Snakes - a spinoff thread

[Guest jackdm3]

A quiz for y'all. A baby copperhead ventured into our shop and we found it not 5 feet from the receptionist's feet. I got it into the shop and put it into a tank. Tried to feed it different things but had no feeder mice. It died in 2-3 days. I stretched it out straight to "cure" and noticed that each fang wasn't a single fang, but two fangs in one at the tips, almost like their tongue is split. All I could think of was that it's like us with our baby teeth giving way to our adult teeth. Ideas?

[Oh Shoot]

...

Are there any snakes in TN that are considered endangered or threatened?..

Yes, the Western Pygmy Rattlesnake and Northern Pine Snake.

On the Federal list. "Threatened" classification I think.

Pine snakes can resemble rattlesnakes in color/pattern, and they get really big. Had one as a kid for about a year, dunno which variety it was, though.

- OS

[Guest bkelm18]

Bounty upped to $100 for coral snakes.

$5,000 for a cougar.

$25,000 for a bigfoot.

Offer not valid for bkelm, who probably has some coral snakes over at the zoo, maybe a cougar, too.

- OS

Aw come on....

[Guest Danne941]

http://www.tngunowners.com/forums/handgun-carry-self-defense/37986-had-use-my-gun-yesterday.html The thread.

Just to prove I am not a reptile killer unless provoked I will share a story. I live on a nice creek which I wade in and bass fish all the time. Snakes are not even my biggest fear the big alligator snapping turtles are! I live across the street from my folks and yesterday my brother called me over to show me a nice sized snapper hanging out in my parents yard. I had my PM9 in my front pocket and gently picked the anger guy/girl up and walked it back to the creek where he was gingerly set free back into the very waters I wade in. Not before I let it snap a 2 inch round stick like a toothpick of course!

[Guest Jamie]

A quiz for y'all. A baby copperhead ventured into our shop and we found it not 5 feet from the receptionist's feet. I got it into the shop and put it into a tank. Tried to feed it different things but had no feeder mice. It died in 2-3 days. I stretched it out straight to "cure" and noticed that each fang wasn't a single fang, but two fangs in one at the tips, almost like their tongue is split. All I could think of was that it's like us with our baby teeth giving way to our adult teeth. Ideas?

The pit vipers here in the U.S. have spare fangs that don't fold out unless the first set break off or are lost... I suppose replacements are grown for the spares once they become the primaries.

You could probably see both sets because of the changes in the soft tissue of the snake's mouth after it died. It may even be possible that there's a third pair tucked back in there somewhere.

Anyway, that's the reason that you really can't permanently de-fang a rattlesnake, copperhead, etc.

I don't know if all of the poisonous snakes with articulated fangs have this trait or not. I do know that I'm certainly not in any hurry to play snake dentist and try to find out.

J.

[Guest jackdm3]

How can you get immunity if you don't play with 'em?!

[Guest Jamie]

so as snakes aren't 'big game', it would seem (and IANAL) that no permit would be needed or required to destroy a snake in such a situation. There is also this, which allows for even endangered or threatened species to be 'dealt with' (albeit with a permit):

70-4-115. Destruction and disposal of wildlife — Permit — Penalty. —

(a) The owner of lands may destroy any wild animals, wild birds, or wild fowl when such wild animals, wild birds, or wild fowl are destroying property upon such lands. Any person, before destroying any big game under the conditions provided for in this section, is required to obtain a permit for destroying such big game. Such permit shall be issued by an officer of the wildlife resources agency.

I've never known a snake to destroy property, other than some of 'em eating your chicken's eggs, or, if it's a poisonous snake, killing your dogs or other animals. ( They won't put holes in your buildings like mice, rats, woodpeckers, etc. and they won't leave your pastures full of holes for your cattle and horses to break their legs in. )

So if you don't raise chickens and the snake isn't one of the toxic varieties, you're probably better off to just leave it alone.

J.

[Guest Jamie]

How can you get immunity if you don't play with 'em?!

I don't know, given that you can't build up an immunity to some of the more exotic ones.

Unless of course you're counting "dead" as "immune"?

J.

[Guest Jamie]

By the way, Jack... a quick search turned this up:

That's a Gaboon Viper... Does the picture of it's skull look anything like what your copperhead's fangs does?

Still wanna be a snake dentist?

J.

[Guest jackdm3]

It was only double-fanged at the tips.

[Guest Jamie]

It was only double-fanged at the tips.

So you're saying one fang actually forked?

Weird... and not very efficient for injecting venom.

J.

[Guest jackdm3]

Zakly.

[Guest Jamie]

Well ya got me on that one... I guess you just have mutant copperheads in your area.

Then again, you ARE in Memphis....

J.

[Guest jackdm3]

Everythings warped in Memphis. Even 140 TGO members.

[Guest Jamie]

Could be worse, I guess... all your snakes could look like this:

J.

[Guest jackdm3]

All the snakes on Nonconnah DO look like that. Comes from the side-effects of the Williams petroleum distillary and Dupont's evil factory.

[JAB]

Looks like snakes are going to be plentiful this year. Sunday, my wife was standing at the top of the steps, talking to me, and she just stopped mid-sentence. I looked to see what had disturbed her and saw that there was a black snake on the steps. My wife is very phobic of snakes, so that one had to go in a manner that hopefully ensured that it will not return. That one was probably just under three feet long. I think it was molting - the skin on its head looked pretty flaky.

Earlier today, when leaving for work, I noticed that one of the cats was swatting at something on one side of the driveway, at the bottom of the steps leading up to the house. We have had baby birds trying to learn to fly in the last week or so and I didn't know what she was after so I blew the horn to run her off then pulled the truck over closer to see. It was another snake. This one was a little bigger than the one that had gotten in the house. It was brown with a black stripe down its back - I think it was what I have always heard called a 'rat snake'. It certainly must have been a pretty docile snake because I never saw it strike at the cat although she was aggravating it. At any rate, I don't believe it was venomous so I just left it alone.

I have lived there for seven years and prior to this year I have seen a grand total of three snakes on the property. I have seen two in the past three days - and one was in the house. I wonder if all the rain is driving them out.

[Guest crotalus01]

Yup, he's getting all of that, same as the other one, and same as ( well, not exactly the same, but you know what I mean ) the beardies.

So yeah, we've kind'a come to the conclusion that we just have a Dwarf Uro.

I should mention that these aren't our first lizards... we've had others before them, and really kicked ourselves for missing the chance at a collared lizard. ( We were all out of tank space at the time. Space in general, for that matter. )

Here's a couple of pics of him, from '06. I'll have to take a couple of new ones later:

He still looks just like this, right now today, only very slightly larger.

Edit: I just checked our chart, and he's 150 grams and 10 inches long now... so although his weight has effectively doubled, he's only grown an inch in 4 years.

J.

Did some research and 11" to 16" and 130g to about 220g is considered a normal adult for Saharan Uros. Hope that helps.

Ahh, Gabbys...beautiful and absolutely deadly. I love 'em.

I am sure Jamie will point this out, but ALL venomous snakes shed their fangs on a regular basis, so seeing a "2 pronged fang" is common - kinda like when a kids adult tooth and baby tooth occupy the same space for a brief period.

[Guest Jamie]

I am sure Jamie will point this out, but ALL venomous snakes shed their fangs on a regular basis, so seeing a "2 pronged fang" is common - kinda like when a kids adult tooth and baby tooth occupy the same space for a brief period.

That's sort of what I was thinking at first, but it seems like what Jack is describing is a fang... just one tooth... that actually forks somewhere near the tip. Not one beside the other, or one sticking out from under the other. A fang that looks like a forked tree limb, or the letter "Y".

J.

[Guest Jamie]

Did some research and 11" to 16" and 130g to about 220g is considered a normal adult for Saharan Uros. Hope that helps.

Well, his size is questionable enough, but the fact his coloration hasn't changed is also pretty odd.

In the end I'm stuck with the conclusion that this particular lizard is just taking a helluva lot longer to mature than I'm used to seeing...

J.