Potentially no Protestants on SCOTUS

[Oh Shoot]

...

As far as I'm concerned, atheists, agnostics and the like should never

be appointed to the supreme Court. But that's just me...

Yep, so much better to have important legal decisions influenced by legend and magic.

Purely rational thought should always be discouraged.

- OS

[Guest 6.8 AR]

Why? Do you really believe that right and wrong - or one's understanding of it - has to be tied to religion?

I really hope the human race isn't so screwed-up as to require an instruction manual to tell 'em the difference between the two, or why it's in their best interest to do the right thing instead of the wrong one...

But then again, from what I've seen, even having one - or several, for that matter - doesn't seem to have helped much.

J.

I'm not saying it has to be tied to religion, but I do think this society

becoming more Godless every day is causing more problems. The "anything

goes" crowd in our country appears to be successful in destroying society.

I hardly ever go to church, myself, and the excuse is my job. Whatever

God you believe in is between you and God. Or, if you choose to get into

the argument that God doesn't exist, that may be fine for you, but our

country was founded with "certain inalienable rights", coming from God,

and I happen to agree with that.

The Ten Commandments are an anchor for our civilization to hold on to.

When it is taken out of our schools and parents don't teach it, I think we

become the problem.

Shouldn't you always strive for something better in life? How can you do

that if you don't have an anchor, or baseline, to measure behaviour in

society. If laws came solely from man, without believing in some higher

being or order, how did they come about?

I think the human race is so screwed up, and realized it, and came up

with the Bible, or versions of it. It's obvious I'm not a scholar, but the

Bible and my parents are where I got my morals from. They really hit

home when I agreed to teach the Ten Commandments in sunday school,

years ago. I think I learned more than the kids in the room.

I'm not condemning anyone for their thoughts about this, just relaying mine.

[jonlisha]

Yep, so much better to have important legal decisions influenced by legend and magic.

Purely rational thought should always be discouraged.

- OS

Wow didn't expect something like that, at least your honest about your opinions though.

I have learned in my short life that when dealing with religion its good to talk to your own kind about it or best to not talk about it at all, it just always leads to a fight and i try to avoid conflict as much as possible.

I'm seeing a lot of support for religious freedom around here and to be honest i didn't really expect that in a southern state, don't get me wrong i do love my state and its people but in my personal experience a lot of people are not very understanding of the non religious.

Either way, if were going to debate about religion we should keep it civil and leave out insults or not talk about it at all, we might all learn something from each other.

[Guest 6.8 AR]

Yep, so much better to have important legal decisions influenced by legend and magic.

Purely rational thought should always be discouraged.

- OS

Sarcasm and rational thought. That's interesting:D

Kind of like objectivity and subjectivity.

Purely rational thought is lacking in a belief system? If you believe in something and another person doesn't, should sarcasm rule the day?

If you believe the bible is legend and magic, good for you. I don't.

[Oh Shoot]

...

If you believe the bible is legend and magic, good for you. I don't.

Okay, let's legislate via the Old Testament:

Illegal activities (punishment/fine to be determined by legislature):

• Consuming blood, blood in meat is not exempt. (Genesis 9:4)
  
• Performing any work on the sabbath.(Exodus 20:10)
  
• Cooking a goat in its mothers milk.(Exodus 23:19)
  
• Eating fat.(Leviticus 3:17)
  
• The consumption of pork.(Leviticus 11:7-8)
  
• Eating a fellowship offering more than three days old.(Leviticus 19:5-8)
  
• Bestiality.(Leviticus 19:19)
  
• Planting more than one kind of seed in a field.(Leviticus 19:19)
  
• Wearing clothing woven of more than one kind of cloth.(Leviticus 19:19)
  
• Cutting the hair on the sides of your head or clipping of the edges of your beard.(Leviticus 19:27)
  
• Tattoos.(Leviticus 19:28)
  
• Consulting a psychic or spiritualist.(Leviticus 19:31)
  
• Being a psychic or spiritualist, punishable by death.(Leviticus 20:27)
  
• Touching the dead carcass of a pig.(Deuteronomy 14:8)
  
• Eating aquatic creatures lacking fins or scales.(Deuteronomy 14:9-10)
  
• Transvestism.(Deuteronomy 22:5)
  
• Consuming the meat of strangled animals.(Acts 15:28-29)
  
• For women, speaking in church.(1 Corinthians 14:34-35)
  

Offenses that incur exile/imprisonment:

A male who is not circumcised. Genesis 17:14

• Eating leavened bread during the Feast of Unleavened Bread. Exodus 12:15
  

• Manufacturing anointing oil. Exodus 30:33
  

• Engaging in ritual animal sacrifices other than at the temple. Leviticus 17:1-9
  

• Sexual activity with a woman who is menstruating: Leviticus 20:18
  

• Consuming blood: This would presumably include eating rare meat and black pudding. Also see above. Leviticus 17:10.
  

• Eating peace offerings while ritually unclean: Leviticus 7:20
  

• Waiting too long before consuming sacrifices: Leviticus 19:5-8
  

• Going to the temple in an unclean state: Numbers 19:13
  

Offenses that incur the death penalty (just a few of the MANY):

• Worshiping idols (Ex 22:20, Lev 20:1-5, Deut 17:2-7).
  

• Blasphemy (Lev 24:14-16,23).
  

• Breaking the Sabbath (Ex 31:14, Numb 15:32-36).
  

• Practicing magic (Ex 22:18).
  

• Being a medium or spiritualist. (stoning) (Lev 20:27).
  

• Trying to convert people to another religion. (stoning) (Deut 13:1-11, 18:20).
  

• Non-priests going near the tabernacle when it is being moved. (Numb 1:51)
  

• Being a false prophet. (Deut 132:5, Deut 18:20, Zech 13:2-3)
  

• Cursing your parents (Ex 21:17, Lev 20:9).
  

• Being a stubborn and rebellious son. And being a profligate and a drunkard. (Deut 21:18-21)
  

• Adultery (Lev 20:10-12, (man and woman).
  

• Premarital sex. Applies to virgin girls who are still in their fathers' homes. (Deut 22:20-21).
  

(many more)

All sounds pretty enlightened to me.

I was wrong, let's roll with these Judeo guidelines.

- OS

[E4 No More]

Wow! Someone's lack of understanding of the bible is just astounding!

But who said the law of the Old Testament is what should be used?

[Oh Shoot]

Wow! Someone's lack of understanding of the bible is just astounding!

But who said the law of the Old Testament is what should be used?

Protestants believe the entire Bible is the inspired Word of God.

You dare suggest that some parts of the Bible are umm, no longer relevant?

Blasphemy, sir, I say, blasphemy!

(cause for execution, by the way).

- OS

[Mike.357]

. Point being it's all tied together.

ABSOLUTELY. You are either in the club or not in the club. If you are not in the club you will never recieve consideration. The ruling class are elitists and they want to keep it that way. No way Joe Lawyer who recieved his degree from MSU or UC is ever going to be on the Supreme Court.

BTW where did the Big O and King Geo.ll go to school?

[Smith]

Protestants believe the entire Bible is the inspired Word of God.

You dare suggest that some parts of the Bible are umm, no longer relevant?

Blasphemy, sir, I say, blasphemy!

(cause for execution, by the way).

- OS

OS - not knocking you but you really have no idea about Biblical history, Levitical law, theology, or NT and OT teachings. You are becoming what you have despised. ONe who takes out of context scripture for his own purpose. Isn't that what you despise about religion? Just sayin. BTW - that is neither rational nor logical.

[Mike.357]

And if the bible is such a big thing why was it edited and what was done with the parts left out of the current version?

Answer: Agendas

And way OT. if there is a God, why do innocent children suffer through unthinkable maladies? Does God not love them?

i wish I had faith, I really really do. but it is not there.

[Smith]

ABSOLUTELY. You are either in the club or not in the club. If you are not in the club you will never recieve consideration. The ruling class are elitists and they want to keep it that way. No way Joe Lawyer who recieved his degree from MSU or UC is ever going to be on the Supreme Court.

BTW where did the Big O and King Geo.ll go to school?

I agree with you .... unless you start going Skull and Bones tin foil on me!

[E4 No More]

Protestants believe the entire Bible is the inspired Word of God.

You dare suggest that some parts of the Bible are umm, no longer relevant?

Blasphemy, sir, I say, blasphemy!

(cause for execution, by the way).

- OS

You're just embarrassing yourself now, but it's your life.

BTW: Protestants are groups that split from the Catholic Church in protest to their dogma and other things. There is not just Catholics and Protestants. There are many groups that have had nothing to do with the Catholic Church ever. The biggest "group" would be Baptist.

[E4 No More]

ABSOLUTELY. You are either in the club or not in the club. If you are not in the club you will never recieve consideration. The ruling class are elitists and they want to keep it that way. No way Joe Lawyer who recieved his degree from MSU or UC is ever going to be on the Supreme Court.

BTW where did the Big O and King Geo.ll go to school?

Well, back to the OP.

I agree with you here 100%.

[Guest Jamie]

I'm not saying it has to be tied to religion, but I do think this society

becoming more Godless every day is causing more problems.

Uh, yeah, you are.

You're saying right there that being without a god, or a belief in one, is causing problems, rather than the problem being simple unrestrained human nature.

J.

[Mike.357]

but I do think this society

becoming more Godless every day is causing more problems.

I would rather believe that removing corporal punishent from schools is the problem.

[Guest Jamie]

I would rather believe that removing corporal punishent from schools is the problem.

Yes, ass-wuppin's need to make a come-back... both for kids in school, and for adults everywhere who desperately need it.

I also believe that tarring and feathering public officials who don't do properly is a perfectly valid form of protest as well...

J.

[Guest 6.8 AR]

Uh, yeah, you are.

You're saying right there that being without a god, or a belief in one, is causing problems, rather than the problem being simple unrestrained human nature.

J.

Uh, no, I'm not. If you wish to call believing in God a religion itself, then maybe I am. I call religion a Baptist, Catholic, Jewish, Muslim,etc. You can believe in God without being in a particular organized religion. I didn't say I was trying to impose God on anyone.

Are you saying that simple unrestrained human behaviour explains a good

reason for the lawlessness and moral decline?

Roman emperor Constantine allowed christianity to flourish hoping it would be a way to control what was left of his part of the empire. I read where he converted to christianity before he died. Maybe OS or someone else will refute this, and I have been wrong before, so have at it.

Look, anyone wishing to trash God or christianity already knows they can do so for whatever reason they wish, but my views are mine. Some of you wish to blame christianity on all the wars and troubles. Believe what you

wish, and that includes whether or not you believe in God. Some would say

religion helped us humans so far, and some say it has hurt us. That's up

to the individual, but I'll keep my subscription to God and let others remain

in the church of Carl Sagan. Go in peace, brother.

As far as oaths go, most would say it is to God.

[Guest SUNTZU]

Ramen.

[Guest 6.8 AR]

Yes, ass-wuppin's need to make a come-back... both for kids in school, and for adults everywhere who desperately need it.

I also believe that tarring and feathering public officials who don't do properly is a perfectly valid form of protest as well...

J.

Now that's something we definitely agree on.

[Oh Shoot]

OS - not knocking you but you really have no idea about Biblical history, Levitical law, theology, or NT and OT teachings. You are becoming what you have despised. ONe who takes out of context scripture for his own purpose. Isn't that what you despise about religion? Just sayin. BTW - that is neither rational nor logical.

Actually, you have no idea of my knowledge of the Bible, its origins and influences, and the history of how it came to be accepted in it's present form(s). It's actually more extensive than you surmise, and while it would fail in detail compared to any particular seminary instruction, it succeeds in being far less biased.

While it should be obvious that I love to play devil's advocate, I did indeed cite actual references found in the Old Testament, which is in use by all Christian sects and quite consistent even among the various translations. The point was to show that U.S. law is quite removed from being based on the oft touted "Judeo-Christian" tradition, which is where this thread became focused.

Rather, it is based on freedom. That "Life, Liberty, and Pursuit of Happiness" thing, fettered only by proscriptions on behavior that deny the same to others.

- OS

[Guest Jamie]

Uh, no, I'm not. If you wish to call believing in God a religion itself, then maybe I am. I call religion a Baptist, Catholic, Jewish, Muslim,etc. You can believe in God without being in a particular organized religion. I didn't say I was trying to impose God on anyone.

re·li·gion

   /rɪˈlɪdʒən/ Show Spelled[ri-lij-uhn] Show IPA

–noun

1.

a set of beliefs concerning the cause, nature, and purpose of the universe, esp. when considered as the creation of a superhuman agency or agencies, usually involving devotional and ritual observances, and often containing a moral code governing the conduct of human affairs.

2.

a specific fundamental set of beliefs and practices generally agreed upon by a number of persons or sects: the Christian religion; the Buddhist religion.

3.

the body of persons adhering to a particular set of beliefs and practices: a world council of religions.

4.

the life or state of a monk, nun, etc.: to enter religion.

5.

the practice of religious beliefs; ritual observance of faith.

6.

something one believes in and follows devotedly; a point or matter of ethics or conscience: to make a religion of fighting prejudice.

When I speak of religion, I'm using no. 1 up there. You, I think, seem to be referring to no.2

I don't think it requires either one to be a "good" or "moral" person.

Are you saying that simple unrestrained human behaviour explains a good

reason for the lawlessness and moral decline?

Said it was the reason. Didn't say it was a good reason.

And I'll stop at that, unless you want to tear out on a psychological sort of tangent. 'Cause that's where an explanation of that one will lead.

Roman emperor Constantine allowed christianity to flourish hoping it would be a way to control what was left of his part of the empire. I read where he converted to christianity before he died. Maybe OS or someone else will refute this, and I have been wrong before, so have at it.

Further demonstrating that religion... specifically organized religion... was most likely created as a tool or means for a person or persons to control a larger group of people. And it doesn't matter if we're speaking of Constantine, the pope, some village's medicine man, etc.

The primary goal is to impose one's will on others, while passing it off as the will or authority of some "higher power".

And if it wasn't outright created as such, it's certainly been bent to that use and task. And quite probably very early on.

Look, anyone wishing to trash God or christianity already knows they can do so for whatever reason they wish, but my views are mine.

I'm not trashing anything, only calling things as I see them.

Some of you wish to blame christianity on all the wars and troubles.

Seems to me that the Muslims currently have the market cornered on causing wars and stirring up trouble.

Though I suppose it rightfully is their turn...

Believe what you

wish...

I will... And right now, I believe it's time for a drink.

...and that includes whether or not you believe in God. Some would say

religion helped us humans so far, and some say it has hurt us. That's up

to the individual, but I'll keep my subscription to God and let others remain

in the church of Carl Sagan. Go in peace, brother.

I also believe that I'll avoid any and all churches like the plague, thankyouverymuch.

After all, that's where you'll find the greatest concentration of fanatics and hypocrites... both of which are nothing but trouble.

As far as oaths go, most would say it is to God.

I don't know about "most", but I do know that many oaths now days leave the option of saying either "I do swear" or "affirm", and are without the requirement of saying "so help me god".

J.

[Guest 6.8 AR]

And It is good that you call it as you see it. So we see things differently. I'm not trying to recruit anyone into a church. Never tried to, either. The "so help me, God" part of the oath is an option. But everything is an option nowadays. Anything goes. I've never seen a fanatic, but maybe a few hypocrites, although I wouldn't know for

a fact.

I think I'll have a drink, also.

[Oh Shoot]

...

Roman emperor Constantine allowed christianity to flourish hoping it would be a way to control what was left of his part of the empire. I read where he converted to christianity before he died. Maybe OS or someone else will refute this, and I have been wrong before, so have at it...

Well, he "became" a Christian, but never gave up pagan homages either. The consummate politician, the more gods the better.

It was during his reign that dates of Christmas and Easter became set, which mainly incorporated Christianity into the existing pagan festival dates of the winter solstice and spring equinox.

This allowed everyone, regardless of faith, to take the same days off from work.

- OS

[Guest mosinon]

I would rather believe that removing corporal punishent from schools is the problem.

You sure about that? I mean are you sure that there is really a problem? I got swatted a few times (well every day almost) when I was in school and I'm not a criminal so the easy thing is to think that because I got swatted all the time I'm not a criminal.

On the other hand violent crime is down, way down from where it was when school folks regularly hit kids.

So if it is outcome based, if what you are after is less violent crime, smacking the kids wasn't working. Not smacking the kids seems to be better.

For all the complaints that it was "better back in my day" I can't find any evidence that it was.

[mikegideon]

Yes, ass-wuppin's need to make a come-back... both for kids in school, and for adults everywhere who desperately need it.

J.

:clap: