Need advise - I Bought a stolen Gun

[Guest BigBob]

Following are the chain of events that occurred when I attempted to pick up the two pistols I had paid for. I went to my FFL Dealer, an employee called the Tennessee Bureau of Investigation to process the transfer of the pistol to be told that the HK P7 M8 Serial XXXX was stolen. The employee reconfirmed that he read the # correctly and it was confirmed. As you know,A stolen pistol automatically sets into the following action: Tennessee Bureau of Investigation informs the FFL dealer they must hold the pistol for the Sheriff's Office to pickup. immediately;.Patrolmen XXX and XXX arrived, The Patrolman called to reconfirm that the pistol was stolen and received such. He then filled out the paper work that can be referenced as XXXX

I ask Patrolman XXXX what he would do if he were in my shoes. His recommendations were: Write a letter describing what happened and demand return of payment, Give a week to have the demand met. If payment was not made I could then file a complaint with the Sullivan Co. Sheriff's Office which in turn have you extradited to Tennessee due to the amount of the pistol being above $1000.00

I sent the final e-mail :

I have sent you U.S. Postal Money orders XXXXXXX,XXXXXXXX & XXX for a total of $2275 for the purchase of two pistols of the same manufacture & model. I received one while the other was confiscated by Sullivan Co. Sheriff's Office due to it being stolen. After sending you the below e-mail you have continued to call me saying the serial # is not showing up as stolen per your neighbor/sheriff along with some other people you have contacted are telling you the serial # is not showing stolen. Upon hearing that, I call the Officer XXXX that picked up the gun and questioned him, is it possible a mistake was made? His was reply was a definite no. No mistake, that he had spelled out Heckler & Koch and gave the number twice. He said in addition his office had contacted Sheriff's Office in Louisville,KY and they confirmed that was the gun that had been reported stolen.

I was totally surprised today when you told me that you would not return my money until it was proven to you that the gun was stolen. You had previously said repeatedly that "my refund is assured". So until today,I was believing that everything would be OK.

I am really surprised you would expect me to wait for a refund until "You have proof the gun is stolen". You know the gun is in the Sullivan Co. Sheriff's Office.

You know that I do not have the gun from the paper work reference # I gave to you and calls you have made. Your issue is with the TN. Sullivan Co. Sheriff's Office. Not Me.

I apologize for the length, but I know detail matters.

This is my first. So if I am missing something Pls. advise. Guess I will start tomorrow.

[Smith]

Wouldn't the fact that the gun was confiscated and verified by the Sheriffs department proof that the gun was stolen? What else are they expecting you to prove? Who are you dealing with? Gun store or individual?

[Guest BigBob]

Wouldn't the fact that the gun was confiscated and verified by the Sheriffs department proof that the gun was stolen? What else are they expecting you to prove? Who are you dealing with? Gun store or individual?

It is an individual. Just don't understand

[TripleDigitRide]

Gun Owners Club, Gun Broker, etc?

[Ropin4gold]

Call the Sheriff's office that has the gun, and get a case number and copy of their report. Ask whoever you have been dealing with over there if they have a copy of the report from where the gun was stolen from (or even the case number). If not call the agency that orig reported the gun stolen (hopefully with at least a case number), and get a copy of the report from where the gun was stolen from and send it to the seller. If this does not work, go see the magistrate in your county and seek a warrant.

[Metalhead]

Hypothetically - since I don't know any better yet - if the gun was purchased off a online auction site like Gunbroker and he doesnt give you a refund with all the proof in the world I would immediately send an email to GB. Tell them that the user sold you stolen property and refused a refund, and they will take care of his account, at least.

Personally I use a credit card when buying off sites like that, just in case it turns up hot I can report it to the card company and hopefully get a refund.

[Guest milkman]

If you got it from Gun Broker or some other website you may want to try them and see if they can apply any pressure. I agree you should get case numbers and incident reports. Another thing that might be good is to see if the Sheriff's Investigator will do an affidavit for the seller saying that H&K Pistol SN XXXXXXX was reported stolen on XX/XX/XXXX in Louisville Kentucky under case #XXXXXXX it is currently case #XXXXXXX with the SCSD. Of course if the Seller is selling stolen guns he sounds shady. You may not be able to get the money back. Do you have his real name and address? You may want to contact an attorney about suing him to get your money back.

[Guest BigBob]

If you got it from Gun Broker or some other website you may want to try them and see if they can apply any pressure. I agree you should get case numbers and incident reports. Another thing that might be good is to see if the Sheriff's Investigator will do an affidavit for the seller saying that H&K Pistol SN XXXXXXX was reported stolen on XX/XX/XXXX in Louisville Kentucky under case #XXXXXXX it is currently case #XXXXXXX with the SCSD. Of course if the Seller is selling stolen guns he sounds shady. You may not be able to get the money back. Do you have his real name and address? You may want to contact an attorney about suing him to get your money back.

This was HKPRO. Good idea to contact them. Yes I have all the background info. on him. I am headed to the Sheriff's Office to get case numbers and incident reports. Some good Ideas. Thanks all.

[Guest pwhphd]

Have you notified the authorities with jurisdiction in the sellers location that you were sold stolen property? It would make sense [since it is still against the law to traffic a stolen firearm] that he should satisfy your loss and seek redress from his source of ownership to avoid additional or continual involvement in an unlawful enterprise.

[Guest TnRebel]

FYI in the future use these sites.

Stolen Gun Database And Stolen Guns Search

http://www.hotgunz.com/index.php

[Guest JHatmaker]

Really hate to hear this, and I wish you luck in getting this resolved as soon as possible. Please keep us updated on the progress of getting your money back.

[packingvol]

This wouldn't happen to have been a pair of Chantilly's that were recently sold there? I own several P7M8s and frequent HKPro. Be nice to know who to avoid over there...

[Guest GT_Rat]

I ask Patrolman XXXX what he would do if he were in my shoes. His recommendations were: Write a letter describing what happened and demand return of payment, Give a week to have the demand met. If payment was not made I could then file a complaint with the Sullivan Co. Sheriff's Office which in turn have you extradited to Tennessee due to the amount of the pistol being above $1000.00

Do the above and tell him that he'll have ample proof that the gun was stolen when his local sheriffs department comes to pick him up to be extradited to TN for a felony count of Grand Theft. Also, the BATFE may have a few bones to pick with him for transferring a stolen firearm across state lines making it a federal felony.

[Oh Shoot]

FYI in the future use these sites.

Stolen Gun Database And Stolen Guns Search

HotGunz Stolen Firearms Database

That has about zero probability of being helpful, I'm afraid.

Not linked to any LEA database, has a whopping 1,617 listed.

At least 300,000 are reported stolen each year in US, and this was as of 1994, most recent I could find.

(Source: US Dept. of Justice, Bureau of Justice Statistics, Guns and Crime, 4/94)

Lots more now, I'm sure.

- OS

Edited April 27, 2010 by OhShoot

[Guest BigBob]

I put the serial # in one of the databases and came back with nothing.Did not try the one you have to register.

packingvol: That was is correct. working with the admin. of the site as we speak. Maybe offset someone else a problem.

I did a google search and he is on several sites benelliusa.com,thehighroad,fivesevenforum,parkcitiestactical, and some others I can't think of right now.

[peejman]

A friend also bought a stolen gun off gunbroker a few years ago. He reported it to them with police reports, etc. and while the process was a hassle and it took a few weeks to get his money back, it was resolved. My only advice is to be patient.

[DaveTN]

If you want your money back I would suggest that you not start making threats of things that won’t happen. Telling him that Deputies from Tennessee are going to come to Kentucky and extradite him back here is probably not going to happen.

I would give him the information he requires to show that the gun was stolen. Certainly he is going to resist. If he didn’t steal the gun his first thoughts will be that you are trying to scam him. One of you is going to be out over a grand; I’m sure he would rather it be you.

Is he close to where the gun was reported stolen? I’m sure the cops there want to talk to him. That would be the proof he needs. Call them.

Good luck. You didn’t do anything wrong; but we all run these risks when dealing with private owners. I hope everything works out for you.

[ShamGlock]

What a crap sandwich. Sorry to hear. Tagged for outcome.

[Guest johnsonc22]

Have you called any lawyers? I have prepaid legal...now i am not saying that you should buy a product for legal insurance, but i have found out that sometimes in the law you need a bigger fish to get the ball rolling. Sorry to hear about the problem.

[Guest Lynchburgsam]

Same thing just happened to me today from GB. I'm working to get a refund now. You would like to think the sellers didn't know it was stolen when they sold it, but I think they owe a refund regardless. My first response from the seller was "I have a receipt from the pawn shop I bought it from." That does me no good. Hope this doesn't turn ugly.

[Guest aaronc]

Hello,

just wanted to stop in and thank TnRebel for posting us. BigBob, good luck with your refund.

Best Regards,

Aaron Crowder

Founder StolenWeapon.com