Fail to Fire and other related terms

[Guest motonut]

I will never profess to be a firearms expert, with that in mind I've seen many terms for a firearm that fails to discharge it's round as intended. I would like to get a better understanding of what the terms actually mean. Please feel free to both define the terms or add new ones.

FTF (Fail to Fire) - I think this is a "catch all" myself

FTF (2) - (Fail to feed ?) -

Stovepipe -

I seem to recall several others.

[MCSCOTT]

Don't forget FTE - Fail To Eject = Stovepipe

And squib....

Also from your numbering I think Fail to Feed is Type 1 and Fail to Fire is Type 2.

Edited June 14, 2010 by MCSCOTT

[Guest bkelm18]

I will never profess to be a firearms expert, with that in mind I've seen many terms for a firearm that fails to discharge it's round as intended. I would like to get a better understanding of what the terms actually mean. Please feel free to both define the terms or add new ones.

FTF (Fail to Fire) - I think this is a "catch all" myself

FTF (2) - (Fail to feed ?) -

Stovepipe -

I seem to recall several others.

Failure to Fire means there's a live round in the chamber but it does not discharge when the trigger is pulled.

Failure to Feed is obviously where the next round fails to feed into the chamber properly and the gun jams.

A Stovepipe is when the round fires properly but the spent casing gets trapped by the slide and sticks out like a stove pipe.

[Guest motonut]

Failure to Fire means there's a live round in the chamber but it does not discharge when the trigger is pulled.

Failure to Feed is obviously where the next round fails to feed into the chamber properly and the gun jams.

A Stovepipe is when the round fires properly but the spent casing gets trapped by the slide and sticks out like a stove pipe.

Ah, very good. Are there other similar terms?

[vontar]

Well, last week when Dad and I was out shooting. I had my first mis-fire in over a year. Dad was standing in a safe area behind me and I yelled, SNAP. Then I proceeded to clear the round, put the gun in safety as we checked it.

I might get laughed at on an actually range.

[Guest Lester Weevils]

As MCSCOTT mentioned, squib is potentially the most dangerous to pay attention to.

That is when the gun fires, but it feels 'funny with light recoil and/or lower than normal noise'.

Whether from a low powder charge, bad ignition, or whatever-- You ALWAYS stop shooting, unload the gun, and visually check to make sure the bullet isn't still sitting in your barrel. If there is an obstruction in there, dangerous things can happen if you shoot another bullet into the obstruction.

Similarly with a fail to fire, yer supposed to keep pointing downrange several seconds before you do anything else, just in case it is a severely delayed firing (like you sometimes get with fake-dud firecrackers).

[SonnyCrockett]

ahhh.........had my first stovepipe this weekend on my LCP at the range

[Guest jackdm3]

Only recently did I get my first "light strikes", failure to fire of sorts.

With this, the firing pin came down and hit the primer lightly, like 50% of needed impact but with the hammer forward and at rest, and sometimes it would take a second trigger pull to finish off the primer and fire.

[Guest Jamie]

Don't forget "Failure to Extract".

This is a situation where the gun fires normally, but the spent case stays in the chamber.

The chamber being blocked will then cause a Failure to Feed, if there's anything left in the mag.

J.

[K191145]

Failure to Fire means there's a live round in the chamber but it does not discharge when the trigger is pulled.

Failure to Feed is obviously where the next round fails to feed into the chamber properly and the gun jams.

A Stovepipe is when the round fires properly but the spent casing gets trapped by the slide and sticks out like a stove pipe.

The only correction I will add to that is, Glocks don't do that.

[Guest Jamie]

The only correction I will add to that is, Glocks don't do that.

Nah, they just do this instead:

J.

[K191145]

As MCSCOTT mentioned, squib is potentially the most dangerous to pay attention to.

That is when the gun fires, but it feels 'funny with light recoil and/or lower than normal noise'.

Whether from a low powder charge, bad ignition, or whatever-- You ALWAYS stop shooting, unload the gun, and visually check to make sure the bullet isn't still sitting in your barrel. If there is an obstruction in there, dangerous things can happen if you shoot another bullet into the obstruction.

Similarly with a fail to fire, yer supposed to keep pointing downrange several seconds before you do anything else, just in case it is a severely delayed firing (like you sometimes get with fake-dud firecrackers).

I had a squib with an M-60 in the Army and sure enough I did exactly what we were drilled NOT to do. I opened the feed tray and cover and pulled the bolt back immediatly. When I saw the bottom of the casing still in the chamber I thought O-$&@&, then a big POOFT and a face full of smoke. Fortunatly the casing hit the bolt and flew over my shoulder and only my squad member feeding the belt saw me do that.

[K191145]

Nah, they just do this instead:

J.

I've seen that photo, it baffles me that it seems like the barrel and slide are still intact and closed, almost is if a freakish accidental discharge of a round in the magizine. I know that's highly unlikely but nothings impossible. Anybody know what happened to it?

[K191145]

There's also, "Failure to go into battery" which I used to call a "Failure to feed". Had those often with my Kimber.

[Guest Jamie]

I've seen that photo, it baffles me that it seems like the barrel and slide are still intact and closed, almost is if a freakish accidental discharge of a round in the magizine. I know that's highly unlikely but nothings impossible. Anybody know what happened to it?

My guess is that "Unsupported Case Head Syndrome", where the back blows off the case and vents all the gas into the mag well.

The slide and barrel may have been forced back together for the pic too.

J.

[Guest Law of Thirds]

Or have been bound tightly together by the expanded and blown case. Look at the extractor, it's forced out of position by the casing methinks.

[Dolomite_supafly]

The only correction I will add to that is, Glocks don't do that.

Limp wrist it and they will.

I had heard from someone that a Glock would, they also had a video proving it. I called BS, thinking it was some sort of trickery by all the Glock haters in the world. I thought to myself there is no way MY Glock would ever let ME down like that. I immediately walked outside my house and fired both factory as well as HOT handloads out of my Glock 17. Limp wristing it while firing caused it to malfunction numerous times and not just stovepipes.

As I stood there in disbelief trying to figure out what had just happened I thought to myself "How could this be?". After all this was a GLOCK, the perfect implement of battle that was designed by God himself and handed down to the prophet Gaston Glock.

Afterwards I was a bit heartbroken, as though I had just found out that Santa Claus, The Easter Bunny and the Tooth Fairy were not real.

Dolomite

[Guest Caveman]

Nah, they just do this instead:

J.

I can wack a 1911 with a sledge hammer too, that doesn't mean it malfunctioned. Of course, with a 1911 I don't have too wack it with a sledge hammer, it will malfunction all on it's own.

Edited June 15, 2010 by Caveman

[Guest jackdm3]

Has anyone mentioned the worst operator's malfunction?: "Failure To Load The Chamber In The First Place"

Good to have a round ready to burn in the first place!

[AndyH]

I've seen my Glock 17 produce a stove pipe as well. I was having numerous other FT*'s at the same time, which I attributed at least partly to the very weak spring in the non-factory magazine I was using. I'm sure that limp-wristing after a long day at the range was a factor as well. I shot the next string with a factory mag and had no further issues.

[robbiev]

I didn't see the word "misfire" mentioned. Misfire is a failfure to fire. You pull the trigger, the hammer falls, then nothing else ever happens. Some of the others may have already been mentioned.

A hangfire is similar to a misfire, except the round eventually fires: You pull the trigger, the hammer falls, then several seconds later the round fires.

A squib is when the round fires but doesn't fire with enough force to send the bullet all of the way out of the barrel. (IE: You now have a piece of lead stuck in the barrel).

A double feed is when a fresh round is trying to enter the chamber before the fired round has ejected.

Many people interchange the words "misfire" and "malfunction" but technically, a misfire is a type of malfunction.

[Guest Jamie]

I can wack a 1911 with a sledge hammer too, that doesn't mean it malfunctioned. Of course, with a 1911 I don't have too wack it with a sledge hammer, it will malfunction all on it's own.

If you think that was hit with a sledge hammer you may be in for an ugly surprise some day.

J.

[Guest smileyguy]

If you think that was hit with a sledge hammer you may be in for an ugly surprise some day.

That's right. Although the chances of a Glock blowing up are, I think, slim. The Glock 40s and 45s (not the 9mm) have had some problems with exploding. Just enough to make me think twice before shooting hot loads in them.

That's why when I wanted a 45 I got the improved Glock. It's called the Springfield XD45.

[Guest Caveman]

If you think that was hit with a sledge hammer you may be in for an ugly surprise some day.

J.

I'm your huckleberry...

[Guest Jamie]

I'm your huckleberry...

You are buckin' for a nasty surprise.

J.