdm3]

Thank you, Dave.

[BigPoppa]

Again… in real life this will depend on how and why this came to be an issue.

very well said

[BigPoppa]

more from Chicago.........the following gun makers' products have been deemed "unsafe" and therefore, not registrable with the Chicago Police Department.

Among the notables, anything made by Hi-Point, Bryco, Jennings, and Jimenez and some Harrington and Richardson models. Also, no Daisy brand.....as in BB guns.

Chicago Police Department Roster of "Unsafe Handguns"

I. PURPOSE

The following handguns have been specifically disapproved by the Superintendent as unsafe handguns and therefore cannot be registered within the City of Chicago.

II. ROSTER OF UNSAFE HUNDGUNS AS DESIGNATED BY THE SUPERINTENDENT

a. Where a model or type is not specifically referenced, all models from the listed manufacturer are deemed unsafe.

Acme

Acme Arms

Aetna

Aetna Arms

Afflerbach, William H.

Ajax Army

Alaska

Alday & Gabilondo

Alert

Alexia

Alexis

All Right Firearms Company

Allen

Allen, W. C.

Alsop, Charles H.

America

American Arms Co.

American Boy

American Bulldog

American Derringer Corp. — all spur trigger models, derringers, and pen guns

American Eagle

American Standard Tool Co.

Americus

AMES Sword Company

Andrews Ferry & Co.

ARES/ARES Defense Systems — all flashlight gun models

Aristocrat

Avenger

Babcock

Bacon Arms

Bacon Mfg. Co.

Baford Arms — all derringers

Ballard, C. H.

Bang-Up

Beemiller, Inc.

Big Bonanza

Billings

Bismarck

Bliss, Frank D.

Bloodhound

Blue Jacket

Blue Whistler

Bodeo

Bonanza

Bond Arms — all models without trigger guards

Boss

Boy's Choice

Brooklyn Arms

Brown Mfg. Co.

Bruff, Richard P.

Brutus

Bryco Arms

Buffalo Bill

Bull Dozer

Bulldog

Bulls Eye

C.S. Shatuck Arms Co.

Captain Jack

Catello Tribuzio — LAMPO model

Centennial

Challenge

Champion

Charles E. Billings — all knife guns or guns with knife attachments

Chase, Anson

Chicago Firearms Company — Chicago Protector and Protector models

Chichester

Chieftain

Christy, William J.

Clerke Products

Clipper

Cobra Ent.

Colt — all derringers

Cone, D. D.

Connecticut Arms & Mfg. Co.

Conqueror

Continental

Continental Arms Co.

Copeland, Frank

Covert Arms — all pen guns

Cowles & Smith

Cowles & Son

Creedmore

Crescent

Crescent Firearms Co. — all spur trigger models

Crispin, Silas

Crowell, George G.

Crown Jewel

CSG — all flashlight gun models

Cummings, O. S.

Czar

D. Debouxtay

Daily Arms Co.

Daisy

Daniel Werner — all knife guns or guns with knife attachments

Davis Ind.

Dead Shot

Defender

Defiance

Delhaxhe — Knuckleduster model

Deringer Rifle & Pistol Works

Dickinson, E. L. & J.

Dictator

Dreadnaught

Driscoll, J. B.

Eagle

Earlhood

Earthquake

Eclipse

Edward Boardman and Andrew Peavey — Little All Right models

Elector

Electric

Empire

Empress

Encore

Enterprise Gun Works

Ernst Schmidt & Co.

Esprin Brothers

Ethan Allen

Eureka

Evans, James E.

Evans, W. S.

Excelsior

Express

Favorite

Firearms Import Export (F.I.E.)

Fish, Daniel

Folsom Bros. & Co.

Forehand & Wadsworth — all spur and sheathed trigger models

Forehand Arms Co. — all spur and sheathed trigger models

Frank Copeland

Frank Wesson Arms

Freedom Arms — all sheathed trigger models

Frontier

Fryberg, Andrew

G.R.A.D. — all knife guns or guns with knife attachments

Garate Brothers

Garbi, Moretti, Y, CIA, (GMC)

Garrison

Gem

Genez, August G.

German Resel — all knife guns or guns with knife attachments

Governor

Great Western Gun Works

Gross Arms Co.

Guardian

Half-Breed

Hard Pan

Harrington & Richardson (H&R) — all spur, stud, and sheathed trigger models

Harrington and Richardson — all knife guns or guns with knife attachments

Hartford Arms Co.

Hartley and Graham — Squeezer and Protector models

Haskell Mfg., Inc.

Henrion, Dassy, & Heuschen, (HDH)

Hi-Point Firearms

HJS Arms, Inc.

Hood Firearms Co.

Hopkins & Allen — all sheathed trigger models

Horseman's — all knife guns or guns with knife attachments

Hungarian — Mini Max – 9 model

Hyde & Shattuck

Iberia Firearms, Inc.

Imperial Arms

International

Irving, William

Iver Johnson — all sheathed trigger and ‘knuckle’ attachment models

J. Ductworth — Protector model

J. P. Sauer and Sons of Suhl — Bar Pistol model

J. Stevens — all sheathed trigger models

J.H. Johnson

James Reid Revolvers — Friend, My Friend, Model #2 Knuckle-Duster, New Model Knuckle-Duster, and New Model My Friend models

James Rodgers — all knife guns or guns with knife attachments

James Turbiaux — Le Protector model

Jennings, Inc.

Jewel

Jimenez Arms, Inc.

John Vittie — all pen gun models

Johnson Bye & Co.

Jose Aldazabal & Sons

Joseph Rodgers & Sons — all knife guns or guns with knife attachments

Jules Bertrand

Keno

Kittemaug

L. Dolne Invur — Apache Knuckleduster model

L.E. Polhemus Manufacturing Company — all knife guns or guns with knife attachments and all pen gun models

Le Francais — Gaulois model

Leader

Lee Arms Co.

Liberty

Lion

Little All Right Firearms Co.

Little Giant

Little John

Little Joker

Lombard, H.C. & Co.

Lorcin Engineering Co., Inc.

Louis Chobert

Louis Dolne — APACHE model

Lowell Arms Co.

Maltby-Curtis — all spur trigger models

Maltby-Henly

Manufrance — Gaulois and Mitrailleuse models

Marlin

Marquis of Lorne

Merrimack Arms

Merveilleux — Repeating Pistol model

Merwin & Bray

Minneapolis Firearms Company — Protector model

Mohegan

Monarch

Monitor

Moore’s Patent Firearms Company — all derringers

Morai

Morgan & Clapp

Mountain Eagle

Napoleon

National

National Arms Co.

Nero

New York Pistol Co.

Nonpareil

North American Arms, (NAA) Mini-Series — all spur trigger models

Norwich Arms Co.

Norwich Falls Pistol Co.

Norwich Pistol Co.

Old Hickory

Osgood Gun Works

Paragon

Parole

Patriot

Peavey — all knife guns or guns with knife attachments

Penetrator

Phoenix Arms

Pickert — all folding trigger models

Pinafore

Pioneer

Pittson Arms Co.

Pointer

Praga — all folding trigger models

Prarie King

Premier

Prescott — all sheathed trigger models

Princess

Protector

Queen

R. J. Braveman Corporation — all pen gun models

Ranger

Raven Arms

Reck

Regnum — Repeating Pistol model

Reid — all sheathed trigger models

Remington — all sheathed trigger models

Retolaza — all revolvers

Retriever

Rigby — Knuckleduster and Stricker models

Rob Roy

Robin Hood

Rocky Mountain Arms Corp — all Mini-Revolver spur trigger models

Rodier, Louis C.

Rohm/RG Industries

Rollin White — all spur trigger models

Rome Revolver & Novelty Works

Rouchouse — French Squeezer model

Royal

Royal Small Arms Factory

Rupertus

Ryan Mfg. Co.

S.P. Cottrell and Son — all flashlight gun models

Sailors — all knife guns or guns with knife attachments

Scott Arms Co.

Scout

Senator

Shatuck — UNIQUE model

Sig Sauer — Mosquito only

Smith & Wesson — all spur trigger models

Smith, Otis

Smoker

Sneider, Charles E.

Southerner

Spy

Stafford, T. J.

Stallard Arms

Standard Arms

Standard Tool Co.

Stans Gunsmithing — all pen gun models

Stinger Manufacturer Corporation — all pen gun models

Sundance Industries

Swamp Angel

Taylor, L. B.

Terrier

Terror

Terry, J. C.

Thomas J. Ryan

Tiger

Tower's Police Safety

Tramp's Terror

True Blue

Turner & Ross

Two Unwin & Rodgers — all knife guns or guns with knife attachments

Tycoon

U.M.C. Arms Co.

U.S. Arms Co.

Uhlinger, W.L.& Co.

Uhlinger, William P.

Union

Union Jack

Union Revolver

Unique

United States Small Arms Company — all knife guns or guns with knife attachments

Unwin & Rodgers of Sheffield — all knife guns or guns with knife attachments

Veiled Prophets

Veteran

Veto

Victor

Victoria

Waffen-Glaser — all pen gun models

Walther — P22 only

Webber Pistol — Squeezer model

Wesson & Harrington

Wesson Frank — Large Frame Superposed pistol

Wesson, Frank

Western Arms Co.

White Jacket

White Star

Whitney Arms Co.

Wide Awake

Wilhelm Decker

William and John Rigby — Striking Weapon Pistol model

William Irving

William W. Marston — all knife guns or guns with knife attachments

Winfield Arms Co. — all spur trigger models

XL

Xpert

You Bet

https://portal.chicagopolice.org/portal/page/portal/ClearPath/About%20CPD/Firearm%20Registration/Unsafe-Roster-final.pdf