GSMNP building clearly posted? You make the call.

[JR2ATN]

This is the Cable Mill 'Visitor Center' located at the back end of Cades Cove in the Smoky Mountains. It is a small log cabin with a large front porch and is not, as far as I could tell, clearly identified as a Visitor Center. It is essentially a gift shop.

On a busy summer day this porch is full of people taking shelter from the sun. As I approached the entrance I was indeed looking for the 'no guns' sign but didn't see it on the door or immediately around the door, so I walked right in. After 30 seconds or so of milling around I noticed that all of the employees were in ranger uniforms so I thought maybe this is a federal building and went back outside to look around some more. I finally spotted the sign in the window but was a bit irked that it was not on or closely around the door.

I thought back to my approach of the building, the porch was full of people at the time and there had been a 30-ish lady standing in front of the window. Through my short time there the porch was mostly loaded with people, I had to wait a few minutes to take this pic. With no people around it's not so hard to spot, but this porch, complete with benches in front of all the windows clearly encourages people to linger. Whaddya think? Clearly posted?

[vontar]

That is my complaint, The Law should be a set requirement. The Signs should be required to be a legal size and should be required to be on the door at the very least.

Actually why wasn't that sign posted with the No smoking sign by the door, that is one place a person might have looked?

Maybe they should even be in Braille. Havne't legally blind people passed the HCP tests?

Wouldn't this fall under 'The Americans with Disabilities Act'. Didn't they sue to get the use currency redesigned.

I am going to do a bit of reading.

As far as Braille, Drive up ATM machines have Braille on them.

If they are going to post signs, I think they need to be held to the highest letter of the law.

Edited June 26, 2010 by vontar
some additions

[Guest bkelm18]

Most likely a federal building. Doesn't need to be posted in accordance with anything.

Edited: I amend the second part of this statement, federal buildings do have to be posted as well. Just not in accordance to TCA but with federal law.

Edited June 26, 2010 by bkelm18

[vontar]

On the surface that building does not look federal.

Sure the fact it is in a national park might be a clue, I don't know if there are any buildings in the park that are ok to carry in or not.

I don't know the laws on carrying in national parks yet either.

[Guest Glock23ForMe]

Most likely a federal building. Doesn't need to be posted in accordance with anything.

So, we must "assume" these buildings are federal? I'm confused. Because you said it was, "Most Likely." Not trying to be an ass, but nowhere in the TCA does it say "Most Likely". It either is, or isn't. There's no half federal buildings. How is anyone to know that this building, in fact, is or isn't a federal building? It could be a gift shop. Are gift shops considered federal buildings?

[JR2ATN]

On the surface that building does not look federal.

Sure the fact it is in a national park might be a clue, I don't know if there are any buildings in the park that are ok to carry in or not.

I don't know the laws on carrying in national parks yet either.

Exactly! This "Visitor Center" is a log cabin in the Cable Mill area which is a historic farming community with roughly half a dozen log buildings which are preserved. It blends in with all the others as opposed to Sugarlands which is clearly a modern building with "Sugarlands Visitor Center" boldly and obviously marked at the entrance (and has the circle slash sign right on the door, btw).

[Guest bkelm18]

So, we must "assume" these buildings are federal? I'm confused. Because you said it was, "Most Likely." Not trying to be an ass, but nowhere in the TCA does it say "Most Likely". It either is, or isn't. There's no half federal buildings. How is anyone to know that this building, in fact, is or isn't a federal building? It could be a gift shop. Are gift shops considered federal buildings?

Well... first off, stow the attitude. Federal buildings have jack squat to do with the TCA. National Parks, as well as federal buildings, are federal property, thus governed by federal law. Secondly, the fact that there were several Park Rangers (federal emplyees) in the building (as stated by the OP) might lend one to think that it's a federal facility. I'll quote this from the federal law:

1) The term "Federal facility" means a building or part thereof owned or leased by the Federal Government, where Federal employees are regularly present for the purpose of performing their official duties.

So we have a building full of federal employees on federal property.... sounds like a federal building to me. And carry in a federal facility is prohibited by federal law, not TCA.

[Fallguy]

Most likely a federal building. Doesn't need to be posted in accordance with anything.

I think you may be right and wrong....

Wrong in that Federal Buildings are actually required to post that they are Federal Buildings per 18 USC Sec.930 See more starting on page 4 here

Right in that you would probably still be prosecuted.

To the OP...IMO this posting does not seem to be "conspicuous" or at the "entrance" but in the end that might be a defense you'd have to use in court not with the ranger.

[Guest bkelm18]

I think you may be right and wrong....

Wrong in that Federal Buildings are actually required to post that they are Federal Buildings per 18 USC Sec.930 See more starting on page 4 here

Right in that you would probably still be prosecuted.

To the OP...IMO this posting does not seem to be "conspicuous" or at the "entrance" but in the end that might be a defense you'd have to use in court not with the ranger.

You are correct. I happened across that as well. They do need to be posted.

[JR2ATN]

Just to be clear, there was no incident, I just hate that feeling of having been made a criminal by simply walking past a sign I didn't see. And yes, seeing the rangers was the red flag that prompted me to go outside and look around for a sign....and even then it was not obvious until some folks cleared out of the way.

[Fallguy]

Just to be clear, there was no incident, I just hate that feeling of having been made a criminal by simply walking past a sign I didn't see. And yes, seeing the rangers was the red flag that prompted me to go outside and look around for a sign....and even then it was not obvious until some folks cleared out of the way.

Well I have to admit...I didn't see the sign at all until I read further down in the thread to see it was in the window. I looked around the door and the other notices...sort of where'd you think it woud be.....

[Guest SUNTZU]

Next trip I'm going in unarmed through the window.

[Mike.357]

I would say that the building is clearly posted. It certainly was when you took the picture.

I am curious about the restroom at Cable Mill. Did you notice if it was posted? And if the actual miller building there was posted

[vontar]

Mike remember he said he had to wait to take the picture because of people standing in front of it. Seems they have the sign posted in a place where you could walk up to the door and if people are hanging out in the shade they could be blocking it pretty easy.

My big question is why is that sign off to the side, when they have other signs like no smoking very near the door? They should have at least put all the no no signs together in one place.

We should not have to have an eastern egg hunt every time we go up to a door.

[Mike.357]

My big question is why is that sign off to the side, when they have other signs like no smoking very near the door?

I am guessing because the feds issued stickers designed to be facing out on the inside of a window. They probably work for most doors but obviously not on that particular door. So someone put it in the best spot available. The other signs look older, maybe they will fix it in due time.

[Mad_Squirrell]

I am guessing because the feds issued stickers designed to be facing out on the inside of a window. They probably work for most doors but obviously not on that particular door. So someone put it in the best spot available. The other signs look older, maybe they will fix it in due time.

Not unless someone brings it to their attention!

[JR2ATN]

I would say that the building is clearly posted. It certainly was when you took the picture.

I am curious about the restroom at Cable Mill. Did you notice if it was posted? And if the actual miller building there was posted

I didn't go in any of the other buildings. I was mainly stopping to stretch my legs and to see if they had any Sourwood honey (they don't, they only have Wildflower honey right now in case you're wondering). Normally I don't stop there at all unless I need a bathroom break. I may be going back to the Smokies soon for a family get together. I'll be sure to stop by some of the historic buildings. I wouldn't think they are posted as there are normally no employees there, federal or otherwise.

Good point about the sticker needing to be applied to interior side of glass. The clearly posted doors at Sugarlands are glass. However when I approach the entrance and see "No Smoking" and "No Pets" but no other warnings I assume guns are okay. That porch was LOADED with people when I first approached and the no guns sticker was blocked. A place like Sugarlands, by its design, does not encourage lingering outside the entrance.

On a lighter note here's my pic of Ramsay Cascade

Curiously, Where I rested at the base of the falls 4 honeybees were extremely interested in me (for my sweat???). I blame them for having Sourwood honey on the brain the next day.